<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">Since then, Jason Kidd has been blatantly overrated.</div> Kidd overrated?! Are we talking about the same Jason Kidd?!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">I was a Kidd fan up until the trade from the Suns to the Nets. While I have always been astonished that nobody has taken offense to Kidd's shooting percentage (he shoots the ball worse than Iverson, who does get heat for it), I was able to forgive him up until the Jersey trade. </div> once again, lets see if this gets through peoples skull about kidds shooting. kidd was never a shooter/scorer. he can put points up and have over the course of his career and his jersey career if you watch the games. plus iverson takes so many shots that his percentage is never going to be great. he has to shoot a lot for philly to win. hes a scorer, he doesnt shoot, philly won't win. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Since then, Jason Kidd has been blatantly overrated. Stephon Marbury was mocked because he couldn't take the same Nets team that made it to the Finals with JKidd to the play-offs. Same team, huh? Bullcrap! 4 of the 5 starters on that team were injured for long stretches during the season with Steph (Kittles did not play all season). When Kidd played there the first season, there were no injuries.</div> overrated!? you have GOT to be kidding me and everyone else. that shows that you cant even make logical points b/c ur a kidd hater. how can someone be overrated when he help to take a team to its first ever nba finals two years in a row with young players? kmart was only in his 2nd yr and collins and rj were rookies. so please tell me how that is being overrated! i can understand you saying that if he had tim duncan or shaq, but he didnt. he had two young fowards and a new center on that nets team. and since when was steph supposed to take the nets far in the playoffs. i don't recall hearing that the nets team with him was supposed to win the east and go to the finals. he had the players who he had and he made the best of it. if u put steph with that 1st yr team kidd was on(yes there was van horn but thats not saying alot b/c he wasnt the best player at that time), he wouldn't have made them(players and team) better and they wouldnt go far into the playoffs b/c the guys were young and had no experience so steph would try to take over and kmart and rj would never grow. bottom line, kidd is a leader and teacher, steph is not. they are totally different players offensivly and defensivly so you can't compare. but u can tell who is the best pg in the league and who is not. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">So that's been my major reason to hate on Kidd: actually it is to give counterweight to all the unjustified Kidd-Steph comparisons. This season, people were saying once more that Steph was the lesser of Kidd in the play-offs. Bullcrap! Allan Houston and Tim Thomas were injured, which caused all of Steph's assists to the wing to be bricked by Shandon fudgin' Anderson.</div> thats a pretty stupid reason. b/c he "cant" shoot and that he was traded for steph. steph was lesser of kidd in the playoffs. if you were talking about the knicks vs nets, then you bring in allen houston and tim thomas' injuries. but if your talking about steph vs kidd, kidd won it easily. steph has enough talent to drive to the basket and make open jumpers, he didnt do that. the injuries had some impact on stephs game possibly, but that much of an impact where he didnt show up in the second half!?!? com'on, he just didnt step up to the plate.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I was a Kidd fan up until the trade from the Suns to the Nets. While I have always been astonished that nobody has taken offense to Kidd's shooting percentage (he shoots the ball worse than Iverson, who does get heat for it), I was able to forgive him up until the Jersey trade</div>. Iverson gets called out because all he basicilly does is shoot. He doesnt bring the intangibles to the table that kidd does. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Since then, Jason Kidd has been blatantly overrated. Stephon Marbury was mocked because he couldn't take the same Nets team that made it to the Finals with JKidd to the play-offs. Same team, huh? Bullcrap! 