As a C's fan lately, there has been a lot of self-loathing going around. People talking about how much it sucks to be a Celtics fan lately, and folks bellyaching about how we never win anything any more. Well, I would like to say unto those folks, nay. Being a C's fan is as good a time as there has been to be one. Lots of youthful optimism, and lots of bright minds and talent going around. That said, I would like to open the doors for everyone who bops on in here to ask us C's fans, any of us, how we feel about the team, what we think about the future, anything. Feel free and ask what you're thinking. There are people out there who want to know what's what, and I think it's time you did just that. Any question will suffice. Even if it's just trivia, or if it's GOAT questions, who cares? Fire away. I would love to hear what it one other folks' minds, and no question is off limits. Thanks in advance guys.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting thedude9990:</div><div class="quote_post">west or telfair</div> Good question. Ultimately one we will have to wait until preseason to really know, but as far as experience is concerned, there is little doubt that it has to be West. Delonte had a great launching off point with last season's experience, but Telfair adds flair and a little playmaking presence, especially when West is as versatile as he is. At the end of this season, we might call this a toss up, but for now, let's stick with West. We'll stay safe with the substance over style pick.
How do you feel about the triple overtime loss to the 76ers? And about Korver's crazy three over delonte west?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting miss3pointer25:</div><div class="quote_post">How do you feel about the triple overtime loss to the 76ers? And about Korver's crazy three over delonte west?</div> What more can you say about it? A great game deserves a great ending. As a C's fan, it's a tough loss to take, but not one that hurts any more than a blowout. I would rather take a divisional opponent to three overtimes and lose than get embarrassed. Of course, a win would be preferable for all the work you put in in three OT's, but oh well. On the other hand, those are the games a team needs to win to see itself in an advantageous postseason position. A break here, more hustle there, and you're the team on top, not to be this time though. As for the crazy three, it was just that, crazy. Can't do anything but give him props. There are fans out there who would say that's a cheap way to win a game, but a shot's a shot. Gotta hand it to him.
Not really a quesiton but, on a scale of 1-10, with 10 being extremely important, rank how important Ryan Gomes and Perkins are to the Celtics sucess (individually ranks).
Of all of these young players, who will be a part of the future, and who will be trade bait: Tony Allen Ryan Gomes Gerald Green Al Jefferson Kendrick Perkins Leon Powe Allan Ray Rajon Rondo Sebastian Telfair Delonte West
Do you think this self-loathing is more a case of the fans being too accustomed to success? I mean, your team is in a situation that most capped-out lottery teams would love to be in and, as an outsider, I don't really understand where it's coming from.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 44Thrilla:</div><div class="quote_post">Will there be a trade before the season?</div> Great question. If we look at the Celtics draft, as well as the acquisitions before, during, and after said draft, you would have to assume that they'll try. AI doesn't seem to be an option by now, and that's certainly understandable (I don't want Wally either), but you know is always trying to play his best cards. He is as natural in front of the mike at that post-trade press conference as anyone in the league, and you know he relishes the role, but he seems capable of getting the better end of deals thus far in his career, although not overwhelmingly, and seemingly inquantifiably so. Maybe he's not as solid as we think. Who knows yet? To answer his question, all signs (especially the roster) point to yes, but who it will be and when is anyone's guess. And people will guess, and most will be wrong, but that's what we love about the offseason. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting P.A.P.:</div><div class="quote_post">Not really a quesiton but, on a scale of 1-10, with 10 being extremely important, rank how important Ryan Gomes and Perkins are to the Celtics sucess (individually ranks).</div> Tough to gauge Gomes, but Perk is seemingly an important part of the near future. Gomes had a great start to his career in Boston, and made quite a splash with Davis and Reed gone, and Allen hurt, but teams didn't waste much time figuring out his game. At the same time, there's little planning you can do to prevent hustle, and that's Gomes' game. Gomes will crash the boards on good days, score capably inside in those same games, and be a quiet, minuteless dud in other games. Which one will stand up consistently is still up in the air. Also, with a premium on the swingman position and Gomes being as small as he is, there's always the idea that he won't end up getting too terribly much playing time. All told, I give Gomes a very debatable four. As for Perk, he's another story. A healthy Perk is guaranteed minutes, and he can be a game changer. He made some plays last season that made me not so upset about the C's trying to make B Wallace a guard. The man is a beast on the boards when he isn't fouling too much, and better than that, he looked so confident in his starts last year. I can't wait to see what new wrinkle he's going to have in his game this season, and he's probably the player I most look forward to seeing develop this year, even surpassing Gerald Green. His importance to the Celtics in the short term is tops, in the long run he may end up being an important trading chip, just like every other young player on this team, but Perk more so than others. Ainge wants an all-star to complement Pierce, and with a salary and an upside like Perk's, he may not last the offseason. Sad but true. Nevertheless, I give him a 7 short term, and a 5 over the long run. