29/8/5 club*<u>60?s</u>Oscar Robertson1961 30.5 points, 10.1 rebounds, 9.7 assists1962 30.8 points, 12.5 rebounds, 11.4 assists1964 31.4 points, 9.9 rebounds, 11.0 assists1965 30.4 points, 9.0 rebounds, 11.5 assists1966 31.3 points, 7.7 rebounds, 11.1 assists1967 30.5 points, 6.2 rebounds, 10.7 assists.1968 29.2 points, 6.0 rebounds, 9.7 assistsElgin Baylor1961 34.8 points, 19.8 rebounds, 5.1 assists1963 34.0 points, 14.3 rebounds, 4.8 assistsJerry West1962 30.8 points, 7.9 rebounds, 5.4 assistsWilt Chamberlain1964 36.9 points, 22.3 rebounds, 5.0 assists1966 33.5 points, 24.6 rebounds, 5.2 assists<u>70?s</u>Kareem Abdul-Jabbar1973 30.2 points, 16.1 rebounds, 5.0 assists<u>80?s</u>Larry Bird1985 28.7 points, 10.5 rebounds, 6.6 assists1988 29.9 points, 9.3 rebounds, 6.1 assistsMichael Jordan1989 32.5 points, 8.0 rebounds, 8.0 assists<u>90?s</u>David Robinson1994 29.8 points, 10.7 rebounds, 4.8 assists <u>00's</u>Dwayne Wade28.7 points 4.90 rebounds 7.9 assistsOther Notes: Wade is putting up 2.1 steals and 1.2 blocks while his turnovers per possession are the same as Jason Kidd.*Give or take a couple tenths of a point for the Admiral and the Logo<u>Ranking Players by PER this season:</u> MIA Dwyane Wade G 29.73 DAL Dirk Nowitzki PF 28.83 HOU Yao Ming C 27.11 SAS Tim Duncan FC 25.66 MIN Kevin Garnett F 25.60 LAL Kobe Bryant SG 24.90 PHO Steve Nash PG 24.85 Heat Record with Wade and no Shaq: Above .500Heat Record without Wade: 1-7<u>Conclusion:</u> Wade is having a marvelous season. Once his team reaches past the ".500 barrier" he will be back in MVP talks (although he wont win). A few years ago, players on teams that were below .500 still had a shot at MVP (Jordan, Barkley, Robertson). Now, players have to deal with the ".500 barrier". True champions don't mind. Keep attacking the basket young fella.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ginger Jesus @ Feb 13 2007, 06:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Wade would be 29/5/8, not 29/8/5. Wade is overrated still. Half his points are from free throws.</div>1/3 of his points are from the free throw line...same with all superstars who drive to the basket.
Yeah, so the jumpshooting superstars should be higher praised. And I'd say it's more like 1/2 for Wade, 1/3 for the rest maybe.
I don't get why people make such a big deal about how he gets to the line so much. He is more smart than anything else. He knows the refs will call it so he drives. If they didn't he would probably have another way of scoring close to that many points. It isn't like he is so reliant on that.Anyways, it just shows how nobody could stop the big O and I think he is a top 5 player.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ginger Jesus @ Feb 13 2007, 06:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, so the jumpshooting superstars should be higher praised. And I'd say it's more like 1/2 for Wade, 1/3 for the rest maybe.</div>No...it's statistical fact that it's around 1/3. He makes around 9 a game and he averages 29... And same with the many others who get around 10 free throws per game.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Feb 13 2007, 08:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't get why people make such a big deal about how he gets to the line so much. He is more smart than anything else. He knows the refs will call it so he drives. If they didn't he would probably have another way of scoring close to that many points. It isn't like he is so reliant on that.</div><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mavsfann 1000)</div><div class='quotemain'>Thought everyone might like to read this. I found it on another forum. What do you all think about this?Posted by Whipit:This is getting passed around and someone sent it to me this morning. Comments re Wade from around the league -"He gets all the calls, that's what makes him special.'' - Gerald Wallace"It's unbelievable what he gets away with.'' - Bob Hill"I can't believe he has the audacity to complain to the refs, he should be grateful for what they've done for him in his career. He is what he is today because of them." - P.J. Brown"He travels on that spin move," Jackson said. "He picks up that pivot foot... everybody knows it. Dwayne Wade can cover so much ground when he makes that move. As you know, he can go 20 feet with that spin move and get to the basket." - Phil JacksonSportsNation Chris Sheridan: (12:40 PM ET ) You're preaching to the choir here, Oliver. every single night D-Wade gets three gift whistles (which even LeBron and Kobe don't get) at a minimum, and one or two late whistles, too. He's treated as preferrentially as Jordan was at the peak of his game, and it is infuriating to watch (unless you're a Heat fan). And I say all that being one of the biggest D-Wade guys around, a Marquette grad even. But it's just plain unfair to see one guy get such special treatment. It takes away from the game.Marc Stein on Galloway & Co (1/30)"No