I was watching Around the Horn today, and they were discussing comments apparently made by Ricky Davis. Supposedly Ricky said "bring out the broom" in the 2nd quarter Saturday. When asked his opinion, Woody Paige says, "this is a guy who shoots at his own basket to get a triple double." Is this because he's a complete moron, or that he knows absolutely nothing about basketball, much less the C's? At one point, I found Paige humorous and interesting, but he has lost all the respect that I ever had for him. Bringing that incident up was totally irrelevant and classless. It's amazing what some of these media members will say. There's no end to it. Why do they refuse to recognize all the great things that Ricky has done? Much respect to Tony and Mike on PTI for not even bringing up any of Ricky's past.
because trying to pad up your stats is completly classless and disrespectful to the sport of basketball. at that point he conmpletly lost all respect of mine, when i watch basketball i want to see players that are gonna give it a 100% out there and try to win, not get a triple double, i agree with paige(which i rarely do), but when there are athletes like, KG, Timmy, Bosh, Iverson, Miller trying to win games, why is there one guy thats disrespecting them by padding up his stats, and then saying their going to sweep a team that had a sweep over boston the previous year. Bob Sura and Ricky Davis's (edit) attemp of a triple double probably will never be forgotan by many people. but on a lighter note that was pretty funny when they tried to get their (edit) triple double. <font color="Blue">Edited for vulgarity</font>
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Umer remU:</div><div class="quote_post">because trying to pad up your stats is completly classless and disrespectful to the sport of basketball. at that point he conmpletly lost all respect of mine, when i watch basketball i want to see players that are gonna give it a 100% out there and try to win, not get a triple double</div>Good for you. I'm really excited about hearing that. You lose respect for players (as if you even had respect for Ricky before that) because they try to pad their stats in GARBAGE TIME? His team was blowing out the Jazz and he got a little too excited (like he always does) and tapped the ball against the rim in an attempt to add one more rebound to his already great statistics in that game. It's such a minuscule thing if you really think about it. Too bad for Ricky that the media totally blew it out of proportion, and most people aren't capable of forming their own opinions, they just listen to whatever is told to them. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> i agree with paige(which i rarely do), but when there are athletes like, KG, Timmy, Bosh, Iverson, Miller trying to win games, why is there one guy thats disrespecting them by padding up his stats, and then saying their going to sweep a team that had a sweep over boston the previous year.</div>He said it to his own teammates as motivation. He didn't say it to the Pacers, the media, or anybody else. He said it to his teammates. Is that really that bad? Why should you be able to scrutinize a player for something he said in the privacy of his own bench? Besides, I haven't even seen or heard Ricky saying it in the first place. For all we know, he could've never even said it. He denies saying anything of the sort. Just because the media tells you something doesn't mean it's true. IMO, The media was trying to fire up the lifeless Pacers because a Pacers' series victory will make them more money than a Celtics'. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Bob Sura and Ricky Davis's (edit) attemp of a triple double probably will never be forgotan by many people. </div>Maybe...but do these people have to constantly bring it up? To me, all it shows is that that person has no idea what they are talking about and that's really all they know about Ricky in the first place. Somebody that would still continue to bring that up hasn't seen Ricky since he has been in Boston, that's for sure.
are you saying, that getting a "fake" triple double is okay, and ricky is a better player by doing that? you be full of ****
While I don't think that Ricky was right to shoot at his own basket, garbage time or not, I don't know why it seems to have stuck to him and yet Bob Sura is suddenly the greatest bench player ever and the key to the Rockets run to the title. Ricky can't live it down and Sura's mess-up is practically forgotten. That's the only thing that bugs me. But, then I remember it's Woody Paige, who once mocked the Patriots and recieved so much mail from Patriots fans that he changed his email address because he couldn't handle that much critisism and it all falls into context. He's the epitiome of a sports-writer: can dish it out, but can't take any in return (and god, do we have those in Boston).
