<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">21st January, 2007 - 11:39 am New York Post - Sources throughout the NBA tell Peter Vecsey that Pau Gasol has asked for a trade to a playoff contender and that the Grizzlies will attempt to oblige. Jerry West has reportedly discussed a trade with three teams, one of them being Chicago. Talks have centered around Ben Gordon and Luol Deng. "Giving up Gordon and Deng would be very difficult," a Bulls insider insisted. "John will never go there. Not even if Scott Skiles and the rest of the coaching staff is beating on him to make that swap, which isn't the case." [READ]</div> Source
I really would be disappointed if this deal went down involving anyone of the main players on our team (Gordon, Deng, Hinrich, Tyrus, Wallace). I realize the quality player Gasol is, but I don't see him as someone who can take over a game down the stretch, or someone that will put us over the hump. Our team is just starting to mesh this would be a bad move.
I don't like the deal at all. We don't know how dedicated Gasol would be to this franchise meanwhile Gordon and Deng are both very dedicated players. Both players have insisted on never leaving the city because they love the atmosphere. I don't think Paxson will make this specific deal from rumor, but knowing him if the chance to get Gasol comes up he may be able to come up with something that wouldn't make him give him Gordon, Deng, Hinrich, or Noce. That's just how Pax is, he is too high on these players. He treats them like they're his children. <div class="quote_poster">I-Miss-MJ Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">If we get rid of Deng I will stop being a Bulls supporter.</div> A joke I'd hope.
Gordon AND Deng is waay too much for Gasol, but seriously Deng for Gasol is a pretty good deal with whatever contracts added like PJ or something, I know, know it's tough to give up someone as good as Deng, but to get something you have to be willing to part with something just as good. Gasol (Beard) and Big Ben (Fro) would be a scary frontcourt, and Gasol, while he's no KG, he would provide the post presence the Bulls need and would become true contendors. Right now the Bulls can win the east, but in the finals, West should dominate. Can we please just get KG?? Though I am surprised Pau is getting upset with the Griz, it's his team, he's gotta carry them, getting tired of this crap of players asking to be traded, what happened to loyalty, then again the lure of winning one is pretty intense. I'd be happy just chilling on the Hawks.
<div class="quote_poster">holyace2k2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> Though I am surprised Pau is getting upset with the Griz, it's his team, he's gotta carry them, getting tired of this crap of players asking to be traded, what happened to loyalty, then again the lure of winning one is pretty intense. I'd be happy just chilling on the Hawks.</div> I agree with you to an extent, loyalty can only go so far, ultimately every players goal in the league is to win a championship. You have to understand where Gasol is coming from. he is 27 years old, and watching his team trade away all their veterans for young players, and heading into rebuilding mode. He wants to win now, before its too late. Can't blame him for that. With that said...keep him far away from Chicago!!!!!!!
How about this P.J. Brown, 2007 pick, 2nd round 2007 picks, 2008 pick, Chris Duhon, and Mike Sweetney? Kirk Hinrich 34/Ben Gordon 14 Ben Gordon 20/Thabo Sefolosha 20/LD 8 Luol Deng 23/Andres Nocioni 25 Pau Gasol 20/Tyrus Thomas 20/AN 8 Ben Wallace 34/Pau Gasol 14 Chris Duhon/Damon Stoudamire/Chucky Atkins Mike Miller (free agency or second round picks from Chicago) Rudy Gay/Hakim Warrick/Memphis second round pick Alexander Johnson/Mike Sweetney/(Bulls 2007 pick) P.J. Brown/(Memphis pick) -own Bulls 2008 pick lol. Thats not going to happen tho. Its just fun to think about if it happened. Trading both Luol Deng and Ben Gordon would be stupid. Our line-up would then be Kirk Hinrich Thabo Sefolosha Andres Nocioni Pau Gasol Ben Wallace this means if Kirk Hinrich or Andres Nocioni has a bad shooting night its an automatic lose.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">this means if Kirk Hinrich or Andres Nocioni has a bad shooting night its an automatic lose.</div> Howso? Gasol is capable for 20 ppg any night and can score from almost anywhere on the court. He's a franchise-caliber player, and you guys are scared to give up reserves for him? You have to give something up to get anything in return, and right now Gasol's a legit 7'0"+, is entering his prime, and has been improving all aspects of his game every season to the point where he's a triple-double threat every time he steps onto the court with his passing abilities. "I want M.J. on my team, but I really, really don't want to have to give up Brian Cardinal, maybe Jake Tsakalidis and some draft picks."