4 of the 5 starters on that team were injured for long stretches during the season with Steph (Kittles did not play all season). When Kidd played there the first season, there were no injuries. </div> What you fail to talk about is the chemistry problems that Steph created his 2 seasons with the Nets. He went at it with Kendall Gill, Keith Van Horn, Kenyon Martin all because of his shot selection. His teamates never had faith in him as their leader at the point. The Nets were in complete disray when he was here. Everybody was selfish, You had like Stephen Jackson,I got love for him but,who lauch the ball everytime he touched the rock. Everybody during those years were out only for stats & self promotion. And it all started at the point guard position. Soon as J.Kidd step in New Jersey he provided the Nets with leadership.He put the faith back into guys like Van Horn, Harris, Kittles. Guys who were on that 98' team that made the playoffs & had nothing but upside. They knew with Kidd leading them they could get back to that level & surpass it. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">So that's been my major reason to hate on Kidd: actually it is to give counterweight to all the unjustified Kidd-Steph comparisons. This season, people were saying once more that Steph was the lesser of Kidd in the play-offs. Bullcrap! Allan Houston and Tim Thomas were injured, which caused all of Steph's assists to the wing to be bricked by Shandon fudgin' Anderson.</div> Granted Steph options were limited. But at least he could have elevated the talent around him to pull out one victory. Kurt Thomas, Penny Hardaway are still decent players when their games are elevated. And its up to Steph as the leader of the Knicks to help elevate their game. Nobody said that the Knicks had to win the series. But at least he should have helped to put his team in a situation to be competive in the series. And maybe pull out a game or 2. Listen Iam not a Marbury hater. I like Marbury indiviual talent. And Iam happy he is back in the tri-state. I live in New York, so I know the excitment & hope Marbury brought to New York when he got trade back to the area in December. But Iam happy he isnt with the Nets anymore. It isnt the place for him. He isnt the type of point guard the Nets need to lead them
Well basically everyone in here is right. He didnt help the knicks as a leader cause he would always try to take over games in the 4th quarter but to tell you the truth i dont blame him..Cause kurt would always miss from the corner where hes always standing and alot of peole would miss so whatever idk
kurt thomas is a whole different story. he is a big guy, has muscle yet ALL he does, or did in the series, was camp on the right baseline and wait for the ball to bounce to him off a reb or for steph or penny to pass it to him. he really needs to post up a helluva lot more for the knicks to have any shot. they didnt have a low post guy to go to and as a power foward that is your job. thats why i think he is/could be on his way out of NY. he is a PF but tries to play a SF and make the 15footer all the time and only take the 15ftr.
If you look at it objectively, Stephon has never got the chances JKidd has got in his career. He has never had the team around him JKidd now has. That's just a fact. He could not have possibly guided the Knicks to a victory because of what was already said in here about Kurt Thomas AND because -- and if you watched these games you would know it -- the plays that were run for Allan Houston were well executed with Steph presenting shots for Shandon Anderson on a dinner plate, with the now well known result: brick after brick. For God's sake, look at Shandon Anderson's FG%: he made 7 of 27 (wide open!!) shots! At that point, Steph has got to step up and of course he then has to force the issue, because no one else is able to step up; on the Nets team, JKidd does not have to take that responsibility. Oh and that stuff about Kidd being a pass first shoot second PG is very true, but is that really an excuse for bricking so many wide open J's? No, it is not. Let me give you the example of another shoot second PG, John Stockton. For his career, Mr Stockton shot the ball at a 52% rate. That, ladies and gentlemen, is efficiency. Kidd does not have that, shooting wis of course, and I do blame him for that.