Bob Sura is just as (edit) as ricky davis, i havnet forgot that bone headed move, and ricky davis is so far the most known as the better bench player, even though he might not win 6th man, but i'd still say he's betta than sura
It's not classless to bring it up, as long as he did it, he deserves to have it thrown back in his face. He made me ashamed to be a cavs fan, and I will never forget him for that. When I consider his comments about cleveland when he left, it's clear he is classless as well. So a classless guy gets hit with a classless comment. Sounds logical to me. Maybe you Celtics fans don't get what's wrong with it, because he didn't shame your team by doing it. I dind't care if it was garbage time. He was on my own team, and I wanted Jerry Sloan to send someone out to knock him out. It was as selfish as it can be, and don't try to blame it on him getting "excited" it was a premeditated act, it wasn't some spur of the moment thing as you would like to paint it.
Like I already said...it was wrong. Does that make it fair game to bring up whenever they talk about him? Sure, I guess. The point of this thread is that NOBODY EVER has anything positive to say about him in the national media. They bring up things that happened years ago BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY THING THEY KNOW ABOUT HIM! God forbid they talk about anything he's done since he's been here. He has become a joke because of one stupid mistake he made. When is the last time Woody Paige has said anything that was worth listening to, anyway?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 44Thrilla:</div><div class="quote_post">Like I already said...it was wrong. Does that make it fair game to bring up whenever they talk about him? Sure, I guess. The point of this thread is that NOBODY EVER has anything positive to say about him in the national media. They bring up things that happened years ago BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY THING THEY KNOW ABOUT HIM! God forbid they talk about anything he's done since he's been here. He has become a joke because of one stupid mistake he made. When is the last time Woody Paige has said anything that was worth listening to, anyway?</div> Yeah, I get what you're saying, it's just that was a big sore spot with me when it comes to Ricky. He's kept his act together for you guys, and looks like he may have turned things around. But he's still got a ways to go before people will drop this. It was one of the biggest symbols of greed in sports. Maybe it's just because the Cavs drafted him. Sura pulled that crap too.
I must say that no one here is giving you crediblity because you are supporting Ricky Davis while having a sig and avatar of him. Therefore, no one really expects your opinion of RD to be relevant. Anyway, you say no one talks about what good he has done, only the bad. Other than putting up good stats (which are apparently padded) what good has the guy done? If he would shut up maybe he could get out of the media's scrutiny. And the media isn't who you should listen to for positive remarks, they tend to put players down (see Kobe Bryant pre and post rape charges) and your boy Ricky was a prime target.
I'm kind of surprised this topic spurred so much emotion. As RunBJM said, most of the sports media are very negative towards players and biased in general. When's the last time you met an objective person in the sports world? On the other hand, Ricky can say whatever he wants to his teammates, and he shouldn't be made fun of just because he was a bit overconfident. I'm not even going into how stat-padding makes someone a worse person somehow or makes their credibility relevant to everything they say. There's a difference being doing something silly and having opinions attacked because you are wrong or others think you are wrong.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Run BJM:</div><div class="quote_post">I must say that no one here is giving you crediblity because you are supporting Ricky Davis while having a sig and avatar of him. Therefore, no one really expects your opinion of RD to be relevant.</div>That's got to be one of the most ignorant comments that I've ever read on this message board. I know you're new here, so I guess it ALMOST can be excused, but you should really know something about somebody before you decide to say anything of that nature. Maybe in your mind my opinion doesn't matter because I have a Davis sig/avatar but anybody that's ever read a fair amount of my posts knows that anybody is fair game in my book. If justified (at least in my opinion), I'll criticize anything and everything I feel I need to, about any and every Celtic player. To tell you the truth, I don't even have a favorite player. The Celtics are my team and I leave it at that. I've had signatures of Delonte West, Tony Allen, Ryan Gomes, Cuttino Mobley, and various others in the past. Does that make my opinion lack credibilty when it comes to all of them as well? Please let me know more about this new way to judge people's opinions. I'd like to know who I can and cannot put in my graphics from here on out. