Very interesting clause in LeBron's $90 million Nike contract

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">I fail to see how the Knicks have a better supporting cast, especially since getting Redd in Cleveland is a real possibility right now. With Ilgauskas and Gooden, that would be a much better team than anything the Knicks could offer.</div>
Well that's just media specualtion equivelent to "the writers in NY" as you would put it. I don't remember him saying "I want to go to Cleveland." In fact, I remember him saying I want to be a Buck and finish my career here. Big Z and the Cavs are miles from an agreement there is a good possibility he will leave. You're talking about Gooden, Big Z and LeBron being a good trip which it is. But you do remember these are the same players that couldn't get them into the playoffs.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I suppose you mean Marbury, who has a ton of talent but has never taken his team beyond the first round of the playoffs and doesn't make his teammates better. Or maybe you mean Crawford who has the same reptutation as being a "me first, shoot first player". I don't think that's the kind of situation LeBron is looking for.</div>
Well Marbury hasn't been put in the most ideal situations throughout his career. He was with a young Timberwolves team, an injury riddled Nets team, he helped the Suns out, but they couldn't beat the NBA champs, and now he's with the injury riddled Knicks is his team. For a long time, KG never got his team out of the first round either. Give Marbury a decent supporting cast and I think he can take a team far. Marbury doesn't make his teammates better much because he is a very talented offensive player. He is a great scorer and is more of a shooting guard playing PG. Crawford is a very good playmaker he just rarely gets time at the 1. He plays shooting guard which is not his natural position and many times his ill-advised shots are due to him being at a disadvantage from playing bigger and stronger players. Well LeBron is a very talented player and makes everyone around him better. He can doesn't have to wait for someone to make others better. He can do it himself.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">It's also ridiculous to think that a team wouldn't want LeBron because it might ruin their chemistry.</div>
I think he means that they have their core set already. Gordon, Hinrich, Deng, Chandler, and Curry are the core. Also in NY, he can become the King of the greatest city in the world. He wouldn't have to share the spotlight with Kobe in LA, or Gordon in Chicago. NY will be all his.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Well that's just media specualtion equivelent to "the writers in NY" as you would put it. I don't remember him saying "I want to go to Cleveland." In fact, I remember him saying I want to be a Buck and finish my career here. Big Z and the Cavs are miles from an agreement there is a good possibility he will leave. You're talking about Gooden, Big Z and LeBron being a good trip which it is. But you do remember these are the same players that couldn't get them into the playoffs.
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They didn't make the playoffs but they were definitely closer than New York was. Remember that they only lost on a tiebreaker. They are basically one solid player away from being a good team. Cleveland is much, much closer to a playoff birth than New York is. I'm sure most people will agree with me on this.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">
Marbury doesn't make his teammates better much because he is a very talented offensive player. He is a great scorer and is more of a shooting guard playing PG.
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This does not make much sense. Just because you're a talented offensive player, doesn't mean that you can't make your teammates better. Garnett, Nash, Duncan (among others) are all very talented offensive players and yet can still make their teammates better. LeBron himself played out of position last year at pg and still made his teammates better.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">
Crawford is a very good playmaker he just rarely gets time at the 1. He plays shooting guard which is not his natural position and many times his ill-advised shots are due to him being at a disadvantage from playing bigger and stronger players.
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Crawford has always put up ill-advised shots, whether it's with New York or Chicago. He's a career .397 shooter, which is mediocre. There's a reason he was replaced with Hinrich and traded to New York - he puts up bad shots and doesn't play defense.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">
I think he means that they have their core set already. Gordon, Hinrich, Deng, Chandler, and Curry are the core. Also in NY, he can become the King of the greatest city in the world. He wouldn't have to share the spotlight with Kobe in LA, or Gordon in Chicago. NY will be all his.</div>

From what I can tell, LeBron would rather win than worry about being in the spotlight. And even if he did go to New York, where would he play? Crawford and Houston are locked up to long-term contracts and you would be hard-pressed to find any team to take them. Point guard is obviously out of the question too.

