Anyone read that LA times article by Mark Heisler? The article Article requires registeration... for all that are too lazy to register, the synposis of the article is: Kobe is the future, Shaq isn't. Shaq is fat and 32, kobe, while pending the rape trial, is young and exciting. Keep kobe, trade Shaq. I thought about the article a lot and was a little at first pissed off that things had to come to this point. Kobe being selfish, Shaq being overweight and greedy. But the more I thought about it, I thought about the future of the Lakers. granted that in two years, after Shaq is overweight and Ming is burnt out... there won't be any real legit centers left in the NBA. the Lakers need to acknowledge that. While coveting a legit center would be a smart move, Shaq is going to deterioate quickly. Centers that weigh 350 plus pounds and are 7 feet tall can only maintain healthy for so long. That said, Kobe is the future, albeit certainity, he's got promise of more to come. Buss while he should've handled it with more tact, made the right choice in keeping Kobe. Phil was going to leave either way. Malone is Kobe's friend as much as Shaq's so it's not going to matter who stays. Payton? Who cares about Payton. Either way, I thought Heisler made some insightful points.
I agree with everything you just said. I wish Payton would've left and looked elsewhere...but I figured he'd come back for the amount of money he wouldn't have made with any other team. Malone should make the choice to come back based on his health more than who he'll be playing with. Kobe has done everything for the Lakers...he's saved them from postseason upsets, regular season losses, and even pushed the Lakers up a couple of seeds in the playoffs with his determination and clutch shots. He is by far the most valuable Laker.
ya, i would keep kobe he has a good future ahead of him,shaq will old and get slower and get less dominent.
Well, i'll keep Kobe any day. Don't get me wrong, Shaq is a great player, but,they're already comparing Kobe @ 25 to Mj @ 25. Kobe is a all around great player.
The whole Laker team plays better with Shaq. When Shaq is hurt and is out but Kobe is in the Lakers lose, but when the role is turned around the Lakers win most of them.
75% of NBA Championship teams had a good to great dominant big man. So that's something the Lakers GM should look at it looking at the fact that the NBA today is being overruled my big men from Shaq, Duncan, and Garnett etc… And lets be realistic Shaq is not the same Shaq from 3-4 years ago, but he still without a doubt a Top 5 Player in the League, and is still labeled as the most dominant player in the NBA. I'm not saying that the Jerry Buss and Mitch Kupchak should consider taking Shaq over Kobe, but he shouldn't just jump to conclusion and just think about the future.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TwinTowers:</div><div class="quote_post">The whole Laker team plays better with Shaq. When Shaq is hurt and is out but Kobe is in the Lakers lose, but when the role is turned around the Lakers win most of them.</div> As they should. The whole Laker team is built around Shaq, not Kobe. However, since Shaq is not the dominant player he once was, teams have been focusing on shutting down Kobe instead. The NBA Finals was a preminition of things to come if the Lakers continue to build around Shaq. Also Shaq no longer plays defense or rebounds with any intensity. He only plays well 1 out of 3 games. A man his size should be getting 30 points and 20 boards a night. Shaq does not assert himself on the court enough, like he did a few years back. Maybe he's bored with the game, maybe he's tired of the double standards in abuse he takes, or maybe his injuries and size have caught up to him. What ever excuse he or the media wants to use, Shaq simply isn't as dominant as he once was and before he gets any worse the Lakers need to get something from him via trade and start building around Kobe.
If it was up to me I would keep Shaq because if it wasnt for him the lakers wouldnt be here in the finals. Shaq could put up 20-10 every night. But due to his injurie Kobe has stepped up. I would keep Shaq even if Kobe is my favorite player. Kobe would want more money every year.
Off topic: I think they should get rid of Gary Payton before worrying about anything else. I don't dislike the man, he just doesn't contribute.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Kobe Krazy:</div><div class="quote_post"> I think they should get rid of Gary Payton before worrying about anything else. I don't dislike the man, he just doesn't contribute.</div> Doesn't contribute? C'mon now! Look at the stats bro: 15 ppg, 5.5 apg during the regular season. Pretty darn good for a 35-yr-old..
Kobe should stay but we gotta get a big man also. even if like you said the centers are gonna detoriate and all that ... championship teams need great centers. Pistons BigBen, Spurs Tim Duncan and all that. The trades possible to trade shaq arent involving good centers. imo that needs to be changed
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Kobe Krazy:</div><div class="quote_post">Off topic: I think they should get rid of Gary Payton before worrying about anything else. I don't dislike the man, he just doesn't contribute.</div> He's a natural born playmaker. I feel and think it's the Triangle that was a huge cause in his poor play. He needs other go to guys, to keep other players involved and create for both them and himself. However going back to the topic at hand. Kobe hands down, Shaq may be dominant but the fact that he's lazy and not fulfilling what he's so far of being capable of. He can do way better than 20 and 10 if he were so "dominant". At least Kobe works well under pressure, is a good overall player, works hard and achieves what he's more than capable of. Shaq is a different story. Off with him.
