The way it sounds so far, the rotation is gonna be tight. GUARDS: Davis and J-Rich are looking at 38-40 minutes each. Fisher and Pietrus will gobble up every other minute available. Poor Monta is only an injury away from a minor contribution. There will be injuries so if he's as impressive as advertised, we'll definitely get a glimps of what he can do. SMALL FORWARD: Dunleavy's at probably 30-35 minutes. Pietrus will take a few of the minutes from time to time, but look for Chewy to get the majority of his time here. POWER FORWARD/ CENTER: I see a four man rotation, with Murphy and Foyle starting. Ike will play major minutes right away, and Biedrins' time should increase after his strong finish last year. I also see Ike and Murphy finishing games this year, unless we're playing against Shaq, or someone who only Foyle can handle. Chewy will get a few minutes here at the 4, but these other four will get the bulk of the time. I don't see Taft getting much run unless there's an injury. THE REST: I hope we don't see much of Cheaney this year. Nothing against him but the young guys need every minute available. I think Calberts here as insurance, in case more than one of our guys go down. Justin Davis, Miles, N'diaye, etc. no chance for much if any time. We'd have to be decimated by injuries for these guys to smell the floor. Unless we regularly blow teams out. Solid ten man rotation, with Biedrins and Chewy grabbing the fewest minutes out of the ten. If either one gets hot, then time will increase. I love our rotation. We can go in so many different directions. Each player brings something tangible and slightly different than the next guy. A tough defensive three, is the only thing missing, but do we really need it? Maybe Dunleavy or Cabarkapa will surprise us with some tenacity this year.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mylie10:</div><div class="quote_post">SMALL FORWARD: Dunleavy's at probably 30-35 minutes. Pietrus will take a few of the minutes from time to time, but look for Chewy to get the majority of his time here.</div> I think you are crazy to think Zarko is going to get more minutes at the 3 than Pietrus. Pietrus will be on the court for any amount of minutes not played by Jrich or Dunleavy. Unless both are out at the same time, then Zarko will play mostly in between the 3,4 and 5...
I think Pietrus will get most of his minutes at the 2, and guarding point guards. Of course Piety will play some three! I wish he was our starting 3. But Dunleavy's going to get major time, as is Fisher, and these 2 will take away from Pietrus. I think Zarko will get the majority of his minutes at the three. Ike is the real deal, and That'll take away from Zarko playing much of the four. Zarko's not looking at alot of minutes at all. But he'll definitley be in the rotation.
Diogu's the real deal. He's a monster. He's got the attitude in the paint we've been missing. He likes contact. He's everthing Foyle isn't. Don't you wish that one time Foyle would square off on someone?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mylie10:</div><div class="quote_post">Diogu's the real deal. He's a monster. He's got the attitude in the paint we've been missing. He likes contact. He's everthing Foyle isn't. Don't you wish that one time Foyle would square off on someone?</div> How can you say that when he hasnt played a minute in the NBA yet?
I watched him play alot of games. While I'm not saying he's the next (insert name here), I do think his game is one of pure tenacity. He just keeps coming at you. Some guys just have a way of bringing it that makes you go, " man they can't stop this dude". You might block his shot, but he'll get the rebound and jamb it down your throat, get the foul call, and sink the free throw. Of course it'll take a little time for him to adjust to his team and the plays, but we'll see it click one day and then watch out. And I mean one day soon. He's gonna be so much better than some are thinking. This will be another feather in Mullins hat by mid season. This is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt. By the way Warriorsfan, your sig is hella tight!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mylie10:</div><div class="quote_post">I watched him play alot of games. While I'm not saying he's the next (insert name here), I do think his game is one of pure tenacity. He just keeps coming at you. Some guys just have a way of bringing it that makes you go, " man they can't stop this dude". You might block his shot, but he'll get the rebound and jamb it down your throat, get the foul call, and sink the free throw. Of course it'll take a little time for him to adjust to his team and the plays, but we'll see it click one day and then watch out. And I mean one day soon. He's gonna be so much better than some are thinking. This will be another feather in Mullins hat by mid season. This is just my opinion so take it with a grain of salt. By the way Warriorsfan, your sig is hella tight!</div> Well, I hope you are right. I hope he is like Amare but I just dont know. I hear people comparing him to Elton Brand. I never really liked Brand's game. He seemed too soft. That is what Diogu looks like to me. I want to see a big guy look to dunk the ball every time he has it. Heck, I even want Jrich and Baron to have that mentality. Like Vince Carter, Kobe, or McGrady. I hope you are right. I think we will be able to tell by mid season if he is for real or not.... BTW, the sig was made by CustodianRules2...
