We all see Vince is clutch throughout the year, but i've never really seen Jalen screw up when the games on the line either. The last 2 or so games Jalen hit the trey WHILE the raptors were down 2 making for even more pressure in the final seconds. Vince has always been clutch as well (like in the Hornets game), but who has more clutch?
Vince's being the more injury prone player has nothing to do with this, but I believe it's him. A natural scorer, with speed and power, he still is fearless and so won't be affected much by the pressure. Also he is clutch. As for Jalen, no doubt he's good, no doubt he's improved. But sometimes his shot selection is still just as stupid and that alone makes me choose the now fundamental and less turnover Vince.
I'd have to say Vince is the most clutch player on the Raptors. Jalan has stepped of late but overall Vince is the most clutch player on the Raptors, and probably top 10-15 player in the league.
I disagree. I think Vince is the guy that gets you into the clutch situation. When the game is on the line, Vince will be heavily guarded. Jalen has more experience and doesn't rush anything in those situations. I mean if the question is if both guys were left wide open who would I want to shoot it, then ya Vince. If you are talking in game situations when Vince draws triple teams, then I'd rather see Rose take the shot. They are both clutch, just depends on the circumstances of the game.
Yes, but when we are talking about "clutch" were talking about a last shot situation, we cannot determine if Vince or Jalen will be double or triple teamed. So we have to assume they are both being guarded the same way.
Vince, not Jalen at all, why? Vince can hit the clutch shot, make the assist, and in crunch time he suddenly becomes our best rebounder and he becomes a good defender. Jalen hit some shots but how can that cover up all his other misses, he also makes bad decisions down the stretch, and his clutchness is restricted to making a shot or a pass, no clutch rebounding, defense or getting clutch blocks or steals.
Being clutch is more than just making the last shot at the end of the game. Its about the steals, blocks, rebounds and last but not least <font size="4">Defense</font><font size="2">.</font> Example: Game six NBA Finals. The Bulls are down by 1 and Utah has the ball. Karl Malone is in the post, Jordan comes from behind and steals the ball. Posession Bulls. Jordan comes down offensive fouls Bryon Russell and makes the game winning shot. But what led to that shot? Defense. If I had to choose someone that is most clutch on the Raptors it has to be Vince. He does it with offense (Although he tries to win games by shooting when he can just drive to the basket) and defense. I can remember a few blocks he had at the end of regulation to preserve leads (on Jason Terry and AD) and he has made some clutch shots to win games as well. Jalen? This guy is a defensive liability. Everyone knows he can't even guard a shopping cart. Offensively he's good but you have to commit to both ends of the court before you are even considered clutch.
i think they r both just as cluth down the streth. vince is the first option but then jalen gets a lot of good shots since vinceis covered most of the time. jalen makes good use of his shots.... and btw, vince and jal;en BOTH dot play defense very well lol.
Jalen is taken out of the game when the Raps are playing defence and Vince stays on the whole time so Vince. And anyone remember his early year games. Last second shot vs Boston? It was also a heavily gaurded shot and he still made it. He also dunked a ball at the last second vs Houston to win the game, can Jalen do that? But Jalen is still good but the only reason Jalen made the shot vs Bucks is because Vince drove, drew 3 guys and kicked it out to Jalen, same thing for Cleveland, Vince drove got 4 shirts on him, kicked it to Bosh, then Mo, then Jalen for the shot.
^^^ that was in the 99/00' thing, the dunk on Houston and the shot over Boston... I remmeber that year, there was a stretch of 3 weeks in which Vince made a buzzer beating, game winning shot once each week... First, it was the isolation fadeaway 3 pointer over TWO Boston Celtics as the clock ran out and the Raps won on the road.. then the catch and shoot 3 pointer against the Clippers on the road again... then finally the quick first step and dunk over Hakeem to win the game with 2 seconds left... damn, those were the days...
lol, ^i didn't see them live, but i've the videos for them...and ...damn...even the clipper fans and boston fans (they were away) were cheering after vince hit the shots..