<div class="quote_poster">Voodoo Child Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Howso? Gasol is capable for 20 ppg any night and can score from almost anywhere on the court. He's a franchise-caliber player, and you guys are scared to give up reserves for him? You have to give something up to get anything in return, and right now Gasol's a legit 7'0"+, is entering his prime, and has been improving all aspects of his game every season to the point where he's a triple-double threat every time he steps onto the court with his passing abilities. "I want M.J. on my team, but I really, really don't want to have to give up Brian Cardinal, maybe Jake Tsakalidis and some draft picks."</div> Gordon and Deng are not exactly reserves, both have the ability to average at least 20 a night if made into the primary scorer of a franchise. I understand what Gasol brings to the table offensively, and how valuable a big man is in the league these days, but giving up Deng and/or Gordon is too much imo when you have invested a top five pick in Tyrus Thomas to play power forward in the future. I'd rather hold on to our guys than trade for Gasol. That's just me though. Especially when we know the Grizzlies have no leverage to demand either of those guys (since Gasol has already demanded a trade). With the franchise possible being sold this off season they want to save as much money as possible. I don't expect them to get much value for Gasol, if he is traded.
<div class="quote_poster">Blur Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Gordon and Deng are not exactly reserves, both have the ability to average at least 20 a night if made into the primary scorer of a franchise. I understand what Gasol brings to the table offensively, and how valuable a big man is in the league these days, but giving up Deng and/or Gordon is too much imo when you have invested a top five pick in Tyrus Thomas to play power forward in the future. I'd rather hold on to our guys than trade for Gasol. That's just me though.</div> I know they're not reserves. I was just exaggerrating to make a point, but still, neither one is individually on Gasol's level, and when you combine them both you just have to third echelon NBA players. The Grizzlies have survived as a franchise up to this point off of having a ton of third echelon stars but no more than one legitimate superstar. Look back at the Hubie Brown coached ten man rotations. Every player in that rotation was great, from Mike Miller to Shane Battier, and because of that they won over 50 games, but then they got swept in the playoffs because they didn't have the same assertive offensive weapons that other teams had. In short, they were too well-rounded, if that's possible. I can see the interest in a deal like Gasol for Bryant, Gasol for Garnett, Gasol for Duncan, Gasol for Kidd, or Gasol for McGrady. Anything along those lines, but Ben Gordon or Luol Deng? That'd put the Grizzlies further back than they already are, especially considering how stacked they are on the wings at the moment - they need a post presence. Besides, I wouldn't be clinging to Tyrus Thomas as the future of my franchise at this point. He was a top five pick? So what? That title doesn't mean anything. The 2006 draft wasn't exactly something to write home about. It's not like it was comparable to the '03 draft, or even the '04/'05 drafts for that matter. It was one of the weakest drafts that I can recall, very similar to the 2002 draft, where your #2-6 picks were Jay Williams, Mike Dunleavy, Drew Gooden, Nickoloz Tskitishvili, and Dajuan Wagner. I can't see Thomas doing any better than any of those guys in the pro's. He lacks the size to play in the post, he has a hitch in his jumper that'll prevent him from ever being a perimeter player, as well as the fact that he can't handle the ball and isn't quick enough with his first step to pick apart defenses, and he has an overall passive attitude and sporadic work ethic that'll limit his development. He's Stromile Swift, Jr.
<div class="quote_poster">Voodoo Child Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> Besides, I wouldn't be clinging to Tyrus Thomas as the future of my franchise at this point. He was a top five pick? So what? That title doesn't mean anything. The 2006 draft wasn't exactly something to write home about. It's not like it was comparable to the '03 draft, or even the '04/'05 drafts for that matter. It was one of the weakest drafts that I can recall, very similar to the 2002 draft, where your #2-6 picks were Jay Williams, Mike Dunleavy, Drew Gooden, Nickoloz Tskitishvili, and Dajuan Wagner. I can't see Thomas doing any better than any of those guys in the pro's. He lacks the size to play in the post, he has a hitch in his jumper that'll prevent him from ever being a perimeter player, as well as the fact that he can't handle the ball and isn't quick enough with his first step to pick apart defenses, and he has an overall passive attitude and sporadic work ethic that'll limit his development. He's Stromile Swift, Jr.</div> From all the reports out of Chicago, they have had nothing but positive things to say about Tyrus Thomas' attitude. He is working with a trainer to get his weight up, while maintaining his quickness and speed. I don't think his work ethic is a problem. He has already shown flashes of being something special in the future. He is 19 years old way to early to judge how good a player he will be in the future in my opinion. Ariza, Iguodala, Howard, Bryant, etc. have all added at least 15 pounds of muscle since coming into the league its not hard to believe Tyrus Thomas can do the same thing.
