<div class="quote_poster">Quoting realdealbneal:</div><div class="quote_post"> What more does he want, a championship? Yeah, so does every NBA player...and guys like Karl Malone were less fortunate to win one, yet he gave the Jazz 17 or 18 years or so and is still considered one of the greatest players to play the game. Carter can end up like Gary Payton, and complain about winning rather than just being thankful you are one of the best in the league. He can jump to different teams, play with one team for a year, then to another...or, he can respect the Raptors and give them all he's got to bring his trade value back up in hopes that if he did ask for a trade the next time around, Babcock will reason with him. That would be the best thing to do, for not just Vince, but for Toronto.</div> very well said. malone is a great example. he gave the jazz most of his career then moved on. vince has given the raps 6 yrs? really just 4 since he sat out practically 2 whole seasons. these people in here are making it sound like vince has given the team his heart and soul. 6 yrs???? give me a break
maxamillion....u said vince had given 3 years of chance for raptors to win...and blah blah blah how's that? vince was practically injured the whole 2 seasons, so u cant possibly expect them to win without their franchise player. then there is the 03-04 season, i know u guys can talk about how carter had a good come back season with 22-5-5, but mostof the time this guy didn't take charge and lead the team like a franchise player should.....and now he just whines and makes it seem like its none of his fault and that he should move on
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Need4Sheed:</div><div class="quote_post">I doesn't matter anyway, we all know that VC is going to play like a lazy <font color="DarkRed">(edited)</font> this year. I is so upset that he wasn't dealt and will remain a lil cry baby the whole season.</div> Vince averaged 20 4 4 (or 5 5 if u round the numbers). Your calling that lazy? Sure he could do more, but the man wasn't 100% (and probably never will be). I think he puts a good amount of effort every season.
What other superstar would want to star in Toronto for such a long time and get nothing out of it :/ He gave alot to the city (charity games) and was hoping for something good to happen in his career with the raptors, but so for nothing has happened and he wants a trade. I'm sure many of us would also want to be traded if we were in his shoes.
really just 4 since he sat out practically 2 whole seasons. where do you guys get this info!! here it is: 1999 - Rookie season...great year 2000 - Amazing Year, NBA sensation 2001 - Even Better, NBA Superstar 2002 - 1/2 season, incredible, playing great ..... sat out 1/2 of season 2003- Sat out practicallly whole season 2004- missed 9 games but still was pretty good 1 and 1/2 seasons guys.....sorry to be picky but come on....
yeah when I see Vince now I just picture in my head a guy made outa break sticks or somthing hes always getting injured but hopefully the old Vince will be back again or maybe even better ? I still think last season he was a great clutch player msot of the time but not the times when he just fumbled the ball at last possesion
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AirJordan:</div><div class="quote_post">What other superstar would want to star in Toronto for such a long time and get nothing out of it :/ He gave alot to the city (charity games) and was hoping for something good to happen in his career with the raptors, but so for nothing has happened and he wants a trade. I'm sure many of us would also want to be traded if we were in his shoes.</div> i dont understand this mentality one bit. The raptors have been trying to win. their lack of success could be attributed to vince himself. Vince's injuries are hardly the fault of the team. nobody forced him to hold the ASG's...and so what? he's giving the city the ASG's...what has that got to do with anything? he's given to the city so its okay for him to ask for a trade? what kind of logic is that? im sure he is hoping for something good to happen in his career...last time i checked his career is far from over. and no...if i was in his shoes...getting paid a hundred million dollars to play basketball. i would have NOTHING to complain about. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Marcel:</div><div class="quote_post">yeah when I see Vince now I just picture in my head a guy made outa break sticks or somthing hes always getting injured but hopefully the old Vince will be back again or maybe even better ? I still think last season he was a great clutch player msot of the time but not the times when he just fumbled the ball at last possesion</div> what are you talking about? always getting injured? he only got injured once last year and missed 9 games. and whats this about fumbling the ball at the last possession? which games did that happen?