 

Lebron's too classy for that kind of thing and he'll probably see more money than he'll ever know what to do with besides the soda pop, bubble gum, and shoe contracts he'll get. If Dan Gilbert and his new GM put him in a position where there's too much pressure on him and it's just not very enjoyable to play basketball because of the team they build around him, he might just sign elsewhere. Dan Gilbert better not jack it up because even though the Cavs went on a losing streak, firing Paul Silas seemed a little bit suspect to me. Doesn't anyone feel that way like he shouldn't have been fired?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">They didn't make the playoffs but they were definitely closer than New York was. Remember that they only lost on a tiebreaker. They are basically one solid player away from being a good team. Cleveland is much, much closer to a playoff birth than New York is. I'm sure most people will agree with me on this.</div>
I don't remember Cleveland having injury problems like New York did. Also NY is one solid player away from making the playoffs. That solid player was injured almost the whole season. I don't think they're much much closer to the playoffs than NY is. I mean, last year NY made it and Cleveland sat home too.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">This does not make much sense. Just because you're a talented offensive player, doesn't mean that you can't make your teammates better. Garnett, Nash, Duncan (among others) are all very talented offensive players and yet can still make their teammates better. LeBron himself played out of position last year at pg and still made his teammates better.
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I should have clarified this more. Marbury's scoring is vital to the Knicks success. Marbury is a scorer by nature and he doesn't dish as much because he can make the same shots as his teammates. He feels more confident in himself than he does his teammates. Also I should have said this earlier. Marbury does make his teammates better. I changed my mind. I just realized what I said was wrong. He makes Kurt Thomas better (especially in the pick and roll), he certainly has helped Tim Thomas reach his career high in 3 point percentage. He also does manage to dish out 8 assists per game. I know at times Marbury could pass more, but he is not as selfish as many people think. Also when Van Horn was in NY, Marbury was making him look like a superstar.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Crawford has always put up ill-advised shots, whether it's with New York or Chicago. He's a career .397 shooter, which is mediocre. There's a reason he was replaced with Hinrich and traded to New York - he puts up bad shots and doesn't play defense.</div>
When Crawford was in Chicago he was playing PG until the last year. When he was playing PG. The only reason why Hinrich replaced him was because of the motorcycle accident that happened to Jay Williams. They had no idea what was going to happen to him so Hinrich was insurance. When Crawford was playing PG, he shot a little bit higher at 41% but still, he did take bad shots. I think he could have controlled his game more if he was still playing PG, but they switched him out of his natural position where he faced bigger and stronger guards. He does make his teammates better despite some of his ill-advised shots. Here's an interesting stat. In Crawford's 3rd year, he doubled his assists per game from the previous 2 in just 4 minutes more of play! After that season they put Crawford at the 2 and Hinirich at the 1.


<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">From what I can tell, LeBron would rather win than worry about being in the spotlight. And even if he did go to New York, where would he play? Crawford and Houston are locked up to long-term contracts and you would be hard-pressed to find any team to take them. Point guard is obviously out of the question too.</div>
You're acting as if the Knicks are the Hawks! The Knicks have a very legit chance of making the playoffs next year, and adding LeBron can improve their chances especially if they are a decent playoff team in 2007. Well you are mistaken here. Allan Houston's huge contract conviently expires when James becomes a free agent. Also, Maurice Taylor's contract comes off the books as well. So in 2007, Houston will be gone. Also, Marbury can be out of here too. Why can't James be a small forward or why can't Crawford come off the bench as was planned for this season? Every team in the league would make room for LeBron James. And why is James running the 1 out of the question? You said it yourself that he is a good playmaker.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't remember Cleveland having injury problems like New York did. Also NY is one solid player away from making the playoffs. That solid player was injured almost the whole season. I don't think they're much much closer to the playoffs than NY is. I mean, last year NY made it and Cleveland sat home too.
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What I meant was that Cleveland was pretty much a playoff team right now. They are one decent player away from being a good team (top 4 seed). The difference is that the Knicks are one player away from being a playoff team but not a top 4-5 team.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">
Marbury is a scorer by nature and he doesn't dish as much because he can make the same shots as his teammates. He feels more confident in himself than he does his teammates.
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Don't you see a problem with this though? Sure he is much more talented than most of his teammates but he can't win games by all by himself. At some point he has to trust his teammates. How are his teammates going to improve if he doesn't trust them to make the shots? It's his job as a point guard to make the players around him better.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">
Also, Marbury can be out of here too. Why can't James be a small forward or why can't Crawford come off the bench as was planned for this season? Every team in the league would make room for LeBron James. And why is James running the 1 out of the question? You said it yourself that he is a good playmaker.
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LeBron is a great playmaker. I just don't see the Knicks getting rid of Marbury. I might be wrong but it looks like Isiah considers him the centerpiece of this team and wants to build around him. I don't see LeBron going back to playing PG anyways. He is excelling at the 2-3 so putting him back at the 1 spot would not be beneficial. LBJ can play the SF and he has many times already but with a backcourt of Marbury-Crawford (who is already playing out of position), the Knicks would be really undersized.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting bball_spida:</div><div class="quote_post">He may not make the decision based on money. It may be based on a championship. look at these teams like NY and LA they have a winning reputation.

