<div class="quote_poster">Quoting PG2:</div><div class="quote_post">IMO here are the NBA's up and coming stars: Ndudi Ebi Rafer Alston Flip Murray Lonny Baxter Kwame Brown Juan Dixon Dajuan Wagner Caron Butler Dwyane Wade Udonis Haslem Sebastian telfair(when he is in the league) Luke Ridnour</div> lol you basically named half of miami's roster....though skip to my lou is a baller, ill give him the respect he deserves....
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MainManMelo15:</div><div class="quote_post">i think melo is the best rookie period... best all around player... hes awesome! but amare has impressed me alot... yeah wade is injury prone</div> Are you joking? did you just say Melo has the best all around game? Does LeBron James not exist?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post">His ability to guard those positions is just an example of his versatility. I agree it would be bad basketball to leave him out there to chase guards all night long. That is obviously not playing into his strengths but he COULD do it, and do it better than any 7 footer I know. Maybe it's because I watch the Lakers more than you do but Shaq's reluctance/inability to come out and cover guards on the pick and roll really makes me appreciate Garnett's skill. Garnett is 20-10-5 guy. I don't see alot of first and second year guys who have the potential to put up those numbers. I can see Amare being a 20-10 guy and Lebron being a 20-7-7 guy.</div> I think I watch the Lakers too much for not being a fan of them, example when they played the Kings why did they lose, Shaq doesn't like to be pulled out of the paint and play on the perimeter. Divac is always on the perimeter, and when they did the high pick and rolls with Bibby and Divac and Payton for some reason tried to go behind the screens, Shaq would never step up and Bibby would stroke the jumper. (Yao is like this a little too, many centers are actually not all tough) Many many centers do that, its also a good way of driving because you can draw the center out and remove the teams shot blocking presence. Also if the center isn't comfortable coming out then the man can get an open shot. Bosh actually does go out and challenge and many times swtiches on to the guard and can failry keep up with them and stop the ball, he can put up the points, rebounds and blocks like Garnett, but his passing I don't think can become like that.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting King James:</div><div class="quote_post"> Odom has been an injured pot smoking head case. Sure he has had a nice season, but he has to play like this longer before he earns respect from me and many others. Clippers wanted to send Odom to the Cavs, but we rejected and asked for Miles.</div> that worked out great for you guys, didn't it? i think skills and talent wise, Odom does have the potential to put up KG-like numbers. he just needs to be more focused, more disciplined - he's showing a lot now that he's leading a team.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post">The topic of this thread states "Who will be the NEXT KG....". not who "not who has the best chance" </div> Well, if you're going to take the topic's title literally rather than what was obviously meant, then you can assume that the topic starter thinks the members of JBB are basketball psychics...no one knows "who <u>will </u> be the NExt KG," but we can only <u>speculate </u> who has a chance to become KG -esque...that's the presumed idea of this topic.... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Yes, you are right there are other things that Garnett can do well besides defend such score, rebound, assist, run the floor of which the definition of versatility has already encompassed</div> And which of these traits of "versatility" does Bosh not do well for a 19 year old?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting PG2:</div><div class="quote_post">IMO here are the NBA's up and coming stars: Rafer Alston </div> I hope you are joking. If you are, then you got a good laugh out or me. If you aren't......... Rafer Alston is a horrible basketball player. He is not fundamentally sound and has 0 bearing on the outcome of a basketball game. He can play AND 1 streetball however when it comes to the NBA he is a horrible player. Calling him an up and coming star is sort of in my mind disgracing all the up and comer's that actually have talent. All Skip to my Lou can do is dribble a basketball and he can't even do it fundamentally. He deserves all the respect he gets on the AND 1 Circuit because there he was the "man". In the NBA, he isn't even worthy in my opinion to even be mentioned in the same thread as Kevin Garnett, Kobe Bryant, Tim Duncan, etc. In the NBA fundamentals are the key and Rafer has none. Amazing how none of the AND 1 streetballers have ever been dominant in the NBA.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting dexter:</div><div class="quote_post"> Rafer Alston is a horrible basketball player. He is not fundamentally sound and has 0 bearing on the outcome of a basketball game. He can play AND 1 streetball however when it comes to the NBA he is a horrible player. Calling him an up and coming star is sort of in my mind disgracing all the up and comer's that actually have talent. All Skip to my Lou can do is dribble a basketball and he can't even do it fundamentally. He deserves all the respect he gets on the AND 1 Circuit because there he was the "man". In the NBA, he isn't even worthy in my opinion to even be mentioned in the same thread as Kevin Garnett, Kobe Bryant, Tim Duncan, etc. </div> While I agree that Skip should never be mentioned in the same breathe as the upper-tier players, I think you're being a bit harsh on his game...He's not a "horrible" basketball player at all IMO, he's actually very solid...He's playing a big role in Miami's success (if u wanna call it that) this season...
