<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">Oh most definitely, he is overrated. His defense is terrible, no matter how many Defensive 1st Teams he's won. He's worse than McGrady, even though the Magic were completely out of the playoffs by their 20th game of the year last season. McGrady is more clutch, even if his clutch performance against the Rockets is quite possibly his first true clutch performance ever. Kobe doesn't pass the ball to anyone, although his assists per game is over 7.0. Kobe doesn't put out any effort for his team, yet he hasn't given up on the Lakers, who have been led by Kobe to a record over .500. Okay... *sarcasm button off* Is Kobe overrated? No way.</div> said it before i'll say it again. ANYONE CAN GET 7 ASSISTS PER GAME WHEN THEY HAVE THE BALL 90% OF THE TIME. What else can he do? Take another bad shot lowering his fg% even more below 40% or pass the ball. The plays run through him. Stats look good, but dont show the hole story. Kobe is overrated. Tell me one other supposedly "elite" player thats shooting under 40% from the field.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">Stats look good, but dont show the hole story.</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe is overrated. Tell me one other supposedly "elite" player thats shooting under 40% from the field.</div> That stat looks bad, but doesn't show the whole story.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">Sonics... they are a very beatable team. They seem to me right now winning by fluke. The suns and sactown are great regular season teams, but when the playoffs roll around they will both break down... guaranteed. So that leaves 3 teams to contend with.</div> why are they any more "built for the regulare season" than the lakers? The Lakers arent an especially good defensive team. They dont have any dominant big guys...or even above average big men. The suns, sonics and lakers are all teams that will struggle in the playoffs. Kobe will be crushed by the defence. He's already struggling from the field and this is just the regular season. I'm not hating on him, or on the Lakers, but they've got their work cut out for them if they plan on making the playoffs. I predict... 1. Spurs 5. Wolves 2. Suns 6. Nuggets 3. Mavs 7. Rockets 4. Kings 8. Sonics
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">why are they any more "built for the regulare season" than the lakers? The Lakers arent an especially good defensive team. They dont have any dominant big guys...or even above average big men. The suns, sonics and lakers are all teams that will struggle in the playoffs. Kobe will be crushed by the defence. He's already struggling from the field and this is just the regular season. I'm not hating on him, or on the Lakers, but they've got their work cut out for them if they plan on making the playoffs. I predict... 1. Spurs 5. Wolves 2. Suns 6. Nuggets 3. Mavs 7. Rockets 4. Kings 8. Sonics</div> I'm not even going to bother with that list...haha.
If you compare Mcgrady's play to Kobe's play you will see that even with Yao Ming Mcgrady is still not getting as many assist as Kobe, or rebs, or steals. Kobe and him are stilled tied in scoring. So who would you take if you were about to start a team Tracy or Kobe.
Duhh... Kobe2mike, the offense runs through YAO MING not T-Mac. In L.A the offense runs through Kobe Bryant and only Kobe Bryant. Whoever else tries to take it without his permission gets an earful from Kobe, and probably Rudy T, "the player's coach." Since your comparing T-Macs assissts with Yao against Kobe's.. where was Kobe's so called non-ballhogging 7 apg when he had Shaq. I guess T-Mac is suffering from the same dilemma??? Do you wanna point it out to me kobe2mike.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">Duhh... Kobe2mike, the offense runs through YAO MING not T-Mac. In L.A the offense runs through Kobe Bryant and only Kobe Bryant. Whoever else tries to take it without his permission gets an earful from Kobe, and probably Rudy T, "the player's coach." Since your comparing T-Macs assissts with Yao against Kobe's.. where was Kobe's so called non-ballhogging 7 apg when he had Shaq. I guess T-Mac is suffering from the same dilemma??? Do you wanna point it out to me kobe2mike.</div> I will. When Shaq received the ball, he created his own shot every time. Payton/Kobe/whoever passes to Shaq, and he stands for about 3 seconds, starts to back in, throws an elbow or two, fakes, and goes up with it and either gets fouled, misses or dunks it.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">That stat looks bad, but doesn't show the whole story. </div> why doesnt that stat show the hole story???? assists dont show the story because the ball is in his hands soo much he's bound to make a few good passes for baskets. BECAUSE the ball is in his hands for 90% of the offensive set. Thats why he's leading the league in turnovers. The good comes with the bad when you're dominating the ball all game. His FG% is an accurate representation of his shooting. Even with the offensive weapons arround him (Odom, Butler) he's still having a hard time scoring with any efficiency. He's getting keyed in on because the other team knows he dominates the ball...everyones watching him, waiting for him to throw up an ill advised shot...or drive the basket hoping for a ref to give him 2 free throws because he's Kobe Bryant. (Also leading the league in free throws attempted). He's inefficient....bottom line. He needs to let the offense flow through some more people cause come playoff time his one pony show is gunna fall flat.
