Looking back over the 6-8 years, the biggest mistake Thorn made was the removal of Byron Scott. The conventional wisdom at the time of his release was that: A ) He couldn't coach, that was mostly done by Eddie Jordan and Lawrence Frank. and B ) Jason Kidd was responsible for the Nets winning, not Scott. While both are somewhat true, Jordan/Frank are great X's and O's guys and Kidd brings a lot to the table, with out Scott there has been no one on the Nets to challenge the team, to dictate that they win. Both Jordan and Frank have mired in mediocrity since becoming head coaches. Kidd has been unable to lead the Nets much of anywhere. Meanwhile, Scott is in the middle of another excellent season with the Hornets, with one of the best records in the NBA.
Another excellent season with NO? This is the first time he has had a winning record with NO and it will be his first postseason since NJ.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 2 2008, 02:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Another excellent season with NO? This is the first time he has had a winning record with NO and it will be his first postseason since NJ.</div> Scott took over a miserable team (post Baron Davis), in a tougher conference, through a tough period (post Katrina NO/Oklahoma) and has built one of the better teams in the league. Scott is now 2/2 for rebuilding bad teams in poor situations.
I give credit to the GM for that. People see his success now and forget what a horrible coach he was in NJ. I'm not a Hornets fan so I could care less what he does now, I just care what he did while he was here. If you guys want to have a short memory and forget thats fine but I won't.
he was lazy and didnt care in jersey. he let eddie jordan basically do whatever he wanted, EJ was def. in control and scott accepted that but i think his firing woke him up inside and he realzied he actually has to be a part of the team as a coach
There's been a bunch of these threads since the Hornets are hot. And I'm firmly anti-Scott. But, here's a deal: if the Hornets get past the second round of the playoffs, I'll admit I was 100% wrong and never post a bad thing about him as a coach again. And, conversely, all pro-Scott people have to do the same thing if they do not make it past the second round. Sound fair?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rory @ Feb 2 2008, 03:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>There's been a bunch of these threads since the Hornets are hot. And I'm firmly anti-Scott. But, here's a deal: if the Hornets get past the second round of the playoffs, I'll admit I was 100% wrong and never post a bad thing about him as a coach again. And, conversely, all pro-Scott people have to do the same thing if they do not make it past the second round. Sound fair?</div> That's not fair,cuz he's in the west.
I could coach the Hornets drunk off my ass, while getting blown by Rihanna and talking on my cell phone and The Hornets would still be one of the best teams in the West. They have that much talent.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 2 2008, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I give credit to the GM for that. People see his success now and forget what a horrible coach he was in NJ. I'm not a Hornets fan so I could care less what he does now, I just care what he did while he was here. If you guys want to have a short memory and forget thats fine but I won't.</div> It's funny, while Scott was here Thorn was GM of the year and widely loved by fans. Now all I read about is how everyone wants to get rid of Thorn. Now Scott is succeeding in NO because of their GM? Kind of odd if you ask me. You would think Scott must be doing something right.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ma3oxuct @ Feb 2 2008, 04:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Byron Scott is a great motivator. He gets players playing hard, something Frank is really bad at.</div> Exactly. For as much as Scott is deficient at X's and O's, he realizes that and delegates those tasks. Meanwhile he does a phenomenal job of getting his players to work hard.
Aside from a few around the league (Popovich, Jackson, Nelson, etc.), I find that the impact a coach has on a team's success is pretty overrated. Really, all a team needs is for the coach to not be a liability (to recognize changes and put his players in a position to win). The majority of the credit for a team's success should be given to the GM (Bower has done an incredible job the past few years) and the players (Chris Paul is ridiculous). On the other side, the Nets aren't suffering so much because of coaching as they are because of a poorly shaped roster. I doubt even the best coaches in the NBA could get a whole lot out of this team and Byron isn't even among that group.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 2 2008, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I give credit to the GM for that. People see his success now and forget what a horrible coach he was in NJ. I'm not a Hornets fan so I could care less what he does now, I just care what he did while he was here. If you guys want to have a short memory and forget thats fine but I won't.</div> It's funny, while Scott was here Thorn was GM of the year and widely loved by fans. Now all I read about is how everyone wants to get rid of Thorn. Now Scott is succeeding in NO because of their GM? Kind of odd if you ask me. You would think Scott must be doing something right. </div> We loved Thorn back then because he got us Kidd and surrounded Kidd with pieces that fit. Scott did not save this franchise, Thorn and Kidd did that. Scott was a horrible coach and still is a horrible coach. The Hornets management has gotten in players that work well together, while our management has just been throwing pieces together that simply do not work. We hate Thorn now because he has been doing a shitty job for the past few years, unlike he did during the 01-04 runs.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ma3oxuct @ Feb 2 2008, 04:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Byron Scott is a great motivator. He gets players playing hard, something Frank is really bad at.</div> Exactly. For as much as Scott is deficient at X's and O's, he realizes that and delegates those tasks. Meanwhile he does a phenomenal job of getting his players to work hard. </div> That was not the case when the Nets had a .500 record in 2004.