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting notMuchgame:</div><div class="quote_post">Well, if you're going to take the topic's title literally rather than what was obviously meant, then you can assume that the topic starter thinks the members of JBB are basketball psychics...no one knows "who <u>will </u> be the NExt KG," but we can only <u>speculate </u> who has a chance to become KG -esque...that's the presumed idea of this topic.... And which of these traits of "versatility" does Bosh not do well for a 19 year old?</div> Being KG-esque at least to me means being versatile for all the reasons I've previously stated. I don't know what it means to you. You've already stated that you Bosh couldn't do that as well as Garnett so I really don't know what point you're trying to drive at. In your post you stated that "KG could do other things besides being versatile". Versatility by definition means being able to do alot of things well. So if KG can defend, score, rebound and assist is he not, by definition, versatile?
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Ndudi Ebi Rafer Alston Flip Murray Lonny Baxter Kwame Brown Juan Dixon Dajuan Wagner Caron Butler Dwyane Wade Udonis Haslem Sebastian telfair(when he is in the league) Luke Ridnour</div> Rafer Alston? Come on. He is not an up and coming player. First off, he is like 28 years old, and he will always be a backup. He does not have the skills to take a team into the playoffs, and he is just a spark off the bench. I don't think many of those guys will be stars. I really like Wagner, but he has alot of work to do on his game. I haven't even seen Ebi play in the NBA yet, and he has potential but he is not going to shine in Minnesota, thats for sure. I really don't know how you can put him on this list with him RARELY playing. Flip Murray is not going to be a star sitting behind Ray Allen. How about some of these guys on top of the others mentioned : Michael Redd, Mike Dunleavy, Carlos Boozer, Chris Bosh, Jarvis Hayes...
lebrons statline 3 years from now (he develops a jumper).....27 PPG, 7 APG, 8 RPG, 2 SPG, 1.5 BPG, 40 MPG
Yea I don't know about the 1.5 BPG though, most guards average the highet BPG of their careers when they're younger b/c they're more inclined then to go for blocks, look at Tmac, Carter, Stackhouse etc. When they get older it tends to decrease. LJ isn't getting up to 1 BPG this year and he's playing 40 mins so I don't think he'll be blocking that many.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post">Being KG-esque at least to me means being versatile for all the reasons I've previously stated. I don't know what it means to you. You've already stated that you Bosh couldn't do that as well as Garnett so I really don't know what point you're trying to drive at. </div> You said the traits of versatility are the abilities to defend, "score, rebound, assist, run the floor"...I'm saying I believe Bosh will be able to do all those things well in the future...will he do it as well as KG? I dont know, but I do know he has the potiential...Bosh is playing as well as Garnett was playing at the same age...But you can't seem to understand that argument for some reason, because you comparing Garnett in his prime to a 19 year old kid... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> In your post you stated that "KG could do other things besides being versatile". Versatility by definition means being able to do alot of things well. So if KG can defend, score, rebound and assist is he not, by definition, versatile</div> Man, u just misquoted me...IF you are going to make a legit arguement, quote me correctly...I said "There's more aspects to KG's game than just his versitility." As you mentioned, Versatility is being able to do mulitiple things, but what u fail to realize is that them "things" are tangible. Leadership, clutch, heart, persistance, intelligence etc etc are NOT traits of versatility, yet they are important qualities of a ball player...I agree that KG is the most versatile player in the league, but versatility alone only begins to describe his game...