question about it that you definitely hear-- I've heard it from executives, I've heard it from coaches, that you just can't touch this guy[Wade]... but you know, the fact that players bring this up in games... I would say yeah it's a definite topic.""Does Wade get calls that nobody else gets? Does he go to the line too much? Yes, no question.""You can't do nothing to D-Wade. If you say 'boogety-boogety boo' to him, that's a foul. If you give him a hard look, that's a foul." -Rasheed Wallace(He also comically took shots and flopped over acting injured. I'm not even joking. Link below)Tracy McGrady went so far as to say the NBA finals might have been rigged in a radio interview the foul calls were so obviously in Miami's favor.Sources:Rasheed:http://www.detroitbadboys.com/archi...h-thats-a-foul/Gerald Wallace:http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlo...arlotte_bobcatsBob Hill: http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/sports/c...ce/15995105.htmPhil Jackson: http://www.latimes.com/sports/baske...viewed-homepage'Sheed: http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/...ok.275f21f.htmlhttp://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=537427sheridan:http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blo...dsheridan_chrisMark Stein:http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...Co+%281%2F30%29 (I can?t find a direct link to the podcast mp3 where he says this, but a google search shows it?s there).Tracy McGrady's thoughts on Wade: http://odeo.com/audio/1597802/viewhttp://www.blogmaverick.com/2007/02...-wade-a-leader/ (Cubans recent comments)These satirical articles from nbadraft.net and the brushback also do a good job of illustrating how the players and media around the league feel about Wade.http://www.thebrushback.com/Archives/classy_full.htmhttp://www.nbadraft.net/prevenas066.asphttp://dwil.wordpress.com/tag/nba-mentions/dwyane-wade/ (not so much satire as it is more of the same about the egregious calls Wade gets away with).It's obvious (particularly after listening to Stein's comments) that the players and coaches around the league feel that Wade is receiving some biased/unfair treatment. On sports forums all over the net debates about Wade's preferential treatment routinely start up before and after games. Hell, if you look at the statistics from last years finals something alarming comes up (here are the leaders in FTA per game for both teams from 1998 to 2006):2006 NBAFINALSWade - 16.2Dirk - 9.02005 NBAFINALSDuncan - 7.7Billups - 6.32004 NBAFINALSShaq - 11.0Billups 8.42003 NBAFINALSDuncan - 9.0Kidd/Jefferson/Martin - 4.02002 NBAFINALSShaq - 14.5Martin - 6.52001 NBAFINALSShaq - 15.2Iverson - 9.62000 NBAFINALSShaq - 15.5Miller - 6.71999 NBAFINALSRobinson - 9.6Duncan - 9.01998 NBAFINALSJordan - 11.6Malone - 8.0Now what can we deduct from all this? You'd have to go back to 1998 to find the last guard to ever averaged double-digit FTA in Michael Jordan in the FINALS. Even still, Wade has about 5 more FTA than Jordan which nearly equates to 2 or 3 more Fouls given. The only one remotely close in FTA to Wade is Shaq in his Prime years. It's obvious why Shaq got that many freethrows, he was a complete monster in the Post and teams often employed the Hack-a-Shaq to slow him down. In Game 2 of the 2000 NBA FINALS, Shaq got 39 FTA in which he only made 18.And yet Wade still averaged more FTA per game.The argument Wade proponents have is that he is being "aggressive" and is the most aggressive player in the Finals. Umm no. Wade isn't anymore aggressive than Jordan, Shaq, Duncan, Iverson or any other superstar that has ever played in the FINALS. It's ridiculous that Wade got more FTA than post players like Shaq, Duncan or Robinson. It's also ludicrous for a guard to EVER get 16.2 FTA while averaging 36.5 ppg. Shows you where a chunk of the points came from.In case you missed all that: It's all about the freethrows. Wade isn't all that great of a basketball player (although he is certainly good), but when the refs will call a foul on the opposing player if he merely BREATH's in your direction there's a problem. Wade gets the kind of calls Jordan got in his prieme-MORE actually-and he's a 4th year guard.Wade isn't a superstar player, he's a MANUFACTURED superstar courtesy of the refs. Put me on the line 11 times a game and I'd be an NBA star as well. Wades ppg to FTA per game ratio is one of if not THE most lopsided in NBA history, and that isn't even taking into account all of the non-shooting/blocking fouls he gets per game. 1 in every of 5 his shot attempts see's the refs putting him on the line.Maybe there's a logical explanation for this, but regardless of what that is more attention needs to be brought to this issue, if only to rectify the problem and assure that the integrity of the game isn't being compromised in an effort to create the "next Jordan."</div>Even jordan didn't get that many calls until he was in his peak.