Ike's not like Amare. Amare is an athletic freak. But Amare doesn't have the refined offensive game of Diogu. If Diogu had the athleticism of Amare, we'd be looking at the next great player. Diogu's not going to average 26points a game on this team, but in the future he's going to become Barons go to guy. Which could mean awesome numbers for him and us.
Well guys, I think we should wait and see first how this rotation will pan out. If we're gutsy we might even play Murphy at center like you guys mentioned (like Mehmet Okur or Predrag Drobnjak). I know not too great defensively, but Murphy can knock down an open jump shot from the elbow almost unconsciously and play for the rebound on defense. I think Ike has a great chance to be Elton Brand mixed with Zach Randolph. To me he seems like he has the physical tools of an Elton Brand, but he plays more like a hustle Zach Randolph with the spin moves. So I think we will get an improving player over the years that has an upside of 18/10 or 20/10 with a few blocked shots and some assists. Maybe that's optimistic, but strength + I.Q. + coordination + agility + aggressiveness + skill + length + soft gigantic hands + finesse means a lot of things to me. He can take bigger guys off the dribble. He ain't no Jamaal Mashburn or Magic Johnson, but he drags along 250 lbs with the ball just fine. He's not flashy, but then again most big guys aren't. Below the rim, but effective is good enough for me. We'll see. Imagine if Ike played some center in some minutes. It is possible playing against some Eastern Conference teams and maybe against the Suns. Sure Amare will score on us, but if Ike takes him into early foul trouble, we can keep on pace. I'm hoping Ike and Andris is the wave of the future since both can block shots, posess great hands, play with great energy and can rebound the ball. Ike has the option of shooting from the outside whenever Biedrins is strong enough to compete down low. I've got faith that Biedrins will be a good inside player once he gets strong enough and more comfortable with his back to the basket. He's got great touch from anywhere 10 feet in, good passing instincts, fast feet and he can dribble some. If not he can still deliver the Marcus Camby or Kmart type finish on the break or putback. (or when he is ready to stay on his feet through contact... an alley-oop. Remember this dude can jump a tad higher from a standstill as Carmelo Anthony and that guy is considered quite an athlete). http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft/d05/tr...?playerId=18628 for the non-believers.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mylie10:</div><div class="quote_post">Diogu's not going to average 26points a game on this team, but in the future he's going to become Barons go to guy. Which could mean awesome numbers for him and us.</div> Can you say "pick and roll"? Ike and Baron could be dangerous in this mode. I don't care if Ike is slow, he is a baller. Name a big man that has that many ways to score and plays like a big man. I'll take power, strong work ethic, inside game, finesse, I.Q., good hands, hustle, and a guy that has broken some college league records anyday over raw athletes with no brains, no hands, no skill, no work ethic, no indication that they could be an impact player (Kirilenko, Pietrus, Parker, Yao Ming etc. are exceptions of course). We were looking for a big player that can bang inside, rebound, play defense and we found one that has a good chance to do what most international players are still learning to do or don't practice as often with that weird trapezoidal key they have in international ball. Luckily, for us the NCAA prospects and high schoolers have a lot of those rare players that are used to playing back to the basket with a more narrow key. I wasn't too certain about Diogu at his size and speed, but who can we be certain about when all the big name players that are true inside guys are taught to play in the States. So chances are good the best back to the basket players are guys who learned in high school or college and made some impact. If guys like Randolph and Brand have qualities that Diogu posesses then chances are good that Diogu could very well bring the surefire impact that they do on more than one level. Would I have liked to take more risk? Sure, but we drafted for need and we needed muscle up front rather than another swing position. We got former #1 overall (early fall mock-draft) Chris Taft as safety insurance for tasking high risk/high potential players. On comparing Amare to Diogu. Sure, I think Amare Stoudamire is the better player than Diogu by far with/or without the right help (i.e. Nash/Marbury as setup guys) because of his combination of size, speed, and strength + good hands, decent shot touch, excellent work ethic, and the fact he is a proven NBA baller for several years now. But chances are good we can emulate some inside presence with a running game situation with feeds from Baron Davis and a player like Ike who can score in many different ways and juke defenders into foul trouble with or without the ball. Even Ike as a role player could still give us impact if he gets fouled the way he does and rebounds at least near double digits. I'm not saying he's going to do that right away as there is some adjustment period for rookie big men, but he's worth the risk if he's Elton Brand/Zach Randolph like. Our goal is to get to the playoffs and the draft was so deep, yet lacking in obvious franchise big man talents or franchise talents in general. Bogut is slow, Marvin