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L @ Feb 2 2008, 05:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 2 2008, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I give credit to the GM for that. People see his success now and forget what a horrible coach he was in NJ. I'm not a Hornets fan so I could care less what he does now, I just care what he did while he was here. If you guys want to have a short memory and forget thats fine but I won't.</div> It's funny, while Scott was here Thorn was GM of the year and widely loved by fans. Now all I read about is how everyone wants to get rid of Thorn. Now Scott is succeeding in NO because of their GM? Kind of odd if you ask me. You would think Scott must be doing something right. </div> We loved Thorn back then because he got us Kidd and surrounded Kidd with pieces that fit. Scott did not save this franchise, Thorn and Kidd did that. Scott was a horrible coach and still is a horrible coach. The Hornets management has gotten in players that work well together, while our management has just been throwing pieces together that simply do not work. We hate Thorn now because he has been doing a shitty job for the past few years, unlike he did during the 01-04 runs. </div> Graph out the two teams since Scott was asked to leave the Nets and you will see they are trending in complete opposite directions. I am the first to admit that Scott is not, and never will be, a good X's and O's/game manager. But what Scott did do, and the Nets have lacked since he left, is fire and a sense of urgency. Even for the poor mixture of players the Nets currently have (which I completely agree with), to be a .500/sub .500 team in the EC with the players the Nets have is complete a total under performance. And to make it worse, everyone excepts it.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L @ Feb 2 2008, 05:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ma3oxuct @ Feb 2 2008, 04:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Byron Scott is a great motivator. He gets players playing hard, something Frank is really bad at.</div> Exactly. For as much as Scott is deficient at X's and O's, he realizes that and delegates those tasks. Meanwhile he does a phenomenal job of getting his players to work hard. </div> That was not the case when the Nets had a .500 record in 2004. </div> The Nets were 22-20 when Scott left and it was clear that Kidd shut the team down, mostly because he didn't want a coach telling him what to do.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 2 2008, 05:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Pat Riley must be a really shitty motivator, because his team has Dwyane Wade and is 9-36.</div> Riley is having a bad season, but has proven on more than one occasion that he is capable of motivating a team to the highest level. Frank can barely get the Nets to .500 in a weak conference.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 05:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L @ Feb 2 2008, 05:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ghost of Jason Collins @ Feb 2 2008, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 2 2008, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I give credit to the GM for that. People see his success now and forget what a horrible coach he was in NJ. I'm not a Hornets fan so I could care less what he does now, I just care what he did while he was here. If you guys want to have a short memory and forget thats fine but I won't.</div> It's funny, while Scott was here Thorn was GM of the year and widely loved by fans. Now all I read about is how everyone wants to get rid of Thorn. Now Scott is succeeding in NO because of their GM? Kind of odd if you ask me. You would think Scott must be doing something right. </div> We loved Thorn back then because he got us Kidd and surrounded Kidd with pieces that fit. Scott did not save this franchise, Thorn and Kidd did that. Scott was a horrible coach and still is a horrible coach. The Hornets management has gotten in players that work well together, while our management has just been throwing pieces together that simply do not work. We hate Thorn now because he has been doing a shitty job for the past few years, unlike he did during the 01-04 runs. </div> Graph out the two teams since Scott was asked to leave the Nets and you will see they are trending in complete opposite directions. I am the first to admit that Scott is not, and never will be, a good X's and O's/game manager. But what Scott did do, and the Nets have lacked since he left, is fire and a sense of urgency. Even for the poor mixture of players the Nets currently have (which I completely agree with), to be a .500/sub .500 team in the EC with the players the Nets have is complete a total under performance. And to make it worse, everyone excepts it. </div> Please, you are trying desperately that Scott's firing is the reason the Nets have been on the decline. You are ignoring specific factors in this: Harris, Martin, Kittles, key components to the Nets teams, left the following summer. At that point, the team's decline was due to their departure, not Scott. Also, take a look back on that year and you'll see that as soon as Frank stepped in, the Nets improved dramatically, only losing to the eventual champs with a Kidd with one leg. The season carter stepped in was in turmoil since Martin and other key components were gone. It was not until the Carter trade did we come back into the playoff mix. And of course, at that point as we all know, the team Thorn just made had no depth unlike the previous Nets teams that were under Scott, and for a short time, under Frank. The decline of the Nets became apparent and if you look closely, Thorn is the reason for the decline. He structured the past few teams poorly, ignoring the fact that Carter and Kidd dont mix well, and he grossly overpaid free agents that never contributed(McInnis and Magloire are the obvoius examples). Yes the Nets are under performing, but I guarantee you that even if Scott were the head coach here, things would be no different. Hell, I would even bet that they would be worse. Now as for the Hornets, they already entered rebuilding as soon as Scott got there. Of course there would be an improvement. Ask yourself, how the hell do you go worse from "rebuilding?" Plus you claim that firing Scott was Thorn's biggest mistake. I say him refusing to rebuild is his biggest mistake.