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Bobcats:</div><div class="quote_post">Of all of these young players, who will be a part of the future, and who will be trade bait: Tony Allen Ryan Gomes Gerald Green Al Jefferson Kendrick Perkins Leon Powe Allan Ray Rajon Rondo Sebastian Telfair Delonte West</div> So tough to say, but I'll go with a couple easy ones: Trade Bait starts with Bassey. Telfair is (according to some fans you talk to), supposedly the savior of the C's backcourt. Not so...at all. This man had a purpose earlier this offseason, and that was fodder. Now we have to ride this experiment out a little. Even if it isn't the life of the contract, we probably (barring an all-star swap) have him at least until the trade deadline. Well, he does add something entirely different to the offense, and that's playmaking. West got a real strong swallow of how to do it last season, but it seemed like he had to ratchet back his offensive ability (most notably his shooting instinct), as a result. With any luck, perhaps we can get some offense out of Rondo, and some playmaking out of Bassey to supplement the second (and a half?) unit. The only other player(s) you can say are actual trade bait would be guys like Gomes, Allen, or Green. Gomes is a guy that could fetch a fairly decent price on the market (in tandem with more important pieces), because of his rebounding and middle/in scoring repertoire. As for Allen, Doc has been high on him since the moment he arrived, but those are the players that usually go in major deals. Players that coaches like, but aren't key cogs in the team. Allen is both of those things. He could be a fairly significant trade piece, again, in tandem with bigger fish. Green is another story. An unknown commodity, surrounded by huge hype, cheap, young, and showing further flashes of brilliance all the time. He, unlike the other youngsters on the team, is a trade chip based solely on his own merit. His athleticism is seemingly limitless, and his jump shot is phenomenal, defense is a little beyond his grasp, but he's further along in that regard than most players his age, even historically, so let's give credit where it's due. The more coaches see of him, the more he will be openly lusted after by GM's. That said, pay attention to his minutes in the early going if the C's start to struggle. If he's riding pine, he's in it for the long haul, if he's not, expect some talk around February. The other players on the list are at least marginally invested somehow in the Celtics future. Especially so are guys like Rondo, who Ainge is head over heels in love with, Jefferson, who is supposed to be a blue chipper one of these seasons, and Delonte West, who is making a name for himself in this running offense. All of them have their ups and downs, but more importantly, all of them are addressing those things. As for Powe and Ray, don't expect much, but if they turn out serviceable, be pleasantly surprised. I know I know, they were great in college, and they were, and people seem attached to both of them, but still, they're rookies, and they aren't really supposed to contribute much, so I'm not falling for it again. The good thing about Powe though, is that he could very well take minutes from Gomes, which would make Gomes even more expendable. Not that I want Gomes to be more expendable, I'm just saying, he could end up being part of trade simple because Powe may well be even better at being Gomes than Gomes is. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">Do you think this self-loathing is more a case of the fans being too accustomed to success? I mean, your team is in a situation that most capped-out lottery teams would love to be in and, as an outsider, I don't really understand where it's coming from.</div> Awesome question. Boston fans are spoiled brats. We are, and we love to be. The only problem is, we put entirely too much pressure on our teams in general. The Red Sox feel is every year, the B's used to, the Pats are just now getting there, and the Celtics felt the full brunt of it in the early 90's after Bird left, and are now feeling the last trickle of it. Apathy is our middle name when it comes to teams that used to be and now are not, and that's just embarrassing. I hear it everyday, "I'm not even gonna watch this season." Why not? It's basketball. It's fun, it's marketable, and it's modern. Our players are young and talented, and more than anything, eager to please, so give 'em a chance. Boston is the most callous collection of sports fans the world has ever seen, and the city has mostly turned on the team that once was its pulse. All that in mind, we do expect victories, more than most outsiders understand, because most people think we're accustomed to losing here in Boston. People think we're a bunch of masochistic headcases who love to suffer along with our ballclubs, but it's not true, and that's mostly due to the past success of the Boston Celtics. They made us known for our winning spirit and we still have it, and I'm fairly certain we always will. We expect a lot of our teams, and the C's are no different. I expect them to be a playoff contender this year, just like I expected last year, and I expect Doc Rivers to make this team better than it was and has been. I expect it, but it's not going to happen, not on Doc's watch, because he's incompetent, and I know that, but I still anticipate his revolutionary new look at the game, because I assume our team will do everything it can to win a championship, and barring that, I assume he will be fired post haste, for wasting all of our time and talent. And that's another scenario that's not going to come true.