Also on his contract, it states if he plays for one of 3 big cities, LA, NY and.,.......Chicago cause of Jordan, he will get roughly the same money.
It matters if he wants the money, but more if he wants the championship! based on the cavs performance after the new management took ova, it may be sooner then later that lebron will move.</div>


Based on a championship team? i doubt if the Knicks should be in there...They were a championship team,yes.I wouldn't argue with that....But that's like way,way back... Nike just wants to make sure that by signing Bron a 90 mil contract he will give them a larger market w/c will be attained if LeBron will play for the top 2 teams in the league....Besides,it's his decision in the end you know...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">What I meant was that Cleveland was pretty much a playoff team right now. They are one decent player away from being a good team (top 4 seed). The difference is that the Knicks are one player away from being a playoff team but not a top 4-5 team.</div>
Well the Atlantic division is up for grabs so the Knicks can possibly grab a 3rd seed. The Knicks were actualy a failry decent team in the begining of the season, that streak where we just lacked confidence and lost close games pretty got us in a bad position. Here is an interesting stat: The Knicks lost 30 games by 6 points or less this season. Now with Houston gone, the Knicks don't have a clutch shooter to help them close out games properly. With a healthy Houston, I'm sure the Knicks could have been in the playoffs this season.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Don't you see a problem with this though? Sure he is much more talented than most of his teammates but he can't win games by all by himself. At some point he has to trust his teammates. How are his teammates going to improve if he doesn't trust them to make the shots? It's his job as a point guard to make the players around him better.</div>
That is ture, and he has been trying more than ever this season to help improve his teammates according to many scouts. He isn't on a distributing level such as Kidd is, but he can make his teammates better to a certain extent. A good example is the pick and roll with Kurt Thomas.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">LeBron is a great playmaker. I just don't see the Knicks getting rid of Marbury. I might be wrong but it looks like Isiah considers him the centerpiece of this team and wants to build around him. I don't see LeBron going back to playing PG anyways. He is excelling at the 2-3 so putting him back at the 1 spot would not be beneficial. LBJ can play the SF and he has many times already but with a backcourt of Marbury-Crawford (who is already playing out of position), the Knicks would be really undersized.</div>
Isiah said if the right deal comes, Marbury can be traded. Here's a link:
New York Post. Jamal Crawford is suited to play the PG position and when he has superstar caliber players such as LeBron around him, he can definitely creates some opportunities for them.

 

Now why didn't Isiah just pull the trigger on that Vince-Marbury trade? It seems to me Isiah is willing to take so many risks with acquiring other players, why didn't he with Vince?

You guys would've gotten a legitimate go-to guy and superstar and we would've gotten an all-star in return. Would've worked out for both of us and you guys would probably be in the playoffs right now.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">Now why didn't Isiah just pull the trigger on that Vince-Marbury trade? It seems to me Isiah is willing to take so many risks with acquiring other players, why didn't he with Vince?</div>
Why should have Vince pulled the trigger? Marbury was playing well with the team at the time, and unlike Vince, Marbury hasn't had injuries like that. Also with the crappy numbers Vince was putting up in the begining of the season, he killed his stock. Also at that time Marbury was untouchable...now he isn't.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You guys would've gotten a legitimate go-to guy and superstar and we would've gotten an all-star in return. Would've worked out for both of us and you guys would probably be in the playoffs right now.</div>
No, I don't know. Marbury and Vince cancel each other out meaning we would need someone else. Allan Houston was supposed to be that person but he was injured for most of the season.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">I fail to see how the Knicks have a better supporting cast, especially since getting Redd in Cleveland is a real possibility right now. With Ilgauskas and Gooden, that would be a much better team than anything the Knicks could offer.