and ya to the laker fans.... mavs 3rd, wolves 5th. i feel the Mavs are the better team, they're certainly deeper and arent as suseptable to injuries. Sprewells been having some hard times as of late, but overall the Wolves are playing pretty good. I feel however that they're gunna slump a bit. KG will be carrying his weight but Cassell and Sprewell will fall off. The mavs have been a very good away team, if they can keep that up, and start playing better at home they should stay on track. Why is it so odd to see the Mavs above the wolves??? You know the Mavs are ahead in the standings right now dont you? Why is it so hard to believe they're going to maintain that till playoffs?
Mr.Wade, I don't know if it would be just the ball running through Yao or also the fact that Houston plays boring slow basketball, and don't really shoot well as a team, but the pace is slower in Houston as opposed to many other teams, and they're not that good defensively, just boring. Tmac is still on 5.5 which has been his average the last 3 seasons, so I don't see the problem? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I will. When Shaq received the ball, he created his own shot every time. Payton/Kobe/whoever passes to Shaq, and he stands for about 3 seconds, starts to back in, throws an elbow or two, fakes, and goes up with it and either gets fouled, misses or dunks it.</div> , but you could also throw the ball down to Shaq 1-2 times a game and have him dunk it for an easy assist, but it's pretty hard to just catch and shoot with Shaq since he doesn't really "shoot", it's like a one hand chuck.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">I will. When Shaq received the ball, he created his own shot every time. Payton/Kobe/whoever passes to Shaq, and he stands for about 3 seconds, starts to back in, throws an elbow or two, fakes, and goes up with it and either gets fouled, misses or dunks it.</div> you can not compare T-mac's numbers with Kobe's and say that kobe's better because he gets more assists. TELL ME YOU GUYS KNOW THAT ITS JUST CAUSE HE'S ALWAYS GOT THE BALL. come on, you cant be that blind can you
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">you can not compare T-mac's numbers with Kobe's and say that kobe's better because he gets more assists. TELL ME YOU GUYS KNOW THAT ITS JUST CAUSE HE'S ALWAYS GOT THE BALL. come on, you cant be that blind can you </div> I agree with ya all along man. Although I think Kobe is the best SG in the league now I still think that he's overrated. Why? Because they, mostly the Lakers fans, think that Kobe is not only the best SG but best all around player in the league. I mean the #1 player in NBA. I think the Lakers fans worship Kobe.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">I will. When Shaq received the ball, he created his own shot every time. Payton/Kobe/whoever passes to Shaq, and he stands for about 3 seconds, starts to back in, throws an elbow or two, fakes, and goes up with it and either gets fouled, misses or dunks it.</div> then wanna tell me how Wade gets so many assists to Shaq? Could it be because he WANTS to pass to him, and WANTS to be unselfish and create for others including Shaq.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">then wanna tell me how Wade gets so many assists to Shaq? Could it be because he WANTS to pass to him, and WANTS to be unselfish and create for others including Shaq.</div> Sure, I'll tell you why. Shaq has lost weight. Shaq has a higher vertical. Therefore, he can jump. If he would've done this in Los Angeles, we would've seen him go up for lobs. You see it for yourself...Wade throws lobs to Shaq, and he EASILY climbs to get them. That's an assist. And it happens alot. Plus, from the Heat games I've seen, most ALL of Wade's assists come from Shaq. In LA, that wasn't the case for Kobe. The triangle was designed for Kobe and Shaq, and the gist of it was to get the ball inside to Shaq, and then use the two scoring threats to put the ball in the whole...pretty much meaning for one of them to create for the other. It wasn't a problem, obviously...but Shaq didn't immediately shoot after the pass was thrown, because he was supposed to draw defenders...correct??? I've heard that millions of times in regards to Kobe having it easy in LA. If Shaq was supposed to draw defenders, then the pass from Kobe was no longer an assist...and that's the reason why 3/4 of Kobe's passes to Shaq didn't turn out to be an assist.