Did you guys watch the finals? The Lakers was freaking dominated by the pistons except for Shaq, He is the heart and blood of the Lakers. He shoots 60%+ from the field and Kobe he's a good athlete but stats are more important to him then winning. Take game 4 for example Lakers were mounting a comeback thanks to Shaq, they cut their 15 point deficeit to 6. Then what happens Kobe jacks up 3 consecutive 3-point shots(and misses) early in the shotclock that led to fast break opportunites for the pistons. Kobe maybe flashy but he is inconsistant. The Lakers if they get rid of Shaq will be like the Magic, sure the star player scores 30 every night but they lose.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MustardMan:</div><div class="quote_post">granted that in two years, after Shaq is overweight and Ming is burnt out... there won't be any real legit centers left in the NBA.</div> Uhh, in 2 years, Yao Ming will be in his 4th year in the league and he would be 26 years old. How would he be burnt out..?
Everyone thinks that a team can't win without a dominant center...well, in some cases that may be true, but does anyone remember that team in the East called...oh...the Chicago Bulls, or something like that? Sure, they had Jordan and Pippen, but who was their center? Bill Wennington, Luc Longley, Will Perdue, Bill Cartwright, etc...not very impressive in my opinion. Team chemistry and determination wins championships, not some 7 foot guy. Say the Mavs were to trade off Nowitzki and Nash for Shaq (yeah right)...I would think that the Lakers would have a great shot at winning the championship with Nash, Kobe, Nowitzki, Vujacic, Payton and Fisher (possibly Malone if he comes back). Nowitzki is pretty tall, but he can't match up to Shaq, Yao, or Ben...so he's not a dominant center even if his primary position was just that. I even will go on and say that the Pistons could've won the their conference, at the very least, with somone like Elton Brand instead of Big Ben. The Lakers can get alot of talent off of Shaq because teams in the NBA that lack size in the paint will do nearly anything for O'Neal, yet these are the teams that want a ring NOW and aren't looking 4 or 5 years down the road, when Shaq is gone.
The Lakers won their three Ships because of Shaq. The Lakers are what they are today because of Kobe's ignorance. However for now because Shaq's time is up soon you obviously pick the younger Kobe. And for that Kobe, MJ comparison. Jordan had something Kobe never will. People argue Kobe had Shaq but MJ had Pippen, but Shaq was already an established player. Who made Pippen what he was?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting ADubb20:</div><div class="quote_post">The Lakers won their three Ships because of Shaq. The Lakers are what they are today because of Kobe's ignorance. However for now because Shaq's time is up soon you obviously pick the younger Kobe. And for that Kobe, MJ comparison. Jordan had something Kobe never will. People argue Kobe had Shaq but MJ had Pippen, but Shaq was already an established player. Who made Pippen what he was?</div> Actually...Phil Jackson made Pippen who he was, not Jordan. Let's think back to Jordan's early years. He was drafted in 1984...Pippen was drafted in 1987. From 1984-1990, the Bulls didn't win a championship...three of those years, Jordan and Pippen played together. Okay...now to the 1990-91 season, Phil was hired as head coach of the Bulls and bam...Jordan and the Bulls are champs. Two years more, and they have three straight...then Jordan retires, and the rest of the Bulls have no determination and pretty much suck, until Jordan returns. The triangle offense has MJ again, and...the Bulls win three straight again. As this is happening, the Lakers pick up Shaq in 1996, just as they get Kobe the same year in the draft from the Hornets. Okay...Jordan retires again, and Phil takes a year off. The Bulls suck again. Then, Phil comes to Los Angeles in the 1999-2000 season, where Shaq and Kobe have been playing for 3 years together (sounds like Jordan/Pippen), and Phil brings along his triangle offense. Well, deja vu...the Lakers win three straight. Shaq was scoring so much because there were no other centers who could stop him, especially when everything is focused on him (triangle). Kobe ran the triangle...he organized it like Jordan, he found the open man like Jordan, he created his OWN shots like Jordan...but he just wasn't as selfish until recently. Sure, Shaq will score nearly every time...but how about putting O'Neal outside of 10 feet? What does he do? He has no shot, no dribble, no pass, no speed...he becomes the worst player in the league then. Kobe pretty much had to lay down for Shaq, and not by choice. I hate to say this...but it's the same for Payton. I think Payton will play much better next year without the triangle offense, because anything else...whether it's a 1-3-1 or a 2-3...and Payton will be able to focus on his drive and his SG (Bryant). Shaq is far too demanding. For all the zeroes he receives on his paycheck, he doesn't really struggle like everyone thinks. He's huge...he's powerful...and he just stands in a square for 40+ minutes, then goes home to do Nestle Crunch commercials. He's not impressive...he lost all that after he gained all his weight and stopped jumping for rebounds.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MizzMcGrady1:</div><div class="quote_post">Well, i'll keep Kobe any day. Don't get me wrong, Shaq is a great player, but,they're already comparing Kobe @ 25 to Mj @ 25. Kobe is a all around great player.</div> Who ever compares kobe to jordan is Crazy because jordan is the best and always will be and kobe is not even close to beinmg jordan and is not good enough to be compared to jordan i mean kobe i like him he is a great player bu like i said he doesnt deserve to be compared to jordan
".but how about putting O'Neal outside of 10 feet? What does he do? He has no shot, no dribble, no pass, no speed...he becomes the worst player in the league then. Kobe pretty much had to lay down for Shaq, and not by choice." You really can't compare the two like that. Going by that logic, what if Kobe had to play center? What would happen then? He would get annihilated.
