http://s2draftblog.s2blogs.com/ Run and I decided to go ahead and make a draft blog, because we've both sort of fallen into the habit of talking more about the draft on AIM than on s2, so we figured we'd fix that by just basically taking what we'd normally say on AIM and turning it into a back-and-forth blog. We posted our picks #1-10 today, with explanations. Tomorrow we'll post #11-20, and on Friday we'll post #21-30. After that, we'll have daily updates with discussions of who this year's draft steals, busts, etc. are, as well as more material on who we think will go where, why, and how that'll impact the teams involved. Comments and criticism are more than welcomed. I'm looking forward to hearing what the s2 community has to say about our thoughts.
Ah sorry I posted in another thread by accident. Here was my question though: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 01:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Run, don't you personally think Love is a bit of a reach for Minny at 3?</div>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 01:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Run, don't you personally think Love is a bit of a reach for Minny at 3?</div> I used to really be skeptical of Love based mostly on his height/athleticism. He measured out just a hair under 6'8 w/o shoes, 6'9.5 in shoes but I'm guessing the shoes he'll actually wear won't really make him that big. More likely he'll be playing at 6'8.5-6'9. 6'11 wingspan is respectable. Word was that hes in awesome shape, dropped a lot of weight and obviously was looking more explosive. I didn't expect him to measure out as good of an athlete as he did though. 29.5 standing vert, 35 inch max vert, 18 bench presses, 3rd best lane agility among PFs, did pretty damn well on the 3/4 court sprint too. And this is all at 12.9% body fat so hes still gonna shed some weight if he continues at this rate. Hes 255 right now, I think if he gets down to 245-250 it'll be ideal. Athletically, he was one of the better big men in the draft. Obviously Love has a ton of skills from day one but also lets not forget that he is only 19 years old. Hes got a nice inside game, developing perimeter shot out to the college 3. good passer, great rebounding instincts. Rumor has it that McHale is in love with him and I think with his stock on the rise he isn't going to risk trading down and not getting him. I'd also point to a trend in the NBA in which undersized, bulky PFs who were stars in college are doing well in the league; Maxiel, Millsap, Craig Smith, Brandon Bass, Carl Landry, Leon Powe, Glenn Davis, and when you're talking about 20/10 guys theres Carlos Boozer, Elton Brand, Zach Randolph, and David West. Kevin Love was probably better last season than all of these guys were as juniors/seniors which gives you an idea of his potential. Love has the similar body, motor, instincts, bulk, etc. but you also throw in the outside game, moves in the paint, passing, and all the "intangibles" that he brings. The point I'm getting at is that undersized big men who were good in college are succeeding in the NBA as long as they fit a few criteria; intelligent, excellent instincts specifically on the glass, usually they are bulky and very strong but also have good mobility. Love has all of that but he's coming into the league at 19-20 years old plus hes got the all-around game from day one. The questions about his height athleticism IMO are not a big deal to me because now that hes proven his athleticism I think hes definitely got hte intelligence, instincts, and motor to do well like a lot of the aforementioned guys but he also has the skills of a Brand, Boozer, Randolph, etc. He'll probably struggle on defense, definitely for the first few years at least. I think he'll probably figure out how to play good man defense in the post like a Kurt Thomas, PJ Brown, etc. I don't think he'll be an elite level PF in the NBA but I think hes a guy who could potentially be a very solid player and hes the type of guy who is always going to make all the rightp lays to help his team win.
Run I've seen Kosta go as low as the late 20's in some drafts, could you please explain your interest in him a bit more? You convinced me with Love at least. Edit- at the very least Max/Powe as far as importance to their team is concerned.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You convinced me with Love at least. I could definitely see him as a Maxiel/Powe type.</div> I don't really understand this at all. Maxiell and Powe are very contrasting players. And you'd settle for one of those 2 with the 3rd overall pick???