<div class="quote_poster">Blur Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">From all the reports out of Chicago, they have had nothing but positive things to say about Tyrus Thomas' attitude. He is working with a trainer to get his weight up, while maintaining his quickness and speed. I don't think his work ethic is a problem. He comes to work, and has shown flashes of being something special in the future. He is 19 years old way to early to judge how good a player he will be in the future in my opinion. Ariza, Iguodala, Howard, Bryant, etc. have all added at least 15 pounds of muscle since coming into the league its not hard to believe Tyrus Thomas can do the same thing.</div> Of course they've had nothing but good things to say about him, they're sources that have everything to gain by playing him up to be a great prospect. His work ethic is definitely questionable though. I saw a lot of LSU games last season and he was really moody, even zoning out at times during the game and just going through the motions. He'd play his hardest in big game situations but coast through the gimmes. And don't you remember the way the guy bullied DraftExpress this summer for listing him too low in their mock? The guy was a total punk in that situation. As for his size, it's not his weight that's the problem as much as it is his height, he's just a shade over 6'7" and has absolutely no game outside of ten feet. Also, I don't think that it's impossible to judge talent at the age of 19. In fact, I think it's very easy. I've played with tons of players who were up-and-coming stars, and I knew which ones would be talented players in the future and which ones were bound to be busts. By that same standard, I've been following college ball closely for about ten years and have been able to make the same judgements about guys in their freshmen and sophomores seasons just as well as I could in their junior and senior seasons.
<div class="quote_poster">Voodoo Child Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Of course they've had nothing but good things to say about him, they're sources that have everything to gain by playing him up to be a great prospect. His work ethic is definitely questionable though. I saw a lot of LSU games last season and he was really moody, even zoning out at times during the game and just going through the motions. He'd play his hardest in big game situations but coast through the gimmes. And don't you remember the way the guy bullied DraftExpress this summer for listing him too low in their mock? The guy was a total punk in that situation. As for his size, it's not his weight that's the problem as much as it is his height, he's just a shade over 6'7" and has absolutely no game outside of ten feet. </div> He is 6'7" but his wing span allows him to play a big mans game. Did you watch the recent game against the Spurs? He was matched up against Tim Duncan, and Duncan could not get any shot off over Tyrus. He pretty much took Duncan out of the game while he was on the court. I saw the interview he did with draftexpress I agree it was pretty low move, but it really doesn't show much about his work ethic. He was upset that he was ranked low, wouldn't you be upset if someone (in your mind) disrespected your game and the work and time you put into it? Sure he could have gave the politically correct answers, but can we penalize him for speaking what he really feels? The reason I say it's too early to judge him at 19 is because of how much he can develop from now until his prime. The experience he will gain playing under Wallace and Brown is also another thing you have to account for. Not every player in the world is the same, as I'm sure you know. Just because one guys career went a certain path doesn't mean every player that fits that profile is destined to end up in the same position. Also something I want to revisit really quick is Gordon and Deng being "third echelon" players, and the comparison to the roster the Grizzlies had a while back. Gordon and Deng have yet to even scratch the surface of their prime. Who is to say they won't become franchise players? I doubt anyone considered Mcgrady or even Bryant a franchise player based on their early seasons in the league. That's all for tonight/this morning gotta go to bed, 7:30 class tomorrow. One.
Why don't we give up Hinrich and Noc, too? haha, no dam way. We cannot give up Gordon and Deng...no no no. This Bulls team is making a connection, we cannot have this trade static during this Bulls team connection.
Gordon will be the next gilbert arenas in about a year our 2 I'm not giving him up. But deng PJ for Gasol is great. Both teams win The grizz would have to give us another desent guard or forward to make me happy. but that trade is realistic Hinrich gordon Noch Gasol Wallace Thats one hell of a starting lineup