if hitting the rim is considered bricked shots, then yes kidd does do that. i think what you mean bricking shots means that he chucks it off the backboard and it looks ugly. he misses, he doesnt brick unless he,anyone else, has to throw it up b/c of the shot clock. everyone has a brick shot here or there, but ur making sound like thats all kidd does is either make it or brick it. he has normal misses shots. and anyone who has an off game is going to miss wide open jumper, like u've been saying about anderson. he has hot shooting games/halfs/quarters then he doesnt like others, he's just not the most consistant shooter in the league and every knows that-especially kidd himself. *sigh...enough with kidd's shooting*
aww man have u seen when kidd does does fakes like hes gonna pass and makes the layup on the break man those are amazing, he probably taught Kerry how to do that cause on game 3 kerry did that...The nets need to win one on the road no matter what i hope they play like the way they did for game 5
I'm sorry I post in this thread again, but I did not want to start a new one. Have you guys now seen how overrated Kidd really is? In the first Game 7 of his career, he can't even score? Is this the MVP candidate? (talking about the last few seasons) What I meant by Kidd being overrated is just situations like this: he cannot take over a deciding game, when they needed him the most. All this season, RJ has bailed him out and when he for once did not lead the Nets, Kidd failed. I wouldn't even call it "failed" because there exists no word for what Kidd "showed" last night. And don't start about K-Mart. Is this a franchise player?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">I'm sorry I post in this thread again, but I did not want to start a new one. Have you guys now seen how overrated Kidd really is? In the first Game 7 of his career, he can't even score? Is this the MVP candidate? (talking about the last few seasons) What I meant by Kidd being overrated is just situations like this: he cannot take over a deciding game, when they needed him the most. All this season, RJ has bailed him out and when he for once did not lead the Nets, Kidd failed. I wouldn't even call it "failed" because there exists no word for what Kidd "showed" last night. And don't start about K-Mart. Is this a franchise player? </div> AHAHAHAHAHA ROFFLES!!!! man, i think this is the first ever 7games you have seen the nets play. it has to be. nobody and be this stupid. sadly you have not seen past years. 2yrs ago you can arguably say that kidd was the mvp over duncan, but td got it. he was injured this whole year and detroit IS a good team. don't sell them short. and it doesnt help that out of your whole roster that 1 guy has been in a game 7. palace isn't the easiest place to win, especially when it is the franchises, FRANCHISES, first game 7, not just kidd's. for you to keep crying about kidd being overrated shows that you are an immature kidd hater, and there is no place for haters only. if you hate kidd at least give a reasonable reason to hate him. not just b/c of the obvious. everything has been said to prove you wrong, you know your wrong- u just hate kidd. so please, let this go and when you grow up next year feel free to post once again. kthx.
Try playing with a bum knee and a sore back. Then add to the fact that you've been playing 40+ minutes the whole series running after Rip Hamilton. Oh and don't get started with KMart. The whole Pistons frontline was focused on him. He's the only post player that the Nets have. Plus when you've been battling two Wallaces during the whole series, a double-double in game 7 is way more than decent.
^^Playing with a bum knee and a sore back, eh? Well, don't look now, but Sam Cassel has to be treated with electrodes on his back duriing time-outs and other breaks and he had himself a decent Game 7 for the Wolves, now didn't he? Ah throwback, looking at your post, it is hard not to laugh at the fact that you call someone else immature. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">he was injured this whole year and detroit IS a good team. don't sell them short. and it doesnt help that out of your whole roster that 1 guy has been in a game 7. </div> He scored zero points and basically cost this Nets team the ballgame, what do you want me to say? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">palace isn't the easiest place to win, especially when it is the franchises, FRANCHISES, first game 7, not just kidd's.</div>How bout those Wolves eh; first game 7 in franchise history and guess what? They won, led by a brilliant performance by their franchise player. That, my friend, is the way superstars should step up. Scoring zero points is just not going to cut it for me... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">if you hate kidd at least give a reasonable reason to hate him. not just b/c of the obvious. </div> Are you now saying that I should not hate on Kidd bc it is obvious that there is a reason to hate on him? I'm confused. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">everything has been said to prove you wrong, you know your wrong- u just hate kidd.</div>I have stated that Ason Kidd is overrated and look what he did in the first game 7 of his life. I am not here to start a fight with Nets fans. I just wanted to come by and let you guys know that my previous comments about Kidd were not as unjustified as you guys deemed them.