<div class="quote_poster">Quoting jzblaze:</div><div class="quote_post">Hey but dont you think Dunleavy's had his chance all year to prove what he can offer? Even when they were losing a lot he was kept out there. But I totally agree with you Zarko is not a starter. He's a great guy to come in off the bench and provide instant scoring when there's a mismatch.</div> He's really too passive to be there when you need it, but all that can change. I mean he may not be as athletic as Rashard Lewis but he could very well break out like him with a little more strength, confidence and killer instinct. He's deceptively quick with the ball because he gets that first step going and he's fluid in his shot and ballhandling mechanics. He plays smart, but he doesn't do enough to be noticed for a guy with high expectations coming out of college. I, like others, don't feel he is the real problem lately (mainly, because he's stopped flopping and playing all soft and missing wide open midrange shots and he's playing Peja well and learning how to guard the wide range of forwards out there). If there is somebody better that will offer similar team skills, is stronger, faster, can play better defense and won't be like a high volume cancer like some of the other forwards in the league, I'd be happy to replace Dunleavy. If Mullin wouldn't, I'd be pissed. But since there is not and only potential rather than results, Dunleavy is a safe guy that neither adds that many +'s or -'s unless he's having one of those games where he just happens to find a favorable mismatch to exploit and goes on a tear. Matchups are the key and Dunleavy seems more like a utility player best matched up against slower forwards or weaker guards. At least he's not playing so weak anymore and not letting all these guys hit three pointers right in his face like earlier this year and last year. Embarassing.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting custodianrules2:</div><div class="quote_post">Hey Jzblaze, welcome. I may have to break my reply down one piece at a time so I can come back to it later. But first, I agree with everything you said about not being shy in admitting there are aspects of the Warriors game that are mediocre to horrible, especially on the defensive end where we've let easy layups and scoring runs amount with very little effort to alter shots either because lack of communication, effort, awareness, or lateral movement. Emotional attachments and accepting anything less than 100% effort/skill on defense is a trap within itself as much as failing to have continuity in our roster (ex: I don't think we should trade Murphy even if we could for a player like Tyson Chandler since he's basically got no offense and is chronically injured more than Murphy gets). Since the Warriors have rediscovered/gained their identity after acquiring Baron Davis, they should try to keep as many players that made the team successful as much as possible... with upgrades made to improve the team along the way. The problem we have is wondering whether Cohan will keep on spending, will spending be wise so that we're not stuck in salary cap hell like the Knicks, and whether the new CBA allows more flexibility to go in the direction we want to. Right now some of us are in Jeff Van Gundy mode. Glad we're winning, but we're not as perfect of a lineup as we can be, so it's like we're never happy until we win it all (yeah, first things first, let's make the playoffs first...). If we keep Murphy or Dunleavy or Foyle that's fine, but if there's a way to improve our starting lineup so it's as tough as the Spurs/Pistons defense and alternatively plays a solid role on offense, heck we'll all be happier. I think Troy Murphy can improve his inside scoring game, that's not the real issue. I think the real issue is whether he'll pick up the intensity on defense and whether he'll be healthy/athletic enough to do so. He doesn't provide intimidation when guarding the basket, he doesn't alter shots the way an elite big should, and he doesn't play the best help defense when Adonal is getting outmatched. I do think Troy is great at what he does, providing solid rebounding, good hands and good spot shooting from anywhere on the court. And that's great to have, but not starting material when we do make the playoffs. If the Pistons still had Mehmet Okur at starting center/forward and not Rasheed Wallace, the game would have ended up differently for them because they could not stop the flow of points from the other team or run out as quickly (This is interesting: Murphy can run the floor well for his size, he just can't jump or move very quickly going laterally. Was this Jason Richardson at one time when it comes to moving laterally?). Anyway, it seemed that Rasheed Wallace's scoring was not that much of a factor in the game, it was his all around defensive game that helped out the team. So why are we so anxious and concerned after playing so well lately? I'll tell you why: It's like now we're pressured to go further to make up for lost time in the playoffs... to do this right, we're going to make the most use of this window of opportunity given to us before we start locking up players to compete in the playoffs for the next couple of seasons (unless we fail to make it for some reason, knock on wood). We see that Dunleavy is a glue guy (great courtvision, passing, a