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Anyway, you say no one talks about what good he has done, only the bad. Other than putting up good stats (which are apparently padded)</div>Yes, in one game he tried to get an extra rebound. Dr. Naismith is rolling over in his grave. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">what good has the guy done? If he would shut up maybe he could get out of the media's scrutiny.</div>The guy can't even talk on his own bench to his teammates without the media listening in. Go ahead and read through every interview that he has participated in this year. Try to find me one thing he said that comes anywhere close to this. I can say with complete confidence that you will not find a thing. Even Peter May, a boston writer who HATED RICKY WITH A PASSION when he was traded here, going as far as to label him "the devil", wrote a piece this year about Ricky being as close to a model citizen as there is in this league. The problem is, to many he is "the guy that shot at his own basket" and they don't bother to learn anything more about the man. As soon as they hear that he supposedly said something like this, they immediatly think they are experts on the subject and decide to spout off their flawed opinions, thinking that people actually want to hear them. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> And the media isn't who you should listen to for positive remarks, they tend to put players down (see Kobe Bryant pre and post rape charges) and your boy Ricky was a prime target.</div>Sorry to sink your boat, but an accusation of rape is a little bit different then what Ricky did. Your correlation between the two, while on point to an extent, just proves my point further that Ricky is not treated fairly by the media...and apparently some people who post at this forum.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 44Thrilla:</div><div class="quote_post">That's got to be one of the most ignorant comments that I've ever read on this message board. I know you're new here, so I guess it ALMOST can be excused, but you should really know something about somebody before you decide to say anything of that nature. Maybe in your mind my opinion doesn't matter because I have a Davis sig/avatar but anybody that's ever read a fair amount of my posts knows that anybody is fair game in my book. If justified (at least in my opinion), I'll criticize anything and everything I feel I need to, about any and every Celtic player. To tell you the truth, I don't even have a favorite player. The Celtics are my team and I leave it at that. I've had signatures of Delonte West, Tony Allen, Ryan Gomes, Cuttino Mobley, and various others in the past. Does that make my opinion lack credibilty when it comes to all of them as well? Please let me know more about this new way to judge people's opinions. I'd like to know who I can and cannot put in my graphics from here on out. Yes, in one game he tried to get an extra rebound. Dr. Naismith is rolling over in his grave. The guy can't even talk on his own bench to his teammates without the media listening in. Go ahead and read through every interview that he has participated in this year. Try to find me one thing he said that comes anywhere close to this. I can say with complete confidence that you will not find a thing. Even Peter May, a boston writer who HATED RICKY WITH A PASSION when he was traded here, going as far as to label him "the devil", wrote a piece this year about Ricky being as close to a model citizen as there is in this league. The problem is, to many he is "the guy that shot at his own basket" and they don't bother to learn anything more about the man. As soon as they hear that he supposedly said something like this, they immediatly think they are experts on the subject and decide to spout off their flawed opinions, thinking that people actually want to hear them. Sorry to sink your boat, but an accusation of rape is a little bit different then what Ricky did. Your correlation between the two, while on point to an extent, just proves my point further that Ricky is not treated fairly by the media...and apparently some people who post at this forum.</div> This may sound like it's coming from a Celtics fan, because it is, but Ricky has more talent in his little finger than Bob Sura, for one. Secondly, yes Woody Paige is an ignorant windbag with little to support his opinions besides his own words, which I might add, rarely have truth to them. Sure, I may be painting with broad strokes, but Woody brought in on himself by consistently making himself a target for criticism by simply making things up. Sure, we've probably all done it once or twice, but one, this is a sportswriter, it's his job to know these things, and two, to do it as often as he does, and as blatantly as he does, he deserves no credibility as such. Paige is a bad writer as it is, he actually has a marginal amount of talent, read his columns sometime, but perhaps I'm getting too nitty-gritty here. My real point is this: back in the day Ricky had some concerns among all his peers that he was a selfish, stuck-up, arrogant, ball hog, with no redeemings teammate-like qualities. That's because he did. For any of you who know him, you know he grew up playing street ball and still does for kicks. His