Williams is soft, Chris Paul is too short, Deron Williams is too slow, etc. Everyone of these guys has a chance to succeed but it could be that none of those guys are franchise players. Even Green or Granger or Bynum have their issues. Green is still raw and in between a forward and a guard and is missing a portion of his index finger on his shooting hand. Granger is injury prone and might not do anything exceptional at the next level, even though he might do a lot of things well (super role player?). Bynum wasn't super athletic or coordinated like Shaq, but he showed he was a big body that could dominate amongst boys at 7 feet tall, 285 lbs, age 17 to be a longterm project that could turn into something like Shaq if he ever develops. I'm glad we stuck to bolstering our front-line with another solid rebounder with good hands that can do a lot of good things on offense or defense. Our window of opportunity is kind of short to spend on such 4-year or more uncertainties. A team needs to have pieces that fit otherwise drafting a guy like Granger or Green will just ruin what we've already built on to get to the playoffs. Let's build a team and run with it and make trades along the way. We will see how this develops. Anyone could be right at this point.
First of all, what in the past recent history of the warriors, say the last five years gives you any indication that Ike will see the floor more than a few minutes a game in garbage time if that? dunleavy was buried on the bench getting little minutes his rookie year. pietrus is still trying to get minutes he deserves and his rookie year he was lucky to get garbage time. Biedrins same thing. I doubt Ike will see significant minutes until March if our past shows us anything. I hope i am wrong as every season i have pulled my hair wondering why the likes of a calbert cheaney, dale davis, cliff robinson get the minutes our youth should get. I would be surprised to see Ike get significant minutes before all star break at best.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting boogielew:</div><div class="quote_post">First of all, what in the past recent history of the warriors, say the last five years gives you any indication that Ike will see the floor more than a few minutes a game in garbage time if that? dunleavy was buried on the bench getting little minutes his rookie year. pietrus is still trying to get minutes he deserves and his rookie year he was lucky to get garbage time. Biedrins same thing. I doubt Ike will see significant minutes until March if our past shows us anything. I hope i am wrong as every season i have pulled my hair wondering why the likes of a calbert cheaney, dale davis, cliff robinson get the minutes our youth should get. I would be surprised to see Ike get significant minutes before all star break at best.</div> The thing that separates Diogu from Pietrus, Biedrins, and even Dunleavy out of college is that he isnt raw and is physically ready to play in the NBA. Hes already the most skilled post player on the team and at 255 hes built to hang with the big men in the NBA. He is already the third heaviest guy on the team (second if you exclude Taft) and hes one of the strongest guys on the team as well. Biedrins and Pietrus were just raw athleticism, they wouldn't have helped the team and both had to make a transition from Eurp ball with 18 year oolds to NBA ball with grown men. Dunleavy had alot of skills coming out of college but was physically weak and he played behind Jamison anyway. He got more PT than Pietrus or Biedrins at the beginning of his rookie year but still not a ton of court time. Another thing you have to consider is that Musselman was in charge when Dun and Pietrus were rookies. I dont think Pietrus would have got much playing time as a rookie under any coach but Dunleavy was neglected by Muss. Ike was drafted to come in and cause some mischeif in the post and get to the line. There may be an adjustment period (especially on defense) but I think if we give the ball to him in the post while he has good postion he should be able to draw the foul. He has the total package coming out of college in terms of skills and how built he is, the question is how long will it take to adjust if any period at all.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting boogielew:</div><div class="quote_post">First of all, what in the past recent history of the warriors, say the last five years gives you any indication that Ike will see the floor more than a few minutes a game in garbage time if that? dunleavy was buried on the bench getting little minutes his rookie year. pietrus is still trying to get minutes he deserves and his rookie year he was lucky to get garbage time. Biedrins same thing. I doubt Ike will see significant minutes until March if our past shows us anything. I hope i am wrong as every season i have pulled my hair wondering why the likes of a calbert cheaney, dale davis, cliff robinson get the minutes our youth should get. I would be surprised to see Ike get significant minutes before all star break at best.</div> Hey boogie, the reason why Dunleavy got few minutes was he was parked behind the team's star, Antwan Jamison. Pietrus in '03-'04 was parked behind Calbert Cheaney, Nick Van Excel (at two guard), Mike Dunleavy Jr, and Brian Cardinal and Muss doesn't like rookies. Then same with Biedrins he was too young and he had all these vets in front of him until we traded them all. We need Ike because he's got talent we need that we can't find anywhere else because Zarko and Murphy have zero inside game.
