<div align="center"><div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> <font size="3">Penny: No Shaq Costly For Kobe</font></div> <div align="left"><font face="Arial"><font face="Verdana">Long before Kobe Bryant ever attended his high school prom, Penny Hardaway was having personality conflicts with Shaquille O'Neal. It was mostly petty squabbles between a young playmaker and a domineering center.</font> </font></div> <div align="left">Though they were never best friends, Hardaway never wanted O'Neal to leave the Orlando Magic. But when O'Neal signed a free-agent contract with the Los Angeles Lakers before the 1996-97 season, the move was a defining moment for both players and both franchises. And now Hardaway believes that O'Neal's blockbuster trade to the Miami Heat last July will have a similar impact on Bryant and the Lakers. </div> <div align="left">"Shaq is the man," Hardaway said yesterday on the first day of the Knicks training camp at the College of Charleston. "I knew we had to have him to win. Kobe needed him to win. But me and Kobe are two different players. I was more about giving Shaq the ball every time down the floor and then I would look for my shot. </div> </div> [/left] <div align="center">Source</div> This is coming from Penny who had a similar situation with Kobe. Same thing with EJ, when he left Shaq his FG% and 3PT% dropped about 5%-10% and his career was never the same. They never made a team that would ever contend for a title (cept for EJ who was given a second chance). What do you guys think: (a)It will never happen to Kobe (b)Kobe and the Lakers did not learn from history and are doomed to repeat it. Note to mods: Please do not move this to the Lakers or Heat forums. I posted it here so everyone can have a chance to view the thread and put in their 2 pennies. <font color="Red">Pleas only post a couple paragraphs or so of the article. It is against JBB guidelines to post so much of the article, so please only post a couple paragraphs next time. Moo2K4</font>
Penny suffered an injury, also. Hardaway was never as great as Kobe in the first place, and were in the Eastern Conference...avoiding Hakeem and David Robinson. Anyone that compares Kobe to Penny Hardaway needs to be
I really doubt that will happen to Kobe. And I'm not saying that just because I'm a Kobe fan. There is still a possiblility that he might win another championship again but I'm pretty sure his career won't go on a downward spiral like Penny's did after Shaq left. First, Kobe has more will, determination, work ethic then Penny does. But, we won't know, right? Everyone can get injured, it all depends on fate and destiny. I think Kobe is 'destined' enough to lead a team by himself and not get a freak recoccuring injury that will wash his name from 'one of the greatest players' to a an injury-prone, backup player. He is too much of a hard-worker and too skilled to just let his name slip from the next great thing to a washed up player. Just my two cents on it. And oh yeah Penny, way to call Shaq "the man" 8 years after he leaves. I guarantee you if Penny had not been plauged with injuries he would have still had a great career and would not be thinking about Shaq and what coulda woulda shoulda been.
Who knows what might have been. Penny was a great player early in his career. I think he's closer to a Dwayne Wade than Kobe Bryant, as far as his playing style and his role on that team. I do think if Shaq stuck around in Orlando they could have won a championship or two. They probably would have been the best in the East, after 1998. Oh, to answer the question, no I don't think Kobe will suffer the same fate as Penny. The Lakers will continue to be a playoff team in the short-run, and in time (maybe 2 or 3 years) could develop into contenders. I really believe that. I just want to say something about Kobe Bryant "using his leverage" to get Phil and Shaq out of LA. I think that's unfair. Look, Kobe was a free agent. He wasn't duty-bound to stay in LA. It was absolutely his right to test the market and find a place where HE wanted to be. Clearly, he wasn't interested in being second-fiddle on a team. And he wanted a coach who was more flexible and ran the team through him. Totally understandable. Bryant is one of the top 4 players in the league, doesn't he deserve to be THE MAN on his own team? Should he be blamed for it? It's not like he demanded to be traded or refused to play unless Phil was fired and Shaq was booted out. He was a free agent, and it was totally on the Lakers management to choose where they wanted the franchise to go. On a side note, is there anyone on these forums who has Shaq AND Kobe listed as their favorite players? Just wondering.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I just want to say something about Kobe Bryant "using his leverage" to get Phil and Shaq out of LA. I think that's unfair. Look, Kobe was a free agent. He wasn't duty-bound to stay in LA. It was absolutely his right to test the market and find a place where HE wanted to be. Clearly, he wasn't interested in being second-fiddle on a team. And he wanted a coach who was more flexible and ran the team through him. Totally understandable. Bryant is one of the top 4 players in the league, doesn't he deserve to be THE MAN on his own team? Should he be blamed for it? It's not like he demanded to be traded or refused to play unless Phil was fired and Shaq was booted out. He was a free agent, and it was totally on the Lakers management to choose where they wanted the franchise to go.</div> Even though Kobe never came out and said it, it was pretty apparent to everyone in the organisation that if they wanted to keep Kobe, Shaq and Phil would have to go. Kobe could have put his hand up for Phil and Shaq to stay, but he didn't. So I think he shares a large part of the blame for the breakup. I'm not saying that it was right or wrong, cause I can see his view, he didn't wanna be second string, but he definitely had substantial power in what the organisation could have done.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting dimch:</div><div class="quote_post">Even though Kobe never came out and said it, it was pretty apparent to everyone in the organisation that if they wanted to keep Kobe, Shaq and Phil would have to go. Kobe could have put his hand up for Phil and Shaq to stay, but he didn't. So I think he shares a large part of the blame for the breakup. I'm not saying that it was right or wrong, cause I can see his view, he didn't wanna be second string, but he definitely had substantial power in what the organisation could have done.</div> Well, it isn't wrong, so I don't think "blame" is the right word. If went to Laker's management and told them he'd be willing to stay with the ballclub even if they kept Phil and Shaq, it could have worked, but he was absolutely not obligated to do such a thing. He didn't force the Lakers management to get rid of Shaq and Phil. He could have signed with another team. I get pissed off when players under contract make demands from their teams, as if they are the GM or something. But a free agent has every right to choose which team suits him. And since the Lakers wanted him, they had to change the makeup of their team to suit him. Perfectly legit.
I agree, Penny had some injuries that never let him develop, he was special. He was also probably a "shooting point guard" but definitely one with a passing and playmaking ability, losing Shaq as a target hurt Penny. Kobe is really a scorer. He doesn't create for others much or make them better around him, at least at this point in his career. Without Shaq, he'll have more chances to shoot, and will excel. I expect career high numbers across the board for him. The Lakers won't be as good of a team though. I also think we should leave the blame game behind, and look forward to what is about to happen in one month. It's Fantastic!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting SunshineRain:</div><div class="quote_post">I agree, Penny had some injuries that never let him develop, he was special. He was also probably a "shooting point guard" but definitely one with a passing and playmaking ability, losing Shaq as a target hurt Penny. Kobe is really a scorer. He doesn't create for others much or make them better around him, at least at this point in his career. Without Shaq, he'll have more chances to shoot, and will excel. I expect career high numbers across the board for him. The Lakers won't be as good of a team though. I also think we should leave the blame game behind, and look forward to what is about to happen in one month. It's Fantastic!</div> Problem is, thats a double edged sword. Untill the Lakers actually step out there & start playing, you can just as easily say that Bryant not making others better and not not creating opportunities for others will wind up being a hinderance to the Lakers ultimatly. Its been proven time and time again that you can be the best player in the league, but if you try to go it alone you arnt going to go very far.