style of play comes right off the playground. The courts of this country that aren't hardwood have a totally different set of rules and totally different etiquette. And that makes me sound like a Ricky apologist, I'm not. The only difference that matters here is this: Ricky played basketball for fun in his young life, and to be the best, not necessarily to win. As a result, his attitude is looked at as lackadaisical and oafish, not as dedicated as his teammates. When DeShawn Stevenson took exception to Ricky's triple-double it what a sign to everyone else that his playground antics weren't to be accepted in the leagues, this coming from a player who's played on the hardtop as much as my grandmother. Now that playground ball is starting to permeate the national basketball mentality, we're starting to see more and more the playing style that comes with it, which is to have fun. Now that being said, that doesn't mean that Ricky doesn't care about winning anymore. There's only so much negative press a man can take before common sense takes over, so what does he do? He changes himself in Boston. He sees a potential to be a well-known talent here in Boston, and clearly he has embraced that. His flair, brovado, and attitude have made at least one fan love him here, and I can't wait to see how his career unfolds here. At 4.92 mil a season, we can afford to watch a natural athlete do what he does best, even if it is in an uncomfortable environment, year after year. Watch him at the Mix Tape tour sometime, and tell me where he learned to play. So few players have had the natural, raw, untapped ability to jump from street ball to the hardwood capably and that's why. There is an attitude in the Association that does not respect that style of play. They learned to play in schools and in organizations, and from coaches. Coaches who learned the game from coaches, and not from ballplayers. And as a result, players who fit into systems make it in the NBA, not players who don't have, know, or care about systems. But any player can grow out of that, humans have survived this long because they adapt, and to earn 4.92 mil a year, I'd learn to friggin' adjust too. Ricky is not a symbol of greed, he is a symbol of raw ability, and rough-around-the-edges attitude. But he's only rough around the edges in the confines of the NBA, not where he's from. After that infamous game, Stevenson mentioned that he couldn't even have gotten that rebound, it wouldn't have counted, any official scorer knows that, but Ricky didn't, what does that say about his motives? They were innocent, and we was only out there having fun, like he learned to do. So enough Ricky-bashing just enjoy watching a natural talent and enjoy the fact that his work ethic is now second to none, and enjoy the fact that his second chance was worth it as much to us fans as it was to him. Rarely do we see that in professional sports. Oh yeah, and enough with Woody Paige too, listening that guy is about as fun as a sharp stick in the eye.
Great post. The media and the fans LOVE to make a mockery of certain players. All it takes is for the player to make one stupid remark, one stupid play, or one stupid decision. Apparently, these people think that they're perfect and immune to mistakes. I understand that the media has a job to do and all, but enough is enough. Ricky couldn't shake this wrap no matter what he does. It still bothers me to this day, in this forgiving society that we live in, that Ricky still has a HUGE black mark on his name because of the silly incident. It must be his whole mentality that irks people because their accounts of the whole situation and their negative opinions of him are flawed and unsubstantiated. Bill Simmons, in one of his columns, said that Ricky would be happy if he was shoveling crap at a circus. That's just it. The guy seems to be having a good time, no matter what. To me, while annoying at times (at the end of a blowout loss), I think it's a mostly positive attribute to have. In fact, I'd like to see Pierce with a similar mindset. NBA basketball, for the most part, is an emotional game. Sometimes PP seems to let his emotions affect his play. Ricky, however, is going to look at things the same way, no matter what the circumstances are. People look at the way Ricky handles himself and they think he's arrogant, cocky, and selfish. In reality, he's just mentally strong and doesn't let his emotions get to him.
Ricky Davis has made a total transformation from his days as a Cav, and if I was a Cav fan i'd be upset too, its to bad you didnt have the opportunity to see the other side of Davis. He was young and immature, he has simply matured. He has found a place where he feels comfortable, a place he can call home. People need to learn to put things that happened in the past behind them, people CAN change! You guys talk about athletes who try to win games and you mentioned Allen Iverson.. Aside from AI being the great player he is: what about the fact that hes constantly getting fines from the NBA, for going after referees, hitting opposing team players, etc. And how about the instance he was arrested for breaking an entering and going after his own wife with a gun..But thats all acceptable?
