<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>JERUSALEM (CNN) -- President Bush launched a sharp but veiled attack Thursday on Sen. Barack Obama and other Democrats, suggesting they favor "appeasement" of terrorists in the same way some Western leaders appeased Hitler in the run-up to World War II. President Bush called the idea of negotiating with terrorists a "foolish delusion." The president did not name Obama or any other Democrat, but White House aides privately acknowledged to CNN that the remarks were aimed at the presidential candidate and others in his party. After Bush's comments were widely reported, the White House denied they were an attack aimed at Obama. According to Obama's Web site, he favors "tough, direct presidential diplomacy with Iran without preconditions, and is willing to meet with the leaders of all nations, friend and foe." He does not favor talks with Hamas, which the U.S. government has listed as a terrorist group. Former President Jimmy Carter recently wrapped up a trip to the Middle East, which included talks with leaders of Hamas, an Islamic fundamentalist group that controls the Palestinian territory of Gaza. "Some seem to believe we should negotiate with terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," Bush said at Israel's 60th anniversary celebration in Jerusalem. "We have heard this foolish delusion before," Bush said in remarks to Israel's parliament, the Knesset. "As Nazi tanks crossed into Poland in 1939, an American senator declared: 'Lord, if only I could have talked to Hitler, all of this might have been avoided.' We have an obligation to call this what it is -- the false comfort of appeasement, which has been repeatedly discredited by history." Watch Bush describe what he calls a 'foolish delusion' » Doubts about Obama with Jewish Americans were earlier stoked by Sen. John McCain, the presumptive Republican nominee in the 2008 presidential election, when he recently charged that Obama is the favored candidate of Hamas. Obama last week called the Hamas allegation a "smear" and lashed out Thursday at Bush's speech in Israel. "It is sad that President Bush would use a speech to the Knesset on the 60th anniversary of Israel's independence to launch a false political attack," Obama said in a statement released to CNN by his campaign. "It is time to turn the page on eight years of policies that have strengthened Iran and failed to secure America or our ally Israel. ... "George Bush knows that I have never supported engagement with terrorists, and the president's extraordinary politicization of foreign policy and the politics of fear do nothing to secure the American people or our stalwart ally Israel," Obama's statement said. Watch the Obama camp's response to Bush »</div> Link
A response from Joe Biden: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Biden calls Bush comments 'bullshit' Posted: 12:55 PM ET From CNN Congressional Producer Ted Barrett Biden had some strong words for the president. (CNN) — The chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee Joe Biden, D-Delaware, called President Bush’s comments accusing Sen. Barack Obama and other Democrats of wanting to appease terrorists "bullshit” and said if the president disagrees so strongly with the idea of talking to Iran then he needs to fire his secretaries of State and Defense, both of whom Biden said have pushed to sit down with the Iranians. “This is bullshit. This is malarkey. This is outrageous. Outrageous for the president of the United States to go to a foreign country, sit in the Knesset…and make this kind of ridiculous statement,” Biden said angrily in a brief interview just off the Senate floor. “He’s the guy who’s weakened us. He’s the guy that’s increased the number of terrorists in the world. His policies have produced this vulnerability the United States has. His intelligence community pointed that out not me. The NIE has pointed that out and what are you talking about, is he going to fire Condi Rice? Condi Rice has talked about the need to sit down. So his first two appeasers are Rice and Gates. I hope he comes home and does something.” He quoted Gates saying Wednesday that we “need to figure out a way to develop some leverage and then sit down and talk with them.”</div> Link
Score one for Bush, actually. They're talking a lot on the news about this, and whether you agree with him or not, he's become very relevant by saying what needs to be said. While the press is intent on using things like Reverend Wright as a smokescreen to hide Obama's policy idea faults, this puts one of his major ideas front burner and subject to the real criticism the idea deserves. I, for one, don't care about who Obama may have in his circle of friends (they're not in his administration yet). I do care about negotiating with terrorist regimes from a position of weakness. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>"Some seem to believe we should negotiate with terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," Bush said at Israel's 60th anniversary celebration in Jerusalem. "We have heard this foolish delusion before," Bush said in remarks to Israel's parliament, the Knesset.</div> Bolded the important bit.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 01:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Score one for Bush, actually. They're talking a lot on the news about this, and whether you agree with him or not, he's become very relevant by saying what needs to be said. While the press is intent on using things like Reverend Wright as a smokescreen to hide Obama's policy idea faults, this puts one of his major ideas front burner and subject to the real criticism the idea deserves. I, for one, don't care about who Obama may have in his circle of friends (they're not in his administration yet). I do care about negotiating with terrorist regimes from a position of weakness. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>"Some seem to believe we should negotiate with terrorists and radicals, as if some ingenious argument will persuade them they have been wrong all along," Bush said at Israel's 60th anniversary celebration in Jerusalem. "We have heard this foolish delusion before," Bush said in remarks to Israel's parliament, the Knesset.</div> Bolded the important bit. </div> Please. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>"George Bush knows that I have never supported engagement with terrorists, and the president's extraordinary politicization of foreign policy and the politics of fear do nothing to secure the American people or our stalwart ally Israel," Obama said in a statement Thursday.</div> http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/storypage.aspx?StoryId=118390
LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 02:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> Gorbachev was a West-friendly reformist. Ahmadinejad is a crazed dictator.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 02:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> Gorbachev was a West-friendly reformist. Ahmadinejad is a crazed dictator. </div> And Obama will treat him like shit if he starts acting up. Doesn't matter. Are you implying he is going to let Israel get messed up then? Ridiculous. What a stupid scare tactic, his douchebag policies have made us less safe.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 06:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 02:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> Gorbachev was a West-friendly reformist. Ahmadinejad is a crazed dictator. </div> And Obama will treat him like shit if he starts acting up. Doesn't matter. </div> You mean he hasn't already? He violates the human rights of his own people, defied UN resolutions telling him to stop his nuclear program, and has called for Israel to be wiped off the map. If that's not acting up, I'm not sure I want to find out what Ahmadinejad acting up is. Maybe we should send Obama or Jimmy Carter to calm him down before he erupts.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 07:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 06:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 02:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> Gorbachev was a West-friendly reformist. Ahmadinejad is a crazed dictator. </div> And Obama will treat him like shit if he starts acting up. Doesn't matter. </div> You mean he hasn't already? He violates the human rights of his own people, defied UN resolutions telling him to stop his nuclear program, and has called for Israel to be wiped off the map. If that's not acting up, I'm not sure I want to find out what Ahmadinejad acting up is. Maybe we should send Obama or Jimmy Carter to calm him down before he erupts. </div> Oh you want Obama to start a war with Iran right now? One step at a time. Talking hurts no one.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> It wasn't a huge change in policy to negotiate with the Soviets, since prior presidents had been doing so, openly. There was a compelling interest in dealing with the Soviets - they had enough nukes to blow up the earth a few times over. I don't see anything close to this kind of interest in dealing with the Iranians, barring some real leverage, as Gates said.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 07:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> It wasn't a huge change in policy to negotiate with the Soviets, since prior presidents had been doing so, openly. There was a compelling interest in dealing with the Soviets - they had enough nukes to blow up the earth a few times over. I don't see anything close to this kind of interest in dealing with the Iranians, barring some real leverage, as Gates said. </div> What if a lucky peace treaty is negotiated? What the hell does it hurt to try. There's no case against it.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 07:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 07:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 06:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Real @ May 15 2008, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 02:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> Gorbachev was a West-friendly reformist. Ahmadinejad is a crazed dictator. </div> And Obama will treat him like shit if he starts acting up. Doesn't matter. </div> You mean he hasn't already? He violates the human rights of his own people, defied UN resolutions telling him to stop his nuclear program, and has called for Israel to be wiped off the map. If that's not acting up, I'm not sure I want to find out what Ahmadinejad acting up is. Maybe we should send Obama or Jimmy Carter to calm him down before he erupts. </div> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Oh you want Obama to start a war with Iran right now?</div></div> You said he didn't act up. What would you define 'acting up' as? <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>One step at a time. Talking hurts no one.</div> The United States has a policy of not negotiating with terrorists.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>You said he didn't act up. What would you define 'acting up' as?</div> You're talking about Obama like he's some traitor. He can always act like your boy McCain if nothing can be worked out (and if the situation merits some sort of physical response). <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The United States has a policy of not negotiating with terrorists.