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Jun 12 2008, 02:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You convinced me with Love at least. I could definitely see him as a Maxiel/Powe type.</div> I don't really understand this at all. Maxiell and Powe are very contrasting players. And you'd settle for one of those 2 with the 3rd overall pick“? </div> Meh I meant in a bad case I could still see him being that level of player Run described. Not necessarily with that specific style.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Run I've seen Kosta go as low as the late 20's in some drafts, could you please explain your interest in him a bit more? You convinced me with Love at least. Edit- at the very least Max/Powe as far as importance to their team is concerned.</div> My Kosta pimping may be as much disdain for the rest of the PF/Cs in the draft as it is that I like Kosta as a prospect. I mean I like Love now that hes slimmed down and gotten some better athleticism but I'm not in love with him either. Even Beasley IMO isn't a very good "designated top big man in the draft" (not to mention hes probably as much a SF as he is a PF but he can get by in the east at PF). Then after that you have Brook Lopez who I've been regularly bashing and calling overrated whenever the opportunity presents itself. DeAndre Jordan used to have the "big time Dwight Howard potential" tag but then measured out as an un-spectacular athlete which doesn't give you much hope given his skill and just how unknown he is. I really don't like Arthur and Speights either. Things I do like about Koufos; size- hes a legit 7'0 in socks with a nice wingspan and in addition hes also a pretty solid athlete. Hes not a freak like your KGs or JOs but athletically I'd say hes above average for a guy his size. Skill- hes got a very nice jumpshot from day one as a 19 year old out to around the college 3, his handle is good for his size, and although his post game is finnesse hes got great touch and I like his fundamentals down there. To me when you're looking at the post game coming out of college its all about footwork, fundamentals, textbook NBA post moves, release point, etc. and not so much even the actual scoring numbers. Theres a lot of big men who average 20+ points a game in college just by being taller, stronger, more athletic than the competition and having good touch around the rim. In the NBA though you have very few big men scoring 20+ points per game because you have to have the size but most importantly you do have to have all those fundamental moves, you have to release every shot at the highest point, you have to have great footwork because every little inch of room you have to get the shot off is necessary. Kosta has a lot of those moves in his arsenal now but they need to be developed. While he may not have been a dominating scorer like Brook Lopez, I think his scoring game will carry over to the NBA better because his moves are more fundamental whereas Lopez' were more awkward and he only had one or two good moves and didn't show much else (not to mention Kosta has a sweet jumpshot). Like I said though I'm not really in love with Kosta I just think that compared to the other crappy PF/C prospects in the draft he stands out as a solid prospect that is being underrated (starting to gain some steam though). Kosta's rebounding is weak for a guy his size and although he averaged 1.8 bpg in college hes not going to be swatting that many shots in the NBA (he could be a 1.5 bpg type of guy though). Its hard to judge his defense because who is really going to challenge a 7'1 guy in college? I would tend to believe his defense will suck as with most big men rookies. I see Kosta as a 16-18 ppg/8 rpg/1.5 bpg type of guy potentially in his prime. Sort of like a Big Z but more athletic and I think he'll be in the post more than Big Z was. A guy like Lopez I can't see having much more than a Magloire-type of career due to his lack of athleticism, nice touch but no real good NBA post moves, and lack of outside game.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Run BJM @ Jun 12 2008, 05:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Run I've seen Kosta go as low as the late 20's in some drafts, could you please explain your interest in him a bit more? You convinced me with Love at least. Edit- at the very least Max/Powe as far as importance to their team is concerned.</div> My Kosta pimping may be as much disdain for the rest of the PF/Cs in the draft as it is that I like Kosta as a prospect. I mean I like Love now that hes slimmed down and gotten some better athleticism but I'm not in love with him either. Even Beasley IMO isn't a very good "designated top big man in the draft" (not to mention hes probably as much a SF as he is a PF but he can get by in the east at PF). Then after that you have Brook Lopez who I've been regularly bashing and calling overrated whenever the opportunity presents itself. DeAndre Jordan used to have the "big time Dwight Howard potential" tag but then measured out as an un-spectacular athlete which doesn't give you much hope given his skill and just how unknown he is. I really don't like Arthur and Speights either. Things I do like about Koufos; size- hes a legit 7'0 in socks with a nice wingspan and in addition hes also a pretty solid athlete. Hes not a freak like your KGs or JOs but athletically I'd say hes above average for a guy his size. Skill- hes got a very nice jumpshot from day one as a 19 year old out to around the college 3, his handle is good for his size, and although his post game is finnesse hes got great touch and I like his fundamentals down there. To me when you're looking at the post game coming out of college its all about footwork, fundamentals, textbook NBA post moves, release point, etc. and not so much even the actual scoring numbers. Theres a lot of big men who average 20+ points a game in college just by being taller, stronger, more athletic than the competition and having good touch around the rim. In the NBA though you have very few big men scoring 20+ points per game because you have to have the size but most importantly you do have to have all those fundamental