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">^^Playing with a bum knee and a sore back, eh? Well, don't look now, but Sam Cassel has to be treated with electrodes on his back duriing time-outs and other breaks and he had himself a decent Game 7 for the Wolves, now didn't he?</div> Believe me, it would be a great difference if you're playing with the MVP. Besides, Kidd's injury's been bugging him almost all season. Add to the fact the minutes that he's playing this series. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">Ah throwback, looking at your post, it is hard not to laugh at the fact that you call someone else immature. He scored zero points and basically cost this Nets team the ballgame, what do you want me to say?</div> This my friend shows how hateful you are of Kidd. You're pinpointing him as the sole reason of the loss. To state a few reasons aside from Kidd's performance: 1. Martin was clearly outplayed by the two Wallaces. 2. Our bench was terrible. 3. Our big men aside from Martin was terrible. To quote Frank, "As a team, it just wasn't our night." <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">How bout those Wolves eh; first game 7 in franchise history and guess what? They won, led by a brilliant performance by their franchise player. That, my friend, is the way superstars should step up. Scoring zero points is just not going to cut it for me...</div> Their franchise player with the help of Sam and Spree of course. Plus a very very deep bench. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Big Zee:</div><div class="quote_post">Are you now saying that I should not hate on Kidd bc it is obvious that there is a reason to hate on him? I'm confused. I have stated that Ason Kidd is overrated and look what he did in the first game 7 of his life. I am not here to start a fight with Nets fans. I just wanted to come by and let you guys know that my previous comments about Kidd were not as unjustified as you guys deemed them.</div> So we're going to throw out the window what he did for the franchise? A bad game 7 and suddenly you forgot what he did the past three years? Franchise players are built and destroyed through the years. It will take more than a game 7 to build or destroy a franchise player. It seems that you're the only person who's saying those arguments. Everybody was surprised with his performance. Everybody has the greatest respect for him. Let me quote some of it. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">'Our guards set the tone, not necessarily on offense, but on defense," said Rasheed Wallace, who finished with 12 points and seven rebounds yesterday. "To hold J. Kidd to zero points, in my opinion, that's next to impossible. We're dealing with one of the better point guards in the league right now."</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">'You can't look at his stat sheet and say, 'Well he didn't score, so he wasn't productive,"' Hunter said. "This guy can be productive not scoring at all."</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">"I thought New Jersey was going to come out with a lot more energy and play a lot harder," Pistons center Ben Wallace said. "If you would've told me that we were going blow this team out, coming into a Game 7, I would've told you you're crazy."</div> I have more to say but I have to go. Please do post again and I'll counter them when I get back in.
nicely put trust. i am not going to reply to mr.zee's post because there is really no reason for this topic to have anymore posts in it. there are haters for every player, every team out there. this is just one hater expressing his opinion and no matter what information other people reply about his thoughts he won't change because he doesn't like jason. so lets just move on. this was my last post in this topic, unless i get provoked
How you can simply ignore the fact that Ason Kidd, the franchise, sucked so badly? I did see the game and Ason was just terrible: Lyndsey Hunter and the other Pistons are obviously going to say what they said out of politeness, but Ason really did suck, and if that hurts and you cannot face it, that is understandable, but it does not mean I cannot state my opinion. You say that KG had more help in Spree & Sam, well what about K-Mart & RJ? Are they not an All Star and an Olympian, respectively? Please. If you're going to say that I'm biased -- which I am -- please do not ignore the fact that you guys are too. I have posted so many facts in here and not one of them has been corroborated. That says it all. But yes, I will stop posting in here as well. I will no longer provoke you guys.
As I've said, it takes more than one game to make or destroy a franchise player. A great game 7 won't make that player suddenly a franchise player. And a bad game 7 won't destroy a franchise player. It's built through the years. So when you take a look at the career of "Ason" Kidd as you put it, all you can see is success. Regarding KG, there's no question that KG is better than Kidd this season. It's true that Kidd has Kmart, RJ and...and...and...basically no one else while KG still has bench players that are pretty much capable of starting. I don't know why I'm even replying. It was nice talking to you.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting InNETSweTrust:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't know why I'm even replying. It was nice talking to you.</div>I appreciate your replies and I apologize if I offended you.
