OFFICIAL Around The NBA Thread...... August

I like Swanigan.....for a second year big, he's got a lot of skills ….let's say that Man you hate Swanigan and just leave it at that....he's not a starter...we're not talking about a rookie Anthony Davis here but please..don't get carried away with some Olshey draft angst...

 

I'm being serious. You seem to really like the end of the bench guys like Swanigan and Layman. You're optimism has singlehandedly silenced both my criticism and my pessimism: time will tell.

As to Olshey draft angst...I that ain't me. What I don't like is Olshey's face.

 

Olshey is great at drafting, but C'mon guys let's be realistic, he fucked up that Pick by selecting Swanigan

 

This season Layman and Swanigan will not be those end of the bench guys...in my view both are poised to make a big leap this season...with Ed gone...Biggie will get some court time. I never go into a season with all this doubt about former end of the bench players...if they can't crack the rotation, they will lose the opportunity...training camp should be competitive for rotation spots..

 

I’m not your bro Euro guy.

 

Sure he did - in hindsight, but if we're being realistic the draft is a crap shoot. It's not an exact science, especially when picking late in the 1st round. Hell, in most drafts, there are more bad picks than good picks when picking in the lottery.

Sure - in hindsight, Kuzma is a much better player than Swanigan, but there were reasons Kuzma was available at 27. It's not like the Blazers were the only ones who passed on him. It just looks worse because he was picked immediately after Swanigan. There were all kinds of concerns about Kuzma's work ethic and attitude. He hadn't exactly distinguished himself in 3 years at Utah.

Swanigan had no doubts about his work ethic. It was already something of legend. In addition to the well documented weight loss, in his two years at Purdue, Swanigan went from backup to the best player on his team to a 1st team All American.

And then there is the age thing. Not only is Kuzma two years older than Swanigan, he's actually older than Noah Vonleh (it seems impossible that Vonleh still isn't 23).

Swanigan was viewed as a safer pick. Not someone who would ever be an all star, or even a starter, but a guy who would work his way into the rotation just with his hustle and rebouding. Kuzma was viewed as a high risk with little upside. In hindsight, Kuzma was the far better pick. That's just the way it happens sometimes.

I'm more interested in how our 10th pick works out. He's shown great potential at the defensive end, but has a LONG way to go at the offensive end. We all know that and I think he does, too. So, gosh darn it, get that young man a proven big man coach to help him reach his full potential. As a bonus, a proven big man coach might help teach Swanigan how to get his shot off against NBA big men, as that seems to be his biggest weakness.

BNM

 

Lol

Had a DBPM of over 3 for the Bulls in all 3 seasons, so what exactly did you "see"?

 

Why so aggressive? I thought you are a cool guy

 

I have to assume this is fake, but kinda wish it wasn't:

 

It's not a Fake. The carmelo Anthony Account who said fuck you has over 6 Million follower

 

I'm going to be a super-optimist and say that it's too early to say that. I happen to think that Kuzma isn't going to sustain his play, and that it's all on offense anyway. Some players have their best years in their rookie years, and I'm betting he's one of them.
Meanwhile, I think everyone here is way too down on Swanigan. Shit, he must be doing something right that we've done so well in Summer League with him as the featured player two years' running. I think he does things to help the team even when he's struggling (his passing and general unselfishness is underrated). He's a bit of a victim of over-inflated expectations after his first Summer League, and then ended up getting very little PT under Stotts. Maybe letting Ed go was partly Olshey's desire to force Stotts to play him?
Any way, we'll see. He has glaring current weaknesses - getting his shot off and defense (other than maybe in the post), but he's still got a solid jump shot, he moves the ball well, and he hustles like crazy.

 

I think that Jordan Bell was the overwhelming favorite on the board with that pick. Yes, most slept on Kuzma, including Neil and many other GM’s, but most people here were not happy with the Swanigan pick.

 

I already answered that. He routinely left his man to get in rebounding position, favoring the measurable stat over hard-to-quantify defense. Chicago's team defense was good enough to allow him to do that, which lets him off the hook in the stats department.

Go back and watch full games, if you can, of his time with Detroit and Chicago. You'll see a vastly inferior defender in the latter years.

I was a Bulls fan whenever they weren't playing the Blazers. I had no reason to root against Rodman.

 

So he must be an NBA player because he's won games in Summer League? If he's struggling on offense and defense he still helps the team because he's unselfish?

He's not a victim of overinflated expectations. A lot of people who pointed out why they don't like him as a player are still observing those very same things.

Letting Ed go was to open up minutes for Collins.

Not being able to get shots off and being poor defender is pretty damning.

All of us want him to succeed, however it's split on people really searching hard for enough positives to justify the pick, and the people that predicted these problems for him before he was drafted.

 

He had similar numbers before and after Chicago, then why are advanced stats so much in his favor in other places, if team performance is the only reason?

 

Bigs in their second season who spent half the first season in the minors haven't garnered the experience of playing against vet competition night in and night out...Swanigan is just a second year big....sets good screens...hustles...rebounds...passes well...can shoot...people just see that he's not a dunker ...his game isn't playing above the rim and once he gets some burn against quality NBA bigs he'll start to figure out how to adjust. He's already a really good rebounder. He's not going to be Sheed but he could become Kurt Thomas or even Zbo..people forget how young he is. This is a big season for Swanigan...he has an opportunity to earn minutes. I don't know how anybody can count him out in the few NBA minutes he's played so far. Small sample size....without Ed he'll get a shot...we'll see what he does with it. As far as being an NBA player..he is an NBA player. Just a young inexperienced one so far who plays hard when given a chance. I wanted Jordan Bell in that draft but that's because I've seen Bell play live and loved his game...I didn't know who Swanigan was until we drafted him...I'm not throwing him under the bus though...if that happens he'll have to show me he isn't a rotation player...so far nobody has that knowledge yet..all speculation at this point.

 

By similar numbers, you mean offensive and rebounding, I assume? He was an all-time great rebounder and an all-time sucky offensive player, so yeah, I wouldn't expect the measurables to change much.

And "before and after Chicago" must mean before and during? Because Rodman basically didn't play after Chicago.

You were born around the time he played in Chicago, if I'm not mistaken? You really need to watch full games (not highlights, not stats) of him during that period to understand how he played on defense. That team made lots of defensive zeroes "look" pretty good on that end of the court.

 

That doesn’t make much sense... That team had “lots” of defensive zeroes, but made them look good. How does that add up? Scottie and MJ played defense for 5?
I know this will come across snarky, but I just don’t get your comment. A bunch of defensive zeroes all looked good on defense...

 

Yeah, I'm sure your 25-year old eye test is flawless compared to statistical analysis.

You realize BPM takes into account team performance? So you're one reason to try to invalidate it doesn't hold up.