coach's son), a player who can do a lot of things, just none of them extremely well, yet. I don't even know if the guy is being used right or if he can compete as well as defensive players like Utah's swingmen Matt Harpring or Raja Bell. He's definitely not a slacker on D, he's just really slow footed for the wing position and that's a huge problem when you have murphy inside and making big $$$. "Who stays and who goes?" some people ask because it just doesn't seem to fit right now when your frontcourt is arguably either the slowest or the softest inside on the defensive end. When only one guy can shoot the ball on offense, it only makes sense that all 5 guys be at least average to above average defenders in order to play great team defense since everybody has to play defense (For example: Spurs: Parker, Ginobli, Bowen, Duncan, Robinson good to great defenders Pistons: Billups, Hamilton, Prince, Wallaces, good to great defenders). Dun showed signs of becoming awesome at power forward and decent in defending the post, but he'll have to prove he's the future starter to set the tone on both ends of the floor at small forward. That we'll have to wait and see and hope next season he can be consistent and then make the decision at the end of the season and let the market set the price. I just hope Mullin doesn't play favorites and that he lets talent and impact decide whether he belongs. Otherwise, it looks like hes' trying to make his own throwback to his time when slow athletes could be impact players in the nba (yeah cuz those guys could shoot from anywhere consistently and had enough defensive presence to outweight their lack of results on the defensive end). In fact that's the reason why I like the Eastern European players is because they are highly athletic, very long, and have great fundamentals with the potential to play great D. Not to bash slow wing/guard players, but I just think they're very limited in what they can do when the other guy they are guarding is running circles around them and swatting shots. Unless the guy is a beast in terms of strength or a guy that always runs at full speed, but plays smart and anticipates, or shoots the lights out at 50% and scores 30 points a game, it's hard to really fall in love with players that are substandard in the NBA level of strength, size, or athleticism. One of the three can be improved upon greatly to improve defense, but when you're getting beat, you better hope the other guy is fast enough to move out of position to help out (which Foyle is not anymore, Dunleavy isn't, Murphy isn't). You also mentioned Pietrus. He's a shooting guard, but plays so raw they make him a forward because a shooting guard is supposed to pass and act like a second point guard. He's got the most potential for a player who is often streaky and has really awful awareness in team defense and offensive sets. He'll have his moment to prove himself, just not now while Dunleavy is still the man being evaluated. We're already seeing improvement now, but he is an open court player and a one-on-one type of player. I also get annoyed by Barnett when it comes to his remarks on Pietrus or Dunleavy because he gets bombastic when it comes to pumping Dunleavy's skill and he's really anal when it comes to Pietrus. Pietrus is fine where he is for the time being with his delicate shoulder injury and the way he loves to drive to the hoop and go left. I gotta say I disagree with Monty being out. I think he was chosen to be the future Larry Brown. Okay maybe I'm over-hyping him, but I think he's a very special coach in that he doesn't let his ego come into play like other failed college coaches. He's a listener, a player's coach, and pragmatic about what he does. Obviously, a coach tries to win as much as he can, but he knows this is a period of learning where he must understand the competition being thrown at him in the NBA, he must know his player's game individually, and he must know how his lineups will act under certain situations. Now I find it curious that Monty would sit Dunleavy in the 4th quarters some times just like Musselman would. Same goes with Pietrus not getting enough playing time (but you could say shoulder injury is a major cause of concern as Pietrus will be a key reserve later on or a future starter). I think Monty is aware of what we are aware of, but there's certain front office politics that are in play and a committment to finding that balance of trying to win and have the team gain confidence, grow the team as one, and developing young talent to keep improving the roster for our own use or in a future trade.</div> Yeah i would definitely agree that Monty's lack of ego is a great asset. I might be a little hasty on Monty but I really dont like his game management. We've lost a lot of close games and the ones we did win could have been a lot easier. He doesn't have too much experience with coaching athletic players, his teams succeeded in spite of their athleticism and not because of it. ANd I really can't change my mind based on anything happening with the rest of this season. It's a lot easier when you're not contending for a playoff spot. I think the beginning of next year will be big for him and the team. How many times have we done well at the end of the year after being eliminated from playoff contention? But I will keep a more open mind on him.