<span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS">What did DWade do to get so much attention? I mean, did he "pleasure" all the referees in the NBA or what?In Michael Jordan's case, I hate the fact that he went to the line so many times, yet nobody seems to make a huge deal. If Wade gets whistles called in his favor, let it be. There's nothing we can really do about it, I guess.</span>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Illosophee @ Feb 13 2007, 08:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What did DWade do to get so much attention? I mean, did he "pleasure" all the referees in the NBA or what?</div>Wubba Wubba dick bavetta! :shifty2:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ginger Jesus @ Feb 13 2007, 08:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, so the jumpshooting superstars should be higher praised. And I'd say it's more like 1/2 for Wade, 1/3 for the rest maybe.</div>That's bullsh*t. That means MJ shouldn't praised as highly as Kobe because MJ was mostly a slasher? Give me a break. AI takes only 1 less FTA per game and scores less PPG, why don't people criticize him? Bron gets away with dozens of travels, including one in playoffs that could have meant the series for the Wizards. Players get away with different things, but bottom line is Wade drives way more than players like GA and KObe yet shoots only 2 less FTA per game, drives more agressively at basket than AI and takes only 1 more FTA, so all of this talk is silly.But yeah, he is having the best statisitical season in the NBA this Yeah rand tearing it up every night. Very impressive.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Conclusion: Wade is having a marvelous season. Once his team reaches past the ".500 barrier" he will be back in MVP talks (although he wont win). A few years ago, players on teams that were below .500 still had a shot at MVP (Jordan, Barkley, Robertson). Now, players have to deal with the ".500 barrier". True champions don't mind. Keep attacking the basket young fella.</div>people have never been able to win an MVP below .500. All of the players to win MVPs but Kareem, Nash, and Jordan in the last 30 years have been on one of the top two teams
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ginger Jesus @ Feb 13 2007, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Wade would be 29/5/8, not 29/8/5. Wade is overrated still. Half his points are from free throws.</div>Dude seriously why do you say stuff like that how is Dwyane Wade overrated, I mean he is averaging the 3rd most points in the league and just about 8 assists per game which is pretty good I think. Also he has a block in 9 consecutive games and a steal in 15 or 16 straight. Just because he gets calls from the refs doesn't mean anything. He averages 11 a game and Kobe averages 9 and Gilbert almost 10. So why don't you go say they are overrated too.
I completely agree w/ everything said about how wade gets so many calls that he shouldn't get.I think by the end of his career Gasol will be a 29/8/5 guy... maybe dirk and definitely lbj.
<span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS">I still don't see how DWade stacks up to the aforementioned fellas. Isn't DWade averaging 28 ppg, 5 rpg and about 8 apg? How is he a 28/8/5 guy when his stats clearly are 28/5/8?</span>
Dwyane Wade may go to the free throw alot(and he doesn't get any other special call no other star wouldnt get), but hes still getting 28 points a game for his team....I dont care how a player does it, if he does it efficently and puts your team in a situation to win, hes a superstar(Yeah hes one, hes got a ring)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (41nowitzness41 @ Feb 14 2007, 10:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I completely agree w/ everything said about how wade gets so many calls that he shouldn't get.I think by the end of his career Gasol will be a 29/8/5 guy... maybe dirk and definitely lbj.</div>coming from a nowitzki fan....wow I got so much respect for you right now.I think the highest Pau will average will be about 24-26ppg, but that 8/5 is accurate. Hes underrated, gladly some people are recognizing how talented he is.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Memphis Fan @ Feb 14 2007, 11:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Dwyane Wade may go to the free throw alot(and he doesn't get any other special call no other star wouldnt get), but hes still getting 28 points a game for his team....I dont care how a player does it, if he does it efficently and puts your team in a situation to win, hes a superstar(Yeah hes one, hes got a ring)</div><span style="font-family:Comic Sans MS">Okay... Tyronn Lue has a ring, does that make him a superstar as well?</span>
no, but Dwyane Wade is a star, who won a ring=superstar. I explained this in another thread. IMO, if your a star, the only thing that can make you different from another star(making you super) is a ring. But thats not saying Lue is closer to a superstar than LeBron...cause hes not.But thats my opinion on what a superstar is...I know others disagree.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (41nowitzness41 @ Feb 14 2007, 11:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I completely agree w/ everything said about how wade gets so many calls that he shouldn't get.</div>Every star gets calls he shouldn't get. Bottom line is Wade drives to the basket more frequently and agressively than anyone else in the league, yet shoots only 1 more FT per game than AI, and only 2 more than Kobe and GA (who both have over 60 less attempts at basket than Wade).So I'm sick of people bi*ching about calls he gets.Illosophee- Wade put up 36PPG in the Finals, 40PPG through last 4 games. He had 2 of the best 4th quarters you will ever see in the Finals, and hit all the clutch shots (outside of GP's shot in game 3). He did this with Shaq putting up 14PPG and others playing like crap. He is having the best statistical season in the NBA right now and his name is becoming a household one...he's a superstar.
Wade gets calls that others wont get. It's not FTA's, it's the fact that Wade will get a call when somebody "fouls" him. Yet when an opponent in the same game gets the same "foul" it's a no-call. I remember the Lakers-Heat game in LA, the Lakers were getting knocked on their asses all night, which is fine but, Wade and the Heat were getting to the line for touch fouls. That's what I hate.Anyway.Wilt in 1967: 24ppg 24rpg 8apgMagic in 1982: 19ppr 9rpg 9apg