You're wrong about Telfair. Don't be surprised when he's starting from day one. Believe it or not, but he was one of the main reasons the AI trade hasn't happened. The Sixers want him but Danny doesn't want to give him up.
How would you rate Doc Rivers as a coach, Danny Ainge as a GM, and Paul Pierce as a cornerstone for a franchise?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 44Thrilla:</div><div class="quote_post">You're wrong about Telfair. Don't be surprised when he's starting from day one. Believe it or not, but he was one of the main reasons the AI trade hasn't happened. The Sixers want him but Danny doesn't want to give him up.</div> Nothing would make me more pleased than to be wrong about Bassey. I'd just like to make it public that I don't see this as his breakout year. Maybe someday soon, but I think this is going to be his best chance. He's in exactly the right scenery to make a huge splash, but I hate to say it, but I don't see it. If I'm wrong, I'll eat my hat. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Sheik:</div><div class="quote_post">How would you rate Doc Rivers as a coach, Danny Ainge as a GM, and Paul Pierce as a cornerstone for a franchise?</div> You guys know how to pick the tough questions. First let me sell myself short by saying that I had not once been right about Doc as a coach until that playoff series with the Pacers two seasons ago. In Orlando, I saw no future for him, and then when he made a name for himself, I thought he wouldn't leave that city for some time. Wrong and wrong respectively. As for present day, I said, "gee, there's no one who can make something out of nothing better than Doc Rivers." And I stand corrected once again. Danny Ainge, the president of this team, did it better in Phoenix than Rivers ever has, and I wish he would quit this media posturing and step into the coach's role already. That's another story for another time. I think Doc is simple in his coaching philosophy to a fault, and has not taken into account the personalities of his players in the way he runs his media relationships. He pays little attention to individual matchups, unless they are blatantly obvious (such as, don't play Paul Pierce on Kobe Bryant for 40 minutes, duh!), he does not value the defensive rebound the way he should (since he's running a fast break offense and "outlet=easy basket" hasn't even entered into the equation), and he is one the worst gametime tacticians I've ever witnessed. His use of his bench (bringing the line shift back to Boston while the B's were locked out), and his counter attack techniques are painfully dated, if they're ever even used. Not to mention, what happened when he was supposed to be God's gift to player development? We've not seen one player blossom as advertised, nor have we seen significant improvement in 90% of said players from season to season. That's the sign of either a lazy coach, bad assistants, a mix of both, or just sheer bad luck. Has anyone seen Al Jefferson rotate on the low block on defense? It's like watching an asthmatic, retarded four year old play football in your local downtown rec league. He fouls any time there's a doubt about the ball going in the hoop, and he moves his feet like he's too drunk to tango. And why? Because no one has taught him the slightest notion about court awareness. Honestly, at this stage in the game, I'm embarrassed to say this man is our coach. And the more he opens his mouth after games, the more his players want to put their foot in it and beat him to the punch. He alienates a player a week, and we hear about Danny picking up the scraps even on game days. That's ridiculous and irresponsible. What we need is a new coaching staff altogether. I know a leprechaun on espn.com that could run this team like it was supposed to be a playoff contender. It's time for him to get a new JOB (hint hint) and we can watch the maestro bring defense back to beantown. Now on to the next portion of the question: Danny Ainge as a GM has been a battle of the bittersweet. He's great on draft day (I think), and he seems able and capable of getting the contracts he doesn't want out of town. Let me preface everything I'm about to say by saying that Ainge is a right sight better than Wallace or Carr (I shudder at the name at this point) could dream of being, so Danny, please don't take this personal. I think he needs to take a step back every now and again about how his treats his role players. He was one himself, and he knows what one needs in this league and on this team, but he seems to ignore that, and has masterminded contracts and press interaction that seem to set these guys up for the fall. When he signed Brian Scalabrine (I'm shuddering again), he gave him a preposterous contract and then threw him to the dogs when it came time for him to meet the Boston press. He was ridiculed mercilessly, lampooned left and right, and I think Ainge just thought the process would prepare him for the real world here in Boston. The familiar fire that brought Scalabrine to Boston, the one that helped the Nets win close games with him in the game, was never present, not even in the preseason, and Scal dogged his way to the worst performance we've seen by a Celtic in this decade. Again, Ainge was nowhere to be found. While that's not the greatest thing in the