moves, you have to release every shot at the highest point, you have to have great footwork because every little inch of room you have to get the shot off is necessary. Kosta has a lot of those moves in his arsenal now but they need to be developed. While he may not have been a dominating scorer like Brook Lopez, I think his scoring game will carry over to the NBA better because his moves are more fundamental whereas Lopez' were more awkward and he only had one or two good moves and didn't show much else (not to mention Kosta has a sweet jumpshot). Like I said though I'm not really in love with Kosta I just think that compared to the other crappy PF/C prospects in the draft he stands out as a solid prospect that is being underrated (starting to gain some steam though). Kosta's rebounding is weak for a guy his size and although he averaged 1.8 bpg in college hes not going to be swatting that many shots in the NBA (he could be a 1.5 bpg type of guy though). Its hard to judge his defense because who is really going to challenge a 7'1 guy in college? I would tend to believe his defense will suck as with most big men rookies. I see Kosta as a 16-18 ppg/8 rpg/1.5 bpg type of guy potentially in his prime. Sort of like a Big Z but more athletic and I think he'll be in the post more than Big Z was. A guy like Lopez I can't see having much more than a Magloire-type of career due to his lack of athleticism, nice touch but no real good NBA post moves, and lack of outside game. </div> Thanks for the thoughts Run, I concur with you about Lopez.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Run BJM @ Jun 12 2008, 03:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Jun 12 2008, 02:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Run I've seen Kosta go as low as the late 20's in some drafts, could you please explain your interest in him a bit more? You convinced me with Love at least. Edit- at the very least Max/Powe as far as importance to their team is concerned.</div> My Kosta pimping may be as much disdain for the rest of the PF/Cs in the draft as it is that I like Kosta as a prospect. I mean I like Love now that hes slimmed down and gotten some better athleticism but I'm not in love with him either. Even Beasley IMO isn't a very good "designated top big man in the draft" (not to mention hes probably as much a SF as he is a PF but he can get by in the east at PF). Then after that you have Brook Lopez who I've been regularly bashing and calling overrated whenever the opportunity presents itself. DeAndre Jordan used to have the "big time Dwight Howard potential" tag but then measured out as an un-spectacular athlete which doesn't give you much hope given his skill and just how unknown he is. I really don't like Arthur and Speights either. Things I do like about Koufos; size- hes a legit 7'0 in socks with a nice wingspan and in addition hes also a pretty solid athlete. Hes not a freak like your KGs or JOs but athletically I'd say hes above average for a guy his size. Skill- hes got a very nice jumpshot from day one as a 19 year old out to around the college 3, his handle is good for his size, and although his post game is finnesse hes got great touch and I like his fundamentals down there. To me when you're looking at the post game coming out of college its all about footwork, fundamentals, textbook NBA post moves, release point, etc. and not so much even the actual scoring numbers. Theres a lot of big men who average 20+ points a game in college just by being taller, stronger, more athletic than the competition and having good touch around the rim. In the NBA though you have very few big men scoring 20+ points per game because you have to have the size but most importantly you do have to have all those fundamental moves, you have to release every shot at the highest point, you have to have great footwork because every little inch of room you have to get the shot off is necessary. Kosta has a lot of those moves in his arsenal now but they need to be developed. While he may not have been a dominating scorer like Brook Lopez, I think his scoring game will carry over to the NBA better because his moves are more fundamental whereas Lopez' were more awkward and he only had one or two good moves and didn't show much else (not to mention Kosta has a sweet jumpshot). Like I said though I'm not really in love with Kosta I just think that compared to the other crappy PF/C prospects in the draft he stands out as a solid prospect that is being underrated (starting to gain some steam though). Kosta's rebounding is weak for a guy his size and although he averaged 1.8 bpg in college hes not going to be swatting that many shots in the NBA (he could be a 1.5 bpg type of guy though). Its hard to judge his defense because who is really going to challenge a 7'1 guy in college? I would tend to believe his defense will suck as with most big men rookies. I see Kosta as a 16-18 ppg/8 rpg/1.5 bpg type of guy potentially in his prime. Sort of like a Big Z but more athletic and I think he'll be in the post more than Big Z was. A guy like Lopez I can't see having much more than a Magloire-type of career due to his lack of athleticism, nice touch but no real good NBA post moves, and lack of outside game. </div> You didn't mention McGee, what do you think of him? He probably would have been my choice if Jordan had been off the board, although I do like Koufos.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (gambitnut @ Jun 12 2008, 10:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You didn't mention McGee, what do you think of him? He probably would have been my choice if Jordan had been off the board, although I do like Koufos.</div> Its hard to say because I haven't seen him play. I would tend to stay away from him because he reminds me a lot of Patrick O'Bryant. Very big, very long arms, nice athlete, did good but not great in a poor conference which is always a concern for a guy of his size/skill. I've also read that hes kind of a strange/immature guy but I don't know how much merit that has. Again, its hard to comment on him but my gut says that he'd be a bad pick in the lotto, I'd probably say he belongs around 18-25.