nevermind I give up on Monty, he doesn't have a clue. Because of foul trouble I may get to see my boy Pietrus excite the crowd.
i know how this ends, he'll bring Fish in for Pietrus. Fish will jack some shots up and then game over.
I dunno time will tell. It's your opinion, meng. I think at one point we were successful with the small ball lineup, but not against Finley, Howard, Terry, Nowitzki. Actually Monty did kept Pietrus in and he was flying. I like that kid. He's instant energy and nobody moves as quickly as he does at that size. I'm not upset because I saw Dunleavy throw his jersey into the crowd and show some emotion while getting tossed from the game! I've been waiting to see Dunleavy get angry and show some fire all season and now I hope the team helps chip in to pay for that fine Man my face and sides hurt from all that laughing I did when I saw it.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting custodianrules2:</div><div class="quote_post">I dunno time will tell.</div> aight can u honestly digest this game and tell me that Dunleavy and Zarko should be playing more than Pietrus? He created most of those shots on his own and the thing is he did it WHEN THEY NEEDED IT. He changed the momentum once again. You can bring up the negative that he forces it sometimes but DFish makes way more mental mistakes than him and is just terrible at d. Jason Terry was abusing him off the dribble. Damn Van Horn and even Devin Harris went off. Well after this game he'll get notice in the league. And they will try to sign him away. He wouldn't have had this opportunity to showcase his talents only because Dun got thrown out. Although I have to admit I wanted Dun to throw his jersey in the crowd but I remember that uncomfortably. Anyways, dont get caught up in stats, with Pietrus, Bdiddy, and Jrich we got peeps who can make plays. On another note Zarko is crappy at d. I dont see how u can watch that game and still want Dunleavy gettin all those minutes over Pietrus. It was plain as hell what the talent disparity was.
Jzblaze, I wouldn't panic. I don't think Mullin is dumb enough to let one of his more valuable draft pieces go to another team. The guy is explosive and energetic no doubt about it. But there's definitely a solid reason behind why guys like Musselman/Montgomery would leave him out too late. He's a double edged sword. But he will earn more playing time because he was getting to the rim, something we have a problem doing and he's showing skills in grabbing steals and rebounds. So I don't know if you're venting right now because your fave player got shafted for minutes or you're challenging my stance or what? Zarko obviously got more time because we needed a center, Rodney White got some minutes at power forward and small forward hoping to pound the ball inside. Our centers all were in foul trouble and we don't really have much depth in the big man department so we played more of Zarko at center. Plus you don't want Tskita to play center, that guy sucks even worse on defense. good game from Pietrus though 22 points. The guy you should be mad at is Fisher, even though he did okay tonight. Fisher takes away Pietrus' minutes because he plays too much like a shooting guard and as a coach you can't take away the nod for your veterans. That just causes trouble. I'm hoping we can move Fisher eventually... (Reason: Guy gets left in the dust when it comes to quicker guards, I hate the point guard not being able to contain their assignments when they have the ball, esp because our inside defense can't save him)