I suppose you mean Marbury, who has a ton of talent but has never taken his team beyond the first round of the playoffs and doesn't make his teammates better. Or maybe you mean Crawford who has the same reptutation as being a "me first, shoot first player". I don't think that's the kind of situation LeBron is looking for.</div>
hmmmmmmmmmm...... how the knicks are a better supporting case......Marbury is much better than Snow or McCinnic, Crawford is MUCH better than Newble, Gooden is better than the group of sweetney, taylor and rose but not by too much and Z is better than Kurt but once again not by the same margin of difference that there is between Craw and newble.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting JWohl:</div><div class="quote_post">hmmmmmmmmmm...... how the knicks are a better supporting case......Marbury is much better than Snow or McCinnic, Crawford is MUCH better than Newble, Gooden is better than the group of sweetney, taylor and rose but not by too much and Z is better than Kurt but once again not by the same margin of difference that there is between Craw and newble.</div>

a supporting cast that look for their own shots before anyone else's....

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">a supporting cast that look for their own shots before anyone else's....</div>
A supporting cast that has also been to the finals 3 times and came out with 2 rings

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">A supporting cast that has also been to the finals 3 times and came out with 2 rings </div>

Were they large contributors to their team? No. Darko has a ring too, do you put any significance into that?

I was talking about Marbury and Crawford anyways.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">Were they large contributors to their team? No. Darko has a ring too, do you put any significance into that?</div>

Malik Rose wasn't a large contributor to the Spurs??
Kurt Thomas got minutes when Ewing was injured in the finals.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I was talking about Marbury and Crawford anyways.</div>
So what does that mean? They're still good players, right? Sam Cassell was a shoot first type PG, is he not good? What about Allen Iverson?

 

Well, do you think the Spurs would have won the championship without him? That should answer your question.

It's not that Crawford and Marbury aren't good players, it's just that that kind of a mentality isn't conducive to team success or a championship.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Eclipse:</div><div class="quote_post">Well, do you think the Spurs would have won the championship without him? That should answer your question.</div>
The Spurs are/were a deep team so the absence of one player with the exception of Duncan wouldn't make a huge difference, but that doesn't mean Rose didn't have a large contribution to the team.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">It's not that Crawford and Marbury aren't good players, it's just that that kind of a mentality isn't conducive to team success or a championship.</div>
Then Iverson, Cassell, Francis, and Bibby's mentality isn't conducive to their teams either...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">The Spurs are/were a deep team so the absence of one player with the exception of Duncan wouldn't make a huge difference, but that doesn't mean Rose didn't have a large contribution to the team.


Then Iverson, Cassell, Francis, and Bibby's mentality isn't conducive to their teams either...</div>

Until Iverson learns to share the ball and fully trust his teammates, he's not going to be able to get a championship. Just look at all the players that he hasn't been able to play/have any successful with: Stackhouse, Hughes, Van Horn, Robinson, and now Webber. Granted, they aren't elite players but they're all very talented. Iverson just dominates the ball so much that it's very difficult for another star player to co-exist with him.

Cassell played well last year because he bought into the team concept and that's when the T-Wolves had great team success. This year he was worried about getting paid and all this other garbage and look what has happened to them. You're probably also aware of the problems back in Milwaukee where everyone played for themselves which got them no where.

Francis has never had any significant team success and couldn't even play with Yao and get him the ball so the Rockets had to trade him for someone that could.

Bibby is a shoot first guard too but the Kings are a passing team so tha ball isn't in Bibby's hands that much anyways. More often than not people will look at his stats and assume that he is a shoot-first guard but you also have to take account the style of play of the Kings and the fact that he's had to carry the offensive load with all the Kings' injury problems over the past couple of seasons.

 

LeBron is not going to New York.

The thought of that makes me laugh. Gilbert is not stupid enough to trade away the home town hero for an underachieved Stephon Marbury. Keep dreaming Knicks fans.

 

this clause doesn't mean anything. people dig too much into things.. LeBron wants to WIN.. NY isnt the place to go to do that. The Cavs could contend next year depending on free agency this year.. (ray allen, michael redd)

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting JWohl:</div><div class="quote_post">hmmmmmmmmmm...... how the knicks are a better supporting case......Marbury is much better than Snow or McCinnic, Crawford is MUCH better than Newble, Gooden is better than the group of sweetney, taylor and rose but not by too much and Z is better than Kurt but once again not by the same margin of difference that there is between Craw and newble.</div>Wait, but I thought Lebron was demandidn a trade to NY (or so spike lee reports)

You don't think your gonna have to give up any significant players to get him? Is it gonna be a Lebron for cash trade?

Probably not.