Even though they are both bad inside, I'd have to give the upper hand to Zarko. He's had some good hook shots in the paint. I love it when he palms the ball and waves it around the air as he goes to the hoop.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AnimeFANatic:</div><div class="quote_post">Even though they are both bad inside, I'd have to give the upper hand to Zarko. He's had some good hook shots in the paint. I love it when he palms the ball and waves it around the air as he goes to the hoop.</div> That guy has got some crazy hands. I think him, Diogu, and Jrich have the biggest mits on the team. That move he does is classic, but it's too bad some refs call him for travelling when it's clearly not. Here's a 6'11 guy who can handle the ball and is going to take some large 2 and one half steps to get to the rim. I like his running hook shot floater and his dunks. Pretty good athlete, but you figure he could run when he only weighs as much as J-Rich. If he was as slow as Murphy that would suck.
Another factor in Ike playing early and often-he played against Monty's Stanford teams and so is no stranger. Ike was the pick because he's ready to play and brings some skills we lacked. What Mylie described,the tenacity,was what I saw. Ike (like Amare) attacks the rim with power and determination. Amare is a bit bigger,Ike may actually have a broader package of skills. Ideally we keep everyone under 35 min a game,keep this crew fresh and fast. I LOVE that we are deep,as I want the W's to play like it's a sprint relay. That also benefits us as it helps the second team maximize their talents and value sooner. Injuries happen. It's stupid to park your subs and when they need to step up-they are not ready.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">Another factor in Ike playing early and often-he played against Monty's Stanford teams and so is no stranger. Ike was the pick because he's ready to play and brings some skills we lacked. What Mylie described,the tenacity,was what I saw. Ike (like Amare) attacks the rim with power and determination. Amare is a bit bigger,Ike may actually have a broader package of skills. Ideally we keep everyone under 35 min a game,keep this crew fresh and fast. I LOVE that we are deep,as I want the W's to play like it's a sprint relay. That also benefits us as it helps the second team maximize their talents and value sooner. Injuries happen. It's stupid to park your subs and when they need to step up-they are not ready.</div> I hope Ike gets meaningful minutes right away and if he is as good as advertised we need to find a way to get him on the floor. Whether that means he starts over Murphy or we move Murphy over to the starting center spot and they swap roles. Murphy can be the outside shooter to draw double teams away from Ike down low and Ike can kick it out to Murphy for the open jumper when Ike is doubled down low. I think that should be the starting lineup personally and if our defense is lagging then we bring in the second team with Foyle, Pietrus, Biedrens and CC.
I'm with you Warriorsfan. The fact that Diogu hurt his hand is gonna hold him back slightly, but hopefully we'll see Murphy and Diogu evenytually starting together. If there's a defensive problem we can bring in Foyle at center, and give Biedrins some time at Powerforward.
Montgomery is on record as saying he wants an 8-9 man rotation, the way I see it, that's going to leave one of the Warriors three young big men on the bench. Assuming that this is the starting five: Baron Richardson Dunleavy Murphy Foyle And that Fisher and Pietrus are the primary reserves for pg, sg, and sf, that leaves two spots AT MOST for the power rotation and three guys: Biedrins, Zarko, and Ike fighting for those spots. If I focus on anything during preseason, it's going to be which two of those three guys play the best. This is why Ike breaking his hand is such bad timing. He's definitely out the first two games, and even if he plays in the other five, he's not going to be as effective as he would be if healthy. Basically he's got two weeks to heal before he plays the last two pre-season games. If he plays anything like he did in the last game of the summer league (37 points/12 boards) durning those last two games, he's got a shot. Otherwise, I think the two spots will be Zarko and Biedrins' to lose.