Lots of replies with good discussion.. When all is said and done though, I don't have a problem with the media bringing up something he's done in the past. Hell, even Ricky shouldn't have a problem with it. It's not like the media is lying about it.. And in the context of that Around the Horn episode; the topic was Davis' comments on a series after the second quarter of the first game. It's more than valid to bring up his past transgression when you're discussing this guy's character
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting tradebark:</div><div class="quote_post">Lots of replies with good discussion.. When all is said and done though, I don't have a problem with the media bringing up something he's done in the past. Hell, even Ricky shouldn't have a problem with it. It's not like the media is lying about it.. And in the context of that Around the Horn episode; the topic was Davis' comments on a series after the second quarter of the first game. It's more than valid to bring up his past transgression when you're discussing this guy's character </div> I don't have a problem with a hack like Woody bringing it up either, or anyone else for that matter, he did do it, it did happen. The argument's just moot now. He's not the player he was, and that's that. And anyone who's ever played basketball on any team, not even team, with any group of individuals, ever, has said some cocky nonsense to his squad to fire them up. That's basketball. So let it go, it happened, and that's all there is to it.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 44Thrilla:</div><div class="quote_post"> The media and the fans LOVE to make a mockery of certain players. All it takes is for the player to make one stupid remark, one stupid play, or one stupid decision. Apparently, these people think that they're perfect and immune to mistakes. I understand that the media has a job to do and all, but enough is enough. Ricky couldn't shake this wrap no matter what he does. </div> It must be kept in mind that such commentary on players is what keeps so many fans coming back to watch the given program, listen to the given radio station, read the given article/column, etc. This commentary creates headlines, conflict, and anticipation of a response - which is what the media always wants to generate. The media wants to have people taking in the material that they distribute, so they transmit the message in controversial techniques. Woody Paige is a perfect example, he's pretty controversial on ESPN's 1st and 10, Around the Horn, etc. But do you think he behaves in a similar manner in real life? I strongly doubt he's even nearly as zealous as he makes himself look. He's very effective in the category of installing some ideas in peoples minds, ideas that bring questions - these questions usually intrigue the viewer/reader/listener, which spurs them to "tune in" the next chance they get. The fans do this as the writers influence them. I do agree, however, it is troubling that people still feel that way about them. The media really went nuts with Ricky, they made him an enormous victim. That I can admit, it is very troubling. The media does overdo it sometimes in transmitting the message, but primarily they do this only to insure that they make the point strong, further increasing it's effect. Keep in mind that I agree with you, I'm just defending the media a tad.
I'm glad I ran into this thread. Some of the things I am reading is complete garbage. First of all, Davis was trying to pump up his teammates on the bench and say bring out the brooms, and the media snoops into his conversation? Shows what this world has come to. I remember in Game 2, Paul Pierce said: "We will not lose this game" on the bench. I bet we'll hear something like this soon. Woody?s job as a member of the media is to say things like this regardless of how silly, stupid, or ignorant he might sound. Similarly to other NBA ?analysts?, the entertainment factor will always outweigh the substance that they provide. A good example is ESPN?s Steven A. Smith. He is a quite entertaining character however, many regard him as an idiot. Davis trying to get that triple double I thought was hilarious because I never saw anything like it, but what?s the problem? The Cavaliers won that game by 27 points and him trying to get (I believe his first) triple double of his career in garbage minutes by getting one mere rebound means he?s padding his stats? I just don?t understand that? I remember in the 02-03 season when the Knicks were playing the Bucks. Allan Houston had 48 points in the final 30 seconds or so. Him wanting the ball to score 50 points means he?s stat padding? Hypothetically speaking, if a player had 99 points in garbage minutes, would you feel it?s stat padding if he wanted to break Wilt?s record? Although Davis has done some regrettable things in his career, I feel as if many aren?t giving him his due credit. He has definitely improved and has helped the Celtics to where they are now. If you think bringing back Davis? old flaws justify what type of player he is, you are clearly as silly as Paige is. Plain and simple.
