With his erratic play and non-existent defense, Wagner has played his way out of the regular minutes rotation. Is he on the outer with Silas, or just in a little slum? Or should Silas be utilising his offensive abilities more??? Wags is averaging 18.6 mpg 8.0 ppg 1.5 rpg 0.9 apg (he's no pg) 37.5 fg% 35.4 3pt% (not bad) 71.0 ft%
Last week I have not seen the Cavs isolate for him as much as they used to. Teams know we can't shoot it either, so the lane is really clogged up, so he has nowhere to go.
I think Wagner is in the same boat as Caron Butler...both looked promising coming into this season but injuries have hindered their play and neither has been able to recover.... If I were Silas and the Cavs, I would continue to give Wagner 15-20 minutes off the bench until he puts together a string of good games...I would also hope that the Cavs give Wagner another year to prove himself before they give up on him...there's no question he's a talent, and that alone should be enough incentive to be patient with him....
Everything goes back to shooting.... If we can't spread the floor for him, we are in big trouble, esp. because of Wagner's lack of size.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting King James:</div><div class="quote_post">Everything goes back to shooting.... If we can't spread the floor for him, we are in big trouble, esp. because of Wagner's lack of size.</div> You guys have one of the best shooters I've ever seen in Kapono...you guys just never play him
Lack of defense and still gets very scared out there...I feel for the kid, we sure could use that shooting.
they should get rid of him. in college he needed the ball all the time. he's not a cancer for the team, but he just doesn't fit well off the bench. he honestly reminds me of a poor mans allen iverson. which is a compliment and diss all in one. congratulations me. i don't know where he would fit in.. i want to see what he can do when he plays 38 mins a game and is an option of some sort. i just can't picture him with another nba team right now.. perhaps the hawks next season? haha. no idea. but the cavs aren't for him, especially because of lebron being there, and the players around.
Zone takes Wagner out of the game too, because he can take anybody one on one. I just get angry when teams don't have to defens us for the deep ball and Wagner has to try and drive past 2 people just to hit a tough tear dropper over a center. Not going to work very much.
Wagner's future?? I had to chuckle a couple of weeks ago, when one of the game announcers said; "Wagner never shot unless he had the ball in his hands." Wagner is not rebuildable into a PG. Points either have it or they don't. DeJuan is an SG, he has no other game. He's foul prone, doesn't rebound, and assists are primarily non-existant. But the real difficulty is...... he can't shoot!! Fans have a tendency to remember those couple games in the past where he played a few mins and scored around 30pts. But in the main, this is the story. He's right on 37% from the floor since his return. That puts him on a par with the 36% he shot in the 46 games he played last year. The Cavs won 17 last year. 8 games with him and 9 games without him. In the 8 games they won with him, in 4 of those games he scored 10 pts or less..... Not much impact there!!... If he's going to be on the floor, he's going to be shooting. If he's shooting , he's going to be taking shots away from better shooters!!....... So far he's a one dimentional player, and nothing special at that............Tank
Tankster has it just about right. I watched him carefully at the Garden yesterday (during his few minutes on the floor). As soon as he got the ball he flung up an errant three-pointer, and the rest of the time he just ran around on offense and defense like a chicken with its head cut off. I wouldn't give up his minutes to Kapuno though. The Cavs need to find out if he's a player or not, and given his youth, lack of experience, and injuries the verdict on that is not in yet. I'm doubtful, but he needs a chance to play more minutes than Silas is currently giving him. I'd like to see the Cavs make the playoffs, like everybody else, most of all Silas, but I do worry that deep-sixing Brown and minimizing Wagner and Diop's minutes will keep the Cavs' management (maybe that's an oxymoron) from finding out who beyond James and Boozer are players to build a strong foundation for the future.
I can only hope that Wag's can be a little like Bobby Jackson. He took a few years to find his role in the NBA. I know Bobby can play some point unlike Wags, but I just hope Wagner can become a good ball handler. If he does this, he can bring the ball up the floor, and utilise James as a point forward. Wags then becomes the shooting guard! Wag's 3 point shot has become better, its just his shot selection in between that is the concern. I hope we are patient with him, but its hard to remain patient with everyone!
Silias wanted Wagner to explore the pg option so he can get minutes. But Wagner denied. That might have something to do with his spot in the rotation.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr_Infante:</div><div class="quote_post">Silias wanted Wagner to explore the pg option so he can get minutes. But Wagner denied. That might have something to do with his spot in the rotation.</div> You'd think a guy who'd missed so much basketball would jump at any oppotunity. All he is doing is limiting his career!
Karma, I think Wagner can handle the ball ok, that's not the issue to me. It's that he hasn't got the slightest idea about making plays for anyone else, except when he takes off into the lane, gets blocked by a post defender and drops a pass to the defender's man. I think we've talked about this before, but to me, Bobby Jackson is not the right hope since he defintely could play point for an extenced period if he had to. To me, Vinnie Johnson is the Wagner prototype, but so far he's only shown that potential in bursts when his shot is falling. But I wish you could have been my guest at the Garden yesterday, because Z was working his butt off on defense and had a very sweet jumper working. I like Z too. He gives the Cavs three solid players. I hope all this talk about him getting traded next year is just talk, but I fear it's more basic than that because I don't think Silas likes him. I posted on ESPN this morning, noting that the only man on the Cavs bench who failed to greet Z when he came out of the game yesterday was Silas the grouch.
If they put Wagner at point, he would just bring the ball to the timeline. Then LeBron will play point at the half court. Silias had this idea months ago. Wagner's denile forced them to make a trade for McInnis. Now Wag is just sitting the bench and taking the shots only when LeBron is out. Well Wagner, you wanted to be a shooting guard, there you have it. Too bad for him LeBron is the star.
aaronr, you're right about Z. Silas talked about needing another big-time player and Z sure has looked like one recently. Other teams have been watching too and with his expiring contract his trade value this offseason will be through the roof. The one thing we still need is outside shooting to stop defenses from packing it in, and that's why I'm not ready to give up on Wags. He's obviously worked on his shot because he's become a consistent three point threat. He's terrible defensively but that will improve over time. Tank, his shooting percentage doesn't really reflect what he brings to the offense off the bench. As an example, against the Spurs I think he shot 2 of 8, but it was all from attacking not jump shooting. Several times he broke down the spurs defense and our big men had easy tip ins after he drew over the shot blockers. It's 25% shooting but it's better than someone who bricks up 15 footers (err, Newble). Wags has the talent to be a big time scorer in this league. I don't know if it will ever happen but it's too early to give up on him.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting CBBI:</div><div class="quote_post">Wagner is not a PG period. We went through this last season with Lucas and it sunk like the Titanic.</div> It would just be nice if, when Ollie and McInnis are both off the floor, Wags could bring the ball up the floor and hand off for James for the half court sets! Doesn't seem too complicated, and gives us a different look!
Wagner's future!! Wagner was a mistake at #6 in the draft and the cavs have been trying to salvage something out of it ever since. He might just be part athlete, albeit a fragile one healthwise, but his skills appear to be limited. And he's not becoming a class favorite of Silas', by refusing to help the team in another role. There's a just a chance that he'll never fill the role that the Cavs drafted him for. Maybe in a different environment he might flourish, but he's not what they need.....not now, not in the future!..... It wouldn't suprise me if at some point they packaged him and moved him. The worse case scenario would be his fragile knees giving out, and he'd earn the 6 million we owe him sitting on the bench after a few more operations. Sorry....but thats how Isee it!!.............Tank
Silias' sole idea for the future is LeBron and Dajuan in the backcourt. Doesn't seem that way anymore.