[quote name='notMuchgame']You said the traits of versatility are the abilities to defend, "score, rebound, assist, run the floor"...I'm saying I believe Bosh will be able to do all those things well in the future...will he do it as well as KG? I dont know, but I do know he has the potiential...Bosh is playing as well as Garnett was playing at the same age...But you can't seem to understand that argument for some reason, because you comparing Garnett in his prime to a 19 year old kid.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting notMuchgame:</div><div class="quote_post">You said the traits of versatility are the abilities to defend, "score, rebound, assist, run the floor"...I'm saying I believe Bosh will be able to do all those things well in the future...will he do it as well as KG? I dont know, but I do know he has the potiential...Bosh is playing as well as Garnett was playing at the same age...But you can't seem to understand that argument for some reason, because you comparing Garnett in his prime to a 19 year old kid... Man, u just misquoted me...IF you are going to make a legit arguement, quote me correctly...I said "There's more aspects to KG's game than just his versitility." As you mentioned, Versatility is being able to do mulitiple things, but what u fail to realize is that them "things" are tangible. Leadership, clutch, heart, persistance, intelligence etc etc are NOT traits of versatility, yet they are important qualities of a ball player...I agree that KG is the most versatile player in the league, but versatility alone only begins to describe his game...</div> No, I don't understand your argument because it's a chicken shit argument. You might as well just say that 100% of the NBA players out there who can score, rebound, assist, run the floor has the potential to be a KG player. If you yourself don't think you Bosh can do it ALL of the things as well or better than KG then Bosh is no KG. KG's upside at 19 was way better than Bosh's at 19 So, no I do not think Bosh will ever be a KG-esque player like you say. For the reason I've repeatedly stated in my arguments before. Bosh will never be able to do the things as well or better than KG. Leadership, heart, persistence, intelligence are personality traits NOT a part of his "game" as you so eloquently put it when you said: "There's more aspects to KG's game than just his versitility". Never once in your previous posts did you mention the intangible qualities. When we talk about his game we are all talking about the tangible qualites because those can be easily compared. *sigh* I'm tired of going around in circles with you. Let's just agree to disagree. You think Bosh has the potential to be the next KG. I call bullshit.
I agree with NotMuchGame that out of everyone (1st and second year) Bosh has the most potential to have the same career as KG. But of course all of this is pure speculation. He could be the first Chris Bosh in the NBA and people will be comparing others to him. All in all, we don't know and we are just speculating. I would have picked Amare but he doesn't pass as well (if at all) as Bosh does. Not saying that Bosh can pass well, he can just pass better than Amare All of the intangibles such as intelligence, leadership etc.. come with time when you are in the league. A rookie doesn't just come in and start leading his team (with a few exceptions) and if I'm not mistaken KG had to be goaded in the beginning to become more of a leader. Those things take time to develope.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post"> You might as well just say that 100% of the NBA players out there who can score, rebound, assist, run the floor has the potential to be a KG player. </div> I was just using your words to back up mine...Look, I'll retrace your words, You said this: <div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post">Garnett can do well besides defend such score, rebound, assist, run the floor of which the <u>definition of versatility</u> has already encompassed. </div> <div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post"><u>Being KG-esque</u> at least to me means being versatile for all the reasons I've previously stated. I don't know what it means to you. </div> <div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post"> Leadership, heart, persistence, intelligence are personality traits NOT a part of his "game" as you so eloquently put it when you said: "There's more aspects to KG's game than just his versitility". Never once in your previous posts did you mention the intangible qualities. When we talk about his game we are all talking about the tangible qualites because those can be easily compared. </div> How are the intangibles "not a part of his game?" Fine, we'll do it your way and only compare tangibles... Again, I'll post what i posted earlier; <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Their stats as 19 year-old rookies: Garnett:..10.4 ppg, 6.3 rpg, 1.8 apg, 1.6 bpg, 1.1 spg, 1.4 tpg Bosh:......11.2 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 1.0 apg, 1.4 bpg, 0.7 spg, 1.4 tpg</div> THat tangible enough for ya? We won't even talk about potiential since its "intangible"...right? <div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post"> I'm tired of going around in circles with you. Let's just agree to disagree. You think Bosh has the potential to be the next KG. I call bullshit.</div> Of course, ain't nuthin wrong with disagrements, especially on a discussion board
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting notMuchgame:</div><div class="quote_post">I was just using your words to back up mine...Look, I'll retrace your words, You said this: How are the intangibles "not a part of his game?" Fine, we'll do it your way and only compare tangibles... Again, I'll post what i posted earlier; THat tangible enough for ya? We won't even talk about potiential since its "intangible"...right? Of course, ain't nuthin wrong with disagrements, especially on a discussion board</div> And what does that prove? I can post numbers of some past 6-11 players who's had numbers similar to Garnett in their rookie years: Veterans in their rookie year: Camby 28.2min 10.5ppg 6.10rpg 1.9apg .519fg% 1.59spg .81bpg Lafrentz 38.0min 14.8ppg 6.30rpg 1.5apg .482fg% .482spg 2.06bpg Laettner 34.9min 18.2ppg 8.70rpg 2.8apg .474fg% .474spg 1.02 bpg These guys are decent players now, but I think we both agree they are no Kevin Garnett. Based on your argument of comparing rookie number's I can point out a few other players besides Bosh who would fit this mold. Do I think they will be the next Kevin Garnett? No. Amare 31.9min 13.4ppg 9.2rpg .9apg .472fg% .76spg 1.06bpg Nene 28.2min 10.5ppg 6.10rpg 1.9apg .519fg% .1.59spg .81bpg And if you want to argue "potential" then I can argue that Garnett had tons more "potential" at 19 than Bosh ever did. But how do you prove it? Are you gonna bring up numbers? I think I've just proven that numbers only tell so much. The only similiarities between Bosh and Garnett is that they're both built like toothpicks. If you asked me who has the potential to be the next Garnett, I would say no one. These guys just aren't as talented as Garnett was, period. If you asked me who has the most potential to be a superstar in this league and be as dominating as a KG or a TMac, I'd have to say Lebron or Amare. Bosh will go the way of Laettner or Lafrentz. Better than average players but no superstar.