a few the one I remember was against The Hawks I think.. and I meant injured the season before. You know how he missed a whole cripe load of games
yes...but last year he seemed to overcome those injuries and play in every game except for 9. id say thats quite an improvment and hardly worthy of saying "keeps going down with injuries" and no i dont remember one game agains the hawks where he fumbled the ball. i remember when he stepped up and won the game for us agains the hawks with two huge plays and a huge block on terry.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting dj_premium_plus:</div><div class="quote_post">yes...but last year he seemed to overcome those injuries and play in every game except for 9. id say thats quite an improvment and hardly worthy of saying "keeps going down with injuries" and no i dont remember one game agains the hawks where he fumbled the ball. i remember when he stepped up and won the game for us agains the hawks with two huge plays and a huge block on terry.</div> lol yeah that was great or the later game when he drained 2 trays with seconds ticking down to win the game (dont remember who they whre against though) im guessing he fumbled it when they where against the Hawks not to sure but I remember he was going down the left side of the court and playing around wit the ball like he does alot on one-on-one situations and it just bounced off his foot and whent out of bounds. they lost which kinda sucked
[quote name='dj_premium_plus'] and the fan590 is the sports media mecca in toronto? the raptors get good coverage on sportsnet, tsn and GREAT coverage from the score. but lets face it...raptors will always take a back seat to the leafs. welcome to life in toronto...thats how it is. as for the fans hating him, there are still plenty of vince supporters. i loved vince up untill he asked for a trade. if he stays a raptor ill still support him. but iv lost a lot of respect for him thats for sure big assumption and opinion on your part. hardly fact. and wrong again, vince has been one of my fav players for TIME now...im pissed that hes asking to be traded. i think thats pretty understandable why do people keep bringing up what vince did in the passed? its all about what hes doing now. dont you people get it? who cares if he brought the raptors to the 2nd round of the playoffs once. what kind of accomplishment is that??? you'd never hear that brought up as an accomplishment for ANY other player. coming within one shot of the eastern conferance finals is still only making it to the 2nd round. vince is supposed to sit back and watch managment make descisions that might end up being bad for the team. its his job to sit back and take it. he's a player. and a player who is actually dedicated to the city and franchise should stick by the team through thick and thin. raptors stuck by vince when he was out with injuries...soon as raptors hit a speed bump, he wants out. selfish and imature. simple like that exactly. thats why you dont understand 3 yrs? oh well then whoopteedoo!! you make it sound like he's given his heart and soul to the raps. he's not even 30 yet. and if a new coach, a budding superstar, a new gm and a good core of talent isnt enough to motivate a player then what is? a trade should be the last option. vince has plenty to get motivated over in toronto...he's just being a baby
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting CourtVision:</div><div class="quote_post">^Sorry but last time I checked: When you sign a contract you are bound by that contract and under no terms will you be released under that contract unless you want to forfeit the rest of the money you are owed. It's not about submitting to the team, it's about honoring a deal.</div> Ok then what's up with a team trading a player that wants to stay, do you know how many times that happens, Players bring families over, and make the city their home, a month later the coach calls up the player to the office, and says: "sorry but you have been traded, you don't fit well, and felt like we got a good deal for you, i hope you and your wife and kids enjoy your new city." You comment makes no sense, unless you think it is right for a team to trade a player under contract, but a player under contract can't ask for a trade because his team has been on a downfall. Vince wants to leave because he feels like he is not regarded as one of the best players in the league, he puts great stats, but the media still doesn't want him to start in the all star game. Plus I don't see what Toronto has done for Vince Carter, lets face it, Canada is about hockey, the maple leafs will always go first. Its more like how much Vince has done for Toronto, in my opinion if it wasn't for carter, The Raps would just be the grizzlies, if you know what i mean. VC brought fans in, and if it wasn't for him no one would even care about the Raps, the same way no one cared about the Vancouver Grizzlies. If Carter would have stayed with the warriors he still would have been a phenomenal rookie, with amazing hops, and great plays.
Its still a contract. Its written on their contract that the GM can deal them around thats a given. According to you, players would only get traded when they wanted to. Its a tough business, but thats why they get paid so much. They can afford to move. Why would he sign a 6 year contract anyway if he wanted to leave in 3 years? You can't sign a contract and decide to not honour your end of the deal in the middle. Business depends on these contracts. And despite how much money he made the team, it doesn't get rid of the fact that he signed for 6 years. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">If Carter would have stayed with the warriors he still would have been a phenomenal rookie, with amazing hops, and great plays.</div> Carter didn't have the choice to stay, the Warriors wanted to trade him away. And he was a phenomenal rookie with the Raps.
Someone said "wouldn't you do the same thing if you were in Vince's shoes?" LoL. No I would not. I'm a student making 7.50 an hour by working. If I was in Vince's shoes and making the 90 million +endorsements that he's making, plus the atheletic ability and potential he posesses, I would have NOTHING to complain about. Instead, I would use the talent I have to only being greater instead of getting lazy and playing video games more then working at the sport you get paid millions of dollars for. Doctors have to go through years of training and school to make the money they make. vince gets many times the money that a Doctor would make by putting a ball through a hoop. Vince, please, just sit down, shut up and play becuase as of right now, you have absolutely NO trade value. Honestly, Vince will stop complaining once the Raptors start winning games. He already had this "injury" label placed on him before and now he has a "whiny" label over him. Lead the Raptors somewhere and then you'll be recognized for what you're worth and get atleast SOME respect. How dare he ask for a trade when he led the Raptors to 33 wins in the East last year and was often injured the 2 seasons prior to last year's? He has no right to ask for a trade. That's the part that gets me upset. He has done nothing worthy of a "trade proposal" in the last 3 years. And it's not like he won us a championship. "One shot away from ECF" Whoop-dee-do. It'd be one thing if it was "one shot away from winning the Finals", but it's only the 2nd round. You people need to get over that.