One game v Dallas is just that,pretty much everyone of the main guys has had ups and downs,even J Rich and Baron. I am leaning to the view that this goup,including Monty,is competitive now with the best of the west. Until I see another W average 11 boards,I don't want to dump Murph,I remember him being quicker and I think he will get some of it back. Murph,and Pietrus,got a lot of raw deals from the refs as new guys and overcompensated. An often overlooked skill is playing the refs. I am not high on Magliore but the guy deserves an Oscar for his portrayal of the innocent victim,when he's usually fabricating the fouls. Some times he's so into that "game" he forgets real basketball. At SF,Dunleavy,Pietrus,and Zarko are all a lot different,and none is the "classic" SF. The W's are doing pretty good at mixing them in,giving different styles,matchups. As to Mullin and Dunleavy,Dunleavy was projected as a player with skills much like Mullin,passing,3pt shot,game smarts. What hasn't always been there is Mullin's execution. I see Dunleavy ideally as a 6th man,a role that could make his versatility an assett. At this point,Cheaney and Shika are expiring contracts. I'm pretty sure White's deal was extended before he left Denver. The W's will have to consider whether he rates a roster spot and if not,then it's a question of moving him. Dunleavy is in a similar spot contract wise,and also at a crossroads as a player and as to his role. While dealing some guys would be real difficult, the only issue with Dunleavy is whether the deal makes us better. I'm not sure what Dunleavy's market value is. Hypothetically,say we coul get a pick middle of rd 1-do we take it with maybe Danny Granger or Hakim Warrick in mind? Because Murphy has a sizable contract,we'd need to get a guy with a pretty big contract back-or apply the trade exemption which could let us take a lower $ player if the other team isn't capped....or whatever,which is to say,a bit complicated
It's bit funny. We ragged about Murphy's defense. But, when he wasn't there, who's the next best pf defender? Richardson and Pietrus... I do think either Murphy will eventually have to be replaced with better pf or we get better center with post up games, because we live and die with 3's, and if 3 doesn't fall, we really don't have much options left like we saw in Dallas game. But, like Dallas game, without Murphy, we are really in a bad shape, so until we actually get that upgrade (or we have to get rid of some salary desperately), we need Murphy...
hahah just venting, not challenging your stance at all. you know I respect your opinion. But I'm having a hard time figuring out what Monty is trying to do. Offensive and defensive sets? Honestly are there really any? All they do is pentrate in order to jack up threes. Their defense is terrible and without any sort of accountability. And why do u wait to put Pietrus in at the end of the 3rd and down 13 already. He had 10 in 12 minutes in the first.
Why do you guys point the finger at lack of D when you look at the box score and see that Davis (7-20), JRich (5-17) and Fish shot like crap. The shot selection was atrocious. The first five shots after half were 3s. If the W's had just executed like the start of the game, they would have been fine. Once they got behind, the Mavs just dared them to continue to shoot from the outside and the Warriors obliged. Even Pietrus, he shot 8-10 inside the arc, that should tell you where he should be shooting the ball. Once Dunleavy got tossed, the Warriors were seriously undermanned at the 4 spot and Nowitzki ate it up and got all of the superstar calls. This was one game, not a big deal.
Van Horn getting 24 on 8-11 is what killed us. It aint no thing for Nowitski to drop 29. And 10 out of 13 shots in the paint is good.
Davis not shooting well or we living and dying on 3 are nothing new, and we played like that after Davis was traded. We couldn't run like 1st quarter because Mavs made an adjustment, and when our 3 wasn't falling, we simply had no answer after that. And sadly, it's also nothing new that yet another role PF role player got 20+ pts with 50% and another superstar PF completely dominating us. This problem has to be solved as soon as possible, because we can't keep dodging the bullet after bullet and hope to win many ball games. Sure, it's just one game, but when a person keep vomiting blood day after day, can you say "er, it's just one day"? This game showed that after Murphy and Dunleavy (when they aren't known for their defense to begin with), our two 6-6 SGs are better option to defend all-star PF then any of our existing forwards, and at the same time another role playing PF just went ahead and raped us with 8-11 shooting night...