I think the reason he said Bosh and not Lattener and Camby etc is b/c Bosh is also 19 like KG was when he came to the league. Camby and Lattener were in their 20's. Actually Nene could be pretty good and versatile, but he doesn't have the shot that Bosh currently does, but Nene can handle the ball like a guard and he's a good passer. He's also a beast and very atheletic and fast (faster than KG), and he has alright quickness.
Bosh will be like Laetnerr or Lafrentz? They have totally different games then Bosh does. Career wise I know Bosh will have a better career than both of those guys put together. You are talking about the fact that KG had more potential than Bosh did at 19, how do you actually measure that? KG had more publicity and hype when he came in thats fore sure but how do you measure potential exactly? Point is there is no way you can compare the potential of players, the best thing you can do is measure the stats up against each other. Noone knows who the next KG, but some players today have enough talent and potential to be known for themselves. Using KG as a measuring stick is fine but to say that none would reach his point is foolish to say at this point.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting DonJuan:</div><div class="quote_post">And what does that prove? I can post numbers of some past 6-11 players who's had numbers similar to Garnett in their rookie years: Veterans in their rookie year: Camby 28.2min 10.5ppg 6.10rpg 1.9apg .519fg% 1.59spg .81bpg Lafrentz 38.0min 14.8ppg 6.30rpg 1.5apg .482fg% .482spg 2.06bpg Laettner 34.9min 18.2ppg 8.70rpg 2.8apg .474fg% .474spg 1.02 bpg These guys are decent players now, but I think we both agree they are no Kevin Garnett. </div> Do u not understand the concept of age? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Based on your argument of comparing rookie number's I can point out a few other players besides Bosh who would fit this mold. Do I think they will be the next Kevin Garnett? No. Amare 31.9min 13.4ppg 9.2rpg .9apg .472fg% .76spg 1.06bpg Nene 28.2min 10.5ppg 6.10rpg 1.9apg .519fg% .1.59spg .81bpg</div> Both Nene and Amare will be future stars IMO...but their game isn't anywhere similar to KG's game, so your argument is futile...My stats were used to <u>support the argument</u>, not to <u>make the arugment</u>...there's a difference... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The only similiarities between Bosh and Garnett is that they're both built like toothpicks. </div> Have u even seen Bosh play before? He's long at 6'10'', yet he runs the floor like a guard...He can shoot it from the outside, and he can also take into the inside...He's incredibly athletic....He has a slight build, but is a lot stronger than he looks... Sound familiar to u? Just to finish this off, I'm not the only one who thinks Bosh has Garnett-esque "potiential"...so you can disagree with it, but you can't totally dismiss it as u have.....Here's Sports Illustrated's scouting report on Bosh coming into the draft... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">It's little wonder Bosh turned pro after just one season in college. He reminds some observers of Kevin Garnett, and those comparisons are justified. He's not quite the perimeter threat Garnett is, but Bosh is an inside-outside scorer with great athleticism and a solid feel for the game. He handles the ball exceptionally well for his size and is also a good passer. Bosh is a defensive presence because he's an exceptional shot blocker. The knock on Bosh is his size.he's going to have to add bulk and strength in order to consistently do battle with NBA power forwards.</div> Sports Illustrated Personally, Bosh looks more like a future David Robinson to me, but that might be because he's left-handed...but a KG comparison is definitely not out of the question...