world, was Ainge has done well is give the fans a reason to show up for some games. He has infused the team with young talent, he has made said talent interact with their fans and press, and has made the team a respectable group of guys, rather than the malcontents, has beens, and bargain basement replacements we saw in the 90's. However, all that and two nickels and you've still only got ten cents. The road to Hell is paved with good intentions, and Ainge needs to figure this out. His not so well-intentioned ribbing and alienation of certain marquee players who shall go unnamed (he's a snake, remember?) has cost him more than one fan (a group I do not count myself among). Nevertheless, I like him because he has taken charge of this organization, made a difference, and been steadfast in the things that he has pulled off, which is more than I can say for the previous two organizational leaders, so hats off to that. Now as for Pierce, let's keep this simple. Paul Pierce is very simply one of the most selfless, understated, talented, and wholly unteachable (unless you're initials are JOB) players ever in this town. Not since Tommy Heinsohn have we seen such frustration, from coaches and himself. Not since Hondo have we seen the single-minded determination to put the ball in the basket. And not since Bird have we seen the ability to put these traits together into a mix that just screams perennial all-star. He's a favorite here in Boston, and there's little he could do to alienate us. He doesn't complain (except about Doc, and that's fair game), he doesn't showboat, he wins when he's called upon to do so, and he's finally taking more of a leadership role and showing some youngsters what's what in this league. Pierce has been given an unfair task in being asked to win with this collection of talent, as has been the case since he arrived. But he's a selfless fella and he plays to win, even if it's individual competition, which he excels at. He plays matchups better than his coach, and as a result, we see some wicked play when his back is to the wall. I say, if there were five of him, we'd have a championship, but there aren't five players in Boston's history with his particular skill set or attitude, so the chances of him taking one home here in Beantown aren't very good, and that's a shame the likes of which we rarely get to see in this fine basketball organization.
I'll keep it a bit more simple than that. Doc Rivers is a figure head who is more interested in defending his methods of coaching than he is adjusting them. Danny Ainge feels that he can defend mediocrisy by continuing to pursue and bring in unproven players with potential -- and in the process he can reduce the payroll to the content of ownership. He will also continue to find himself initiating trade talks so that the fans believe he is doing everything in his power to bring a winner back to Boston -- despite the fact that many of the proposed trades that are somehow leaked are extreme long shots to happen. Paul Pierce is a top five player in this league that for some reason isn't good enough to carry a successful team on his back by himself. He needs another All-Star caliber player on his team to get the C's back into contention. That type of player could be a Larry Hughes, Rip Hamilton, Mike Bibby, Zach Randolph, Carlos Boozer, etc. Not upper echelon stars but someone that the defense would have to prepare to stop every night. He was successful w/ Toine b/c Toine wasn't afraid to go after his game and the defense had to adjust to that. With the current coach and current management I doubt that the Celtics ever advance past the first round. That's a shame b/c I think that Paul Pierce is the most unappreciated superstar that this league has to offer. I have another question for you: Who was the last quality free agent to sign with the Celtics and do you feel that the Celtics are capable of attracting quality free agents to Boston?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">I have another question for you: Who was the last quality free agent to sign with the Celtics and do you feel that the Celtics are capable of attracting quality free agents to Boston?</div> I don't know that they've even gotten a "quality" free agent, depending on your definition of quality. They have acheived mild success in the free agent market with low-salaried role players, but other than that, you're not talking anything significant. The entirety of their major acquisitions have been drafts or trades. Free agents seem not to rear their heads in Boston's history. That said, I think you have to say, based on the history of the franchise, that no, the Celtics aren't capable of netting quality free agents. I personally view the word quality to mean someone who can contribute significantly enough as to make the team substantially more dangerous than they were without that player. And no one jumps to mind. I would like to say that the Celtics are capable of anything with the current administration in place, because they have been the only administration willing to shake things up so far, but I can't really mean it, because I have no proof. As for next year's class, I don't see this trend getting bucked unfortunately. We're capped out, and mid-levels don't get important free agents anymore (if they ever did).