^ but if shaq is *supposed* to draw defenders...that would mean that him having the ball isnt to score, but to get other people open. Shaq wouldnt get the pass...wait to get more defenders on him and then try to score, he passes it back out...thus making it easier for Kobe. The system in Miami isnt much different. sometimes shaq gets the ball with the intent on him taking a FG other times its to allow someone else an easier shot. your scenerio was just on set plays, and only some of the time. It really is a moot point. End of the day Shaq's making another player better and Kobe's turnovers and FG% are horrible. I still maintain my original statement "show me another elite player in the league that shoots below 40% from the field"
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">^ but if shaq is *supposed* to draw defenders...that would mean that him having the ball isnt to score, but to get other people open. Shaq wouldnt get the pass...wait to get more defenders on him and then try to score, he passes it back out...thus making it easier for Kobe. The system in Miami isnt much different. sometimes shaq gets the ball with the intent on him taking a FG other times its to allow someone else an easier shot. your scenerio was just on set plays, and only some of the time. It really is a moot point. End of the day Shaq's making another player better and Kobe's turnovers and FG% are horrible. I still maintain my original statement "show me another elite player in the league that shoots below 40% from the field"</div> Okay, how about you show me another elite player in the league that has a new coach and is the only returning starter for his team? Then I'll see how well that player is shooting with his new offense and new teammates, and new coach...and then look at his assists and rebounding and see if they are career highs.
RealDeal that isn't a good excuse though, just look at when Tmac made the transition from Toronto to Orlando, none of his old teammates [except Dee Brown who played like 5 games], a new coach, new system, and came from having hardly any defensive pressure to being double teamed and having lots of defensive pressure. Even that Magic team wasn't the same, they just traded Ben and Chucky, and also traded Maggette to the Clippers, lost Ron Mercer as an FA, see what I'm saying here? Players in the NBA really shouldn't take that long to "adjust" to their team and teammates. Kobe is just not handling the one man role like some thought he would, I don't think we can say it's having a new team etc etc for the whole year, okay pre-season yes, first 5 games go by, yes, but 20+ games into the season, we can't keep saying the same things.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">Sure, I'll tell you why. Shaq has lost weight. Shaq has a higher vertical. Therefore, he can jump. If he would've done this in Los Angeles, we would've seen him go up for lobs. You see it for yourself...Wade throws lobs to Shaq, and he EASILY climbs to get them. That's an assist. And it happens alot. Plus, from the Heat games I've seen, most ALL of Wade's assists come from Shaq. In LA, that wasn't the case for Kobe. The triangle was designed for Kobe and Shaq, and the gist of it was to get the ball inside to Shaq, and then use the two scoring threats to put the ball in the whole...pretty much meaning for one of them to create for the other. It wasn't a problem, obviously...but Shaq didn't immediately shoot after the pass was thrown, because he was supposed to draw defenders...correct??? I've heard that millions of times in regards to Kobe having it easy in LA. If Shaq was supposed to draw defenders, then the pass from Kobe was no longer an assist...and that's the reason why 3/4 of Kobe's passes to Shaq didn't turn out to be an assist.</div> WHAT??? what kind of excuse is this??? So what are you saying? Shaq couldn't jump before? If you are over 7'0", you don't even have to jump that high. I see in a lot of Shaq's highlight videos, actually a lot of lob passes are thrown to Shaq...What are you trying to say? Sounds to me like you're blaming Shaq (once again) for Kobe's low assist numbers in the past...That's lame..
What you guys are saying doesnt make sense. Its like saying Jason Kidds not good and the only reason he gets so many assists is because he has the ball i nhis hands all the time. Should we take away Jason Kidds greatness? Because he has the ball in his hands all the time. Cmon you give Kidd credit for it you have to give other players credit for it.