Vince has absolutly no trade value right now... to close to none. He wouldn't even be traded for a player like Carlos Arroyo, (not taking anything away from Carlos) but Vince is supposed to be a Franchise player, but he isn't really one anymore. He should try to be 2nd tier to Bosh, but I really don't see that ever happening. The only reason Vince only had 1 injury last year was cause he was a p*ssy. He hardly ever drove, and when he did he RARELY finished strong. He settled for the outside jumper constantly...
okay i been readin this thread and wow, i cant believe what im reading.. who cares what he did in the past? who cares what jordan did then.. michael who? he cant do it anymore.. sooo forget him.. oh and guys like dominique, and spud, and dr j.... forget them.. all the past means nothing now.. RITE?? carter is the best dunker of all time, end of that story... okay put urself in carters shoes... why drive.. why put ur body at risk for a team going no where, or save ur self for another year... its the way he is... ya cuz hes getting paid millions... we all say we would play 100% regardless of the team.. and we all mean it because the opportunity is an unbelivable thing... but ppl in the nba are gifted.. so they take it for granted.. only reason vince had an injury last year was cuz he was a <font color="red">Profanity removed</font>.. ok ... u clearly do not watch raptor games, u just watch hhighlights and if vince doesnt dunk in teh night but still drops 40 points u tink its garbage? man he is a great shooter... if they arent respecting the jay.. light them up... wen they play him tight he does drive.. but no one who follows raptors closely can disagree thats the refs showed him NO RESPECT NO CALLS THE LAKER GAME ... THE JERMAINE ONIEL CRAP.. man its amazing how ppl talk wen they dont even know.. Next season vince wont return, cuz hes been here... and this year was not a bad year.. he is a great shooter, and exceptional driver, but u shoot when you think u have the shot.. some shots may look abd to us but feel good to him.. so thats the way it works.. who cares about what we think.. he wouldnt shoot unless he either thought he could get a good shot off or it was absolutely necessary.... vince dunked on kirlenko, the dunk on atlanta was frigging crazy where he went under diaw.. try to do that .. dats hard with a defender flying at u.. he windmilled a few times, many reverse alleys.. and how about the one with his hand resting on the backboard while he threw it down iwth his right hand.. that dunk is soooooo SICK i dont believe how many ppl missed that.. vince has nothing left to prove as a dunker... mj did not continue to dunk throughout his career.. he drove more and more rarely every year.. just liek carter.. but mj developed a decent shot and i believe carters shot is better than mjs.. when his feet are set hes very good.. if carter had shaq on his team.. think about the weight off his back.. he could shoot knowing shaq was under the rim if he missed.. on toronto.. he shoots knowing if he misses its on him.. no help on offensive boards.. the occasional wierd bounce will be recovered but thats about it. i also recall somoene saying that he did not win any individual battles? hmm orlando game, hit the clutch shot OVER tmac.. against lakers... stepped up big time and put the team on his back and it came down to a bad call to lose the game... i dont recall even seeing much iverson... nor kobe against raptors.. against denver, he dominated carmello.. man many games this season he has stepped up and been player of the game .. he has great battles with other players and ppl who hate on vince hate on him cuz they expect him to jump over someone every game.. if u watch.. when he does attack the basket he gets tripped, hacked, and ripped down.. the coaches say dont let him drive, if he tries.. kill him... and tahts a fact (not necessarily in those exact words) so as i said vince wont be back next year.. cuz hes been here.. 24ppg and 5 5.. are not bad stats at all for a guy who makes great passes that are ALMOST NEVER COMPLETED.. the rare kick to mo pete will pay off. the rare time where bosh owuld make a good cut.. other than that if u saw last season.. carters passes lead to open shots.. just they would not convert.. carter cant do it alone, as no one can.. take away lamar odom from kobe next season.. gaurentee he will flop.. but with lamar to work with.. he will do well <font color="red">Watch the language. -Franchise</font>