</div> We have perfect policies in place? Again, you're speaking as if Israel won't exist anymore the day he starts talking with our enemies.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>You said he didn't act up. What would you define 'acting up' as?</div> You're talking about Obama like he's some traitor. He can always act like your boy McCain if nothing can be worked out (and if the situation merits some sort of physical response). </div> I never insinuated that Obama or anyone else who wants to negotiate with Iran were traitors. I just don't think these people have a right to talk to us. Nor do I see any reason to talk with these people. But I have to ask. What would merit physical response? Would it be an attack on a United States' fleet or group of soldiers or one of its allies? Would it be a bad vibe Obama would get from Ahmadinejad? Would it be if these talks break down? I can say right now with confidence, if anything ever happened to the United States or one of its allies (Israel), then Obama would take as much heat for negotiating with this man as Clinton and Bush did for not doing more to prevent 9/11. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The United States has a policy of not negotiating with terrorists.</div> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>We have perfect policies in place?</div> No, but this one is good.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 05:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 07:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> It wasn't a huge change in policy to negotiate with the Soviets, since prior presidents had been doing so, openly. There was a compelling interest in dealing with the Soviets - they had enough nukes to blow up the earth a few times over. I don't see anything close to this kind of interest in dealing with the Iranians, barring some real leverage, as Gates said. </div> What if a lucky peace treaty is negotiated? What the hell does it hurt to try. There's no case against it. </div> Like the one Clinton negotiated with the North Koreans? http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/10/16/us.nkorea/ U.S.: North Korea admits nuke program From Andrea Koppel and John King CNN Washington Bureau Thursday, October 17, 2002 Posted: 9:07 AM EDT (1307 GMT) WASHINGTON (CNN) -- North Korea has revealed to the United States that it has a secret and active nuclear weapons program begun years after it promised to never again to pursue such a course, the White House said late Wednesday. One senior administration official said Pyongyang made the acknowledgment only after it was confronted with evidence that it has a uranium-based program and enough plutonium for at least two nuclear weapons. The North's admission prompted urgent consultations among the United States, Japan and South Korea -- the three nations that North Korea had promised under the so-called "agreed framework." The diplomatic term describes the 1994 agreement under which North Korea said it would no longer seek to develop nuclear weapons. In exchange, the United States and others agreed to help build two light water nuclear reactors to replace the plutonium-producing reactors Pyongyang was using, The Associated Press reported.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 07:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 05:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 07:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ May 15 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ May 15 2008, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LOL Score another one for Bush as Obama digs himself into a deeper hole. Ahmenidinijad is a terrorist, no matter what Obama says.</div> Much ado about nothing. I see nothing wrong with what Obama is doing. Reagan negotiated with the Soviets, I didn't see Bush bring that up. </div> It wasn't a huge change in policy to negotiate with the Soviets, since prior presidents had been doing so, openly. There was a compelling interest in dealing with the Soviets - they had enough nukes to blow up the earth a few times over. I don't see anything close to this kind of interest in dealing with the Iranians, barring some real leverage, as Gates said. </div> What if a lucky peace treaty is negotiated? What the hell does it hurt to try. There's no case against it. </div> Like the one Clinton negotiated with the North Koreans? http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/10/16/us.nkorea/ U.S.: North Korea admits nuke program From Andrea Koppel and John King CNN Washington Bureau Thursday, October 17, 2002 Posted: 9:07 AM EDT (1307 GMT) WASHINGTON (CNN) -- North Korea has revealed to the United States that it has a secret and active nuclear weapons program begun years after it promised to never again to pursue such a course, the White House said late Wednesday. One senior administration official said Pyongyang made the acknowledgment only after it was confronted with evidence that it has a uranium-based program and enough plutonium for at least two nuclear weapons. The North's admission prompted urgent consultations among the United States, Japan and South Korea -- the three nations that North Korea had promised under the so-called "agreed framework." The diplomatic term describes the 1994 agreement under which North Korea said it would no longer seek to develop nuclear weapons. In exchange, the United States and others agreed to help build two light water nuclear reactors to replace the plutonium-producing reactors Pyongyang was using, The Associated Press reported. </div> Yeah I guess we should never ever ever ever try then. Lol you want me to pull up the treaties/etc. we've successfully negotiated?
