Nurk Fever - second wave?

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Rastapopoulos, Nov 7, 2021.

  1. HomerLovesKoolAid

    HomerLovesKoolAid I have a well-known member.

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    I got vaxxed. No Nurk fever for me.

    He has played well the last few games against weaker matchups. I'm skeptical of his maturity level, ability to finish and limit his turnovers when being shown a double team against a good defense, and mostly, not having an immature meltdown in a high-pressure game and committing dumb fouls.
     
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  2. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

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    Not on the Blazers please.
     
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  3. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you.
     
  4. Strenuus

    Strenuus Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Max contract for a completely inefficient and oft checked out center?

    Nah.
     
  5. BonesJones

    BonesJones https://www.youtube.com/c/blazersuprise

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    Steals + Blocks does not equal good defense. I've seen RoCo let his guy drive past him numerous times just so he can try to reach around for a steal. Blocks and steals make up 6% of his defensive possessions, what about the other 94%? He was rough defensively for the majority of this season.
     
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  6. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    “I’ve seen him” doesn’t make someone a bad defender either. I’ll trust the numbers, especially when they all suggest the same thing.
     
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  7. BonesJones

    BonesJones https://www.youtube.com/c/blazersuprise

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    DBPM is a terrible advanced stat that's way too dependent upon steals and blocks.
     
  8. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    Very poor take at best. 6% of his possessions are blocks and steals so 94% are bad? Nope.
     
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  9. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    it is... I speak from experience. Hey....a double-dog-dare can't be ignored. Everybody knows that
     
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  10. KSF-ERIC

    KSF-ERIC Well-Known Member

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    Is he inefficient?
     
  11. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Players that average at least 1 steal and 1 block per game

    Herbert Jones
    Thybulle
    KAT
    LeBron
    Draymond
    Embiid
    Giannis
    JJJ
    Roco

    So 9 players in the entire league. The vast majority of that list are plus defenders, so getting blocks AND steals probably does equal good defense.
     
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  12. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

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    That's not how BPM is calculated.

    You have to remember the following:

    The Stats for the BPM are calculated based in relation to the other players on the team (so if the team has very few shot blockers for example, even a mediocre shot blocker's value would be increased) - in addition, the regression is based on position played.

    I would certainly pay attention to basketball reference's own notes on BPM - https://www.basketball-reference.com/about/bpm2.html

    "Box Plus/Minus is good at measuring offense and solid overall, but the defensive numbers in particular should not be considered definitive"

    I would argue that RoCo was a good defender last year, has definitely seemed to have been pretty poor earlier this year - but seems to have recovered some since - have not seen enough to say if it is all the way to where he was before. He still seems to be a decent defensive player at worst, but even last year he was more of a good team/help defender than an individual defender.
     
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  13. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    agreed:

    upload_2022-1-18_15-49-29.png

    upload_2022-1-18_15-50-9.png

    upload_2022-1-18_15-50-38.png

    upload_2022-1-18_15-54-8.png

    I guess this is where somebody says stats can be misleading. But it is a less credible claim when all the stats say the same thing

    the only mitigation is that those compare him to the rest of the team and that's a low standard
     
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  14. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    actually if you take it further and just count non centers, the list is

    Thybulle
    Jones
    Giannis
    Lebron
    Draymond
    Roco

    So you’re telling me it’s all first team caliber defenders except for RoCo? Yeah, I’m gonna have to disagree there.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2022
  15. BonesJones

    BonesJones https://www.youtube.com/c/blazersuprise

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    What the fuck? I never said that because 6% of his possessions are blocks and steals automatically means that the other 94% is bad. Just that 6% of his defense is just that: a very small percentage of possessions. Don't put words in my mouth.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2022
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  16. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    Guess you didn't read the comment completely. It says "Nope" at the end.
     
  17. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    Defense is played as a team. One player breaking down can lead to a total collapse and it can even make another player look really bad. Players around him do matter. Overall defensive work ethic and just plain hustle make a huge difference. We have all watched a bad team play three or four good possessions in a row when they are locked in.
     
  18. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    What the fuck????
    You literally did.
    It may not say what you meant but yes, that is exactly what you said. This is not semantics either. This is word for word.
     
  19. BonesJones

    BonesJones https://www.youtube.com/c/blazersuprise

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    Yeah you completely misread that. I'm saying that 6% isn't a big enough sample size to determine how good or bad of a defender he is. Somehow you made that out as me saying any possession he doesn't get a steal or block is bad...
     
  20. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Well-Known Member

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    Yeah that's it. It was me that misread that. Now who is putting words into someone's mouth?
    What i said was QUOTE "Very poor take at best".

    I agree with you on "Blocks and Steals do not always make a great defender". CJ pretty much proves this.
     

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