The Celts currently have 17 players on their roster. (technically 18 with Olowokandi still on the roster) http://www.nba.com/celtics/roster/ The NBA allows a maximum of 15 on the team so who do you get rid of and why?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting cMac44111:</div><div class="quote_post">The Celts currently have 17 players on their roster. (technically 18 with Olowokandi still on the roster) http://www.nba.com/celtics/roster/ The NBA allows a maximum of 15 on the team so who do you get rid of and why?</div> Another great question. I'm assuming Olowokandi is leaving via free agency, so I'll operate under that assumption. Now anyone can tell you there is going to be some serious contract eating going on in this particular regard, so this is a tough thing to take. You can either buy out Grant and get him off the books, or you can cut him and eat his salary, and it'll drag, but at least he'll be gone. One way or the other Grant has to go. He is no longer a contributing member of any NBA team, and I think we can safely say that his injuries are entirely too much for any player to have to bear at this point. I loved his game back in the day, but he's nothing to nobody now. That's one. For two, that's a toss up, and it's going to depend a lot on preseason. You have two candidates that the C's will have no trouble getting rid of, and probably will get rid of one of them, or we may see them in the D-League. Those two fellas are Allan Ray and Kevin Pittsnogle. You have the option of paying them not to play on your team and seeing how they develop, or you have the option of cutting them, paying them what you owe, and not worrying about roster space. Personally, if anyone, I get rid of Pittsnogle and call that group my roster. Dwayne Jones would be option number one if the D-League wasn't an option. He takes up space and doesn't produce, but we are so shy of big men that having him just one phone call away probably isn't a bad idea.
2 Questions ... The Celtics have a rich history of legends. What are some of your favorite Celtic nicknames? After watching the Redsox get swept by the Yankees, I thought about how the Celtics no longer have a true rivalry. A fiery rivalry usually leads to two teams trying to out duel each other in the offseason to stockpile talent and stay one step ahead of their rival. Every offseason you can guarantee the Yankees and Redsox will pursue big name free agents to keep the rivalry going. In the 80s the Celtics always made moves to counter their rivals in the Atlantic and to keep pace with the Lakers. Since the Bird-Era of Celtic basketball, the team hasn't been fueled by the same type of rivalries. Powerhouse rivals, Knicks & 76ers have equally struggled to get back to a Championship level. So I pose this question ... Has the lack of a true rival caused the Celtic franchise to be more complacent in roster moves as they were in the 80s? Had the Knicks and 76ers been more successful would the Celtics feel more pressure to win?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">2 Questions ... The Celtics have a rich history of legends. What are some of your favorite Celtic nicknames?</div> I always loved 'Jungle' Jim Loscutoff, his brutish nature and unrivaled spirit were some awesome motivating factors in his dubbing by Auerbach in the early going of the Celtics franchise. Loscutoff played a lot of power forward, but was actually the starting center when Bill Russell started his career 24 games into the 1956 season. He was actually the first enforcer in the NBA and the most notable until Laimbeer came along. More recently, you've got Vitaly 'Ukraine Train' Potapenko, as he was known here, once in Seattle he was more affectionately known as 'Potty,' which was closer to reality. Obviously the 'Ukraine Train' was tongue-in-cheek, but I loved it. 'Cornbread' was another good one. Max earned that one. More of an inside one would be Milt 'Full court Mort' Palacio. That story is a funny one. Bob Cousy accidentally called him 'Mort' on a broadcast, and it stuck with myself and my brothers. And since he could never score unless he was busting a press from half court, the Full Court part made sense too. I swear, that guy couldn't hit the rim unless he was taking a running layup he started 60 feet away. There are plenty more, and I'd love to hear what everyone else has to say to that one too. I think one of the most important nicknames in the history of Celtics' basketball isn't even their name. That would be 'Showtime,' a name I was glad to hear stick, and a name I miss. Which brings me to the next question... <div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">After watching the Redsox get swept by the Yankees, I thought about how the Celtics no longer have a true rivalry. A fiery rivalry usually leads to two teams trying to out duel each other in the offseason to stockpile talent and stay one step ahead of their rival. Every offseason you can guarantee the Yankees and Redsox will pursue big name free agents to keep the rivalry going. In the 80s the Celtics always made moves to counter their rivals in the Atlantic and to keep pace with the Lakers. Since the Bird-Era of Celtic basketball, the team hasn't been fueled by the same type of rivalries. Powerhouse rivals, Knicks & 76ers have equally struggled to get back to a Championship level. So I pose this question ... Has the lack of a true rival caused the Celtic franchise to be more complacent in roster moves as they were in the 80s? Had the Knicks and 76ers been more successful would the Celtics feel more pressure to win?</div> Aside from the pathetic mini-rivalries the Celtics had with the Nets and Sixers of this recent Celtics incarnation, we've had nothing to drive us. We fans cling to even the slightest whiff of rivalry, and we've had nothing in years. It's troublesome, yes, but no more so than the fact that we can't go deep into the playoffs anymore. We're getting pushed just enough by this Division to win it every now and again, but we're not being challenged [(or funded) or run capably] enough to win a championship, and that's killed everything having to do with the success of this team.