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting McGrady^1:</div><div class="quote_post">lol, ^i didn't see them live, but i've the videos for them...and ...damn...even the clipper fans and boston fans (they were away) were cheering after vince hit the shots..</div> LMAO
Yeah they were cheering, especially in LA. It was gawd damn hilarious. As for the clutchest of players on the Raps squad, it most definitely has to be Vince. He raises his game to a level that we could expect him to play with all game. He can simply dominate on both ends sometimes and we wonder why isn't that motivation all the time. He's still learning I guess. Jalen has been good for us too though. Ever since returning from his injury (way earlier than scheduled BTW) he was truly playing like that secondary scorer we need every night. He hit some nice shots. I like having both players, nothing wrong with added pressure on the other time in crunch time.
Vince no doubt. He can score under pressure and is real good at the free throw. He gets almost all his rebounds at the end and plays real good defense(block vs Atlanta). Him and Rose are the only players that can play at the end of the game. Every one else stops playing thats why we had so many losses. Rose is clutch but Carter is much more clutch. The only reason Rose got those two shots beacause the play was designed for him but most of the time its designed for Carter. You cant give it to Carter all the time because all the other team has to do is triple team him.
Thank You CourtVision, clutch is not only about taking the last shot but the all around game during the last 4/3/2 minutes or so. On Defense, vince has been very good this season when it's crunch time I remember a couple of big blocks he had like the toronto-atlanta game when he collected 3 rebounds,6 points,2 assists and 1 block all in the clutch. Jalen has hit big shots from us too, and i do not want to take anything away from him but even in his days at indiana, when he was a really big part of their offense, he could not defend. You need to do much more than score in the crunch to be considered clutch.
I don't think you can say clutch is just about if both players were in the same situation who would be better. The fact of the matter is that Vince draws triple teams on last second shot attempts. That drastically reduces the odds of him making the shot. Jalen doesn't. There are other points in the game that can be considered clutch as well. For example when your team is leading, but the other is making a run. It's clutch to nail a basket to end the run for the other team. I'm just saying that Jalen deserves some respect for hitting shots when they are needed. I totally agree that Jalen is a turnover machine. That's because he needs to play the SG versus the point. Hopefully that happens next year.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Fundamentals:</div><div class="quote_post">Thank You CourtVision, clutch is not only about taking the last shot but the all around game during the last 4/3/2 minutes or so. On Defense, vince has been very good this season when it's crunch time I remember a couple of big blocks he had like the toronto-atlanta game when he collected 3 rebounds,6 points,2 assists and 1 block all in the clutch. Jalen has hit big shots from us too, and i do not want to take anything away from him but even in his days at indiana, when he was a really big part of their offense, he could not defend. You need to do much more than score in the crunch to be considered clutch.</div> Thats what I said: <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Vince, not Jalen at all, why? Vince can hit the clutch shot, make the assist, and in crunch time he suddenly becomes our best rebounder and he becomes a good defender. Jalen hit some shots but how can that cover up all his other misses, he also makes bad decisions down the stretch, and his clutchness is restricted to making a shot or a pass, no clutch rebounding, defense or getting clutch blocks or steals</div> It's true, its more than just offense, at least in crunch time Vince will play better D, Jalen just can't play better D.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting harry_balls5:</div><div class="quote_post">....and btw, vince and jal;en BOTH dot play defense very well lol.</div> But Vince plays a hell of a lot better defense than Jalen (although that is not saying much). I can't say that Vince sucks at defending because he does make some clutch plays on defense. But I do think he is a better help defender than one on one defender. He is good coming from the weak side and blocking shots but if you ask him to stop Kobe, it ain't happening.
The thing about Vince, he's a good off ball defender but doesn't put enough effort and isn't a good on ball/ one on one defender. He has the team defense but when its one on one he's not good.