I actually happen to live 2 hours away from Toronto, so I saw many of their games. What I saw wasn't the VC of old, and we will never see his old self again that averaged 27 ppg and attacked the rim constantly. His dunks last year weren't as flashy as they were before his multiple injuries. He's almost likea cripple compared to before. Yes, his jumpshot is nice, but he almost ALWAYS settles for the J, which isn't a good thing even if HE thinks it is a good shot. The rare occasion, yes he would attack the rim strong, but not like he used to. I know he has a better J than his rookie year etc, but when an all-time great slasher settles for the J every game, you kinda know somethings not right. The reason MJ didn't dunk as he did before, was because he didn't want to risk ending his career because he was getting old. But he had a post game and some unstoppable moves that were unguardable, so he didnt have to dunk. Vince doesn't have the same arsenal of moves MJ had. The back to the basket fadeaway jumpshot baseline? Unstoppable. Vince has 1 move, but it doesn't always go in. Dribbles to the corner and pulls up fading away from the basket abit. Plus Toronto isn't that bad as you call it allstar44. You're acting as if they're the worst team in the league by far. They're in the EAST! There aren't many good teams in the east besides Miami, Detroit and Indiana. So the Raptors should be doing better than they are doing. Vince is getting most of the blame yes, but he should be getting the blame. He's the Franchise player and when you're given that title, you have to take the responsibility of bringing your A game every night. Not just when you're facing Carmelo, or Kobe or T-Mac. He has to say alright, my teams losing I gotta step it up even more, even though my players aren't stepping up. He's gotta act like a leader. But what happens? Instead of being a leader, he whines to the media that everyones putting the blame on him, and don't correct me on this. I watched Sportsnet news every single day and VC was there whining and talking about how bad his team was, etc. I'm sure any team with a good swingman and big man would do good as you say if VC had Shaq. P.S You say when he drives coaches tell their players to stop him... kill him or w/e. I'm sure that goes for every great slasher in this league. Noone is gonna give you an easy basket.
With all of this criticism coming Vince's way I would not be surprised if he came back and started attacking everyone on the court. Man, this guy is getting killed in the papers and everywhere he goes he is known as an idiot, he has no other choice but to come back and start taking people to school. Now I know this is harder than it looks but really, if he doesn't take his game to another level this year we will see the rapid decline of Vince Carter's career. This is his chance to prove to everyone that he is in the upper echelon of players in the league, right now he is the laughing stock. If he does want out of Toronto, this is the only way it's gonna happen because his trade value is next to nothing right now.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">Vince has absolutly no trade value right now... to close to none. He wouldn't even be traded for a player like Carlos Arroyo, (not taking anything away from Carlos) but Vince is supposed to be a Franchise player, but he isn't really one anymore. He should try to be 2nd tier to Bosh, but I really don't see that ever happening. The only reason Vince only had 1 injury last year was cause he was a p*ssy. He hardly ever drove, and when he did he RARELY finished strong. He settled for the outside jumper constantly...</div> Isn't that better than him missing 30 games in the season
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting R_ChutneY:</div><div class="quote_post">Its still a contract. Its written on their contract that the GM can deal them around thats a given. According to you, players would only get traded when they wanted to. Its a tough business, but thats why they get paid so much. They can afford to move. Why would he sign a 6 year contract anyway if he wanted to leave in 3 years? You can't sign a contract and decide to not honour your end of the deal in the middle. Business depends on these contracts. And despite how much money he made the team, it doesn't get rid of the fact that he signed for 6 years. Carter didn't have the choice to stay, the Warriors wanted to trade him away. And he was a phenomenal rookie with the Raps.</div> If a team can trade a player even if the player wants to stay, then a player can ask for a trade. If the Raps were offered Kobe for Carter obviously it won't happen but they wouldn't hesitate one second, because they want to do what is right for the team, so why can't a player do what is right for himself. Secondly, i never said Carter wanted to play for the Warriors, and neither did i say he wasn't a good rookie, I was to prove that Carter made Toronto what it is, Toronto didn't make him the player he is, He gave to Toronto much more than he received. even if he played for the Warriors he would've been rookie of the year. Plus if a team signs a player for 6 years, he brings his family over and after 3 years they have someone else in sight, they won't hesitate trading him, its all about business, if he wants to do what is best for him, let him. And why you putting words into my mouth, i never said players can only be traded when they want to, can you read? i said if a player can be traded from his team because the manager or whoever doesn't want him any longer, then a player can ask for a trade. It goes both ways. why did the lakers trade Shaq when they signed for more years? because they like kobe better, obviously. I betcha shaq wanted to stay in LA. So if a team can get rid of a player that quick, then a player is allowed to ask for a trade, plus all he's doing is asking, they don't necessarily have to trade him.
