The Lillard Blazers peaked 2 seasons ago

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Rastapopoulos

Rastapopoulos

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Remember how, when the Drexler Blazers lost to Jordan in the finals (after losing to Zeke and then Magic) we thought they'd be back, but it was first round exits from there on out? And then the 'Sheed Blazers battled the Shaq-Kobe Lakers to a standstill before running out of gas in game 7 of the WCF and we also thought we'd be back? Only - guess what - first round exits for years after? Well (and I think you can see where this is going)...

Realistically, Dame is at his very tip-top peak and has already probably started a decline, and there's no way we're going to get another superstar, let alone the TWO superstars you need nowadays. So, if he's suddenly decided he might not be a Blazer-for-life-through-thick-and-thin, it's time to let him fly free.

Add to that the fact that nobody is going to give us value for CJ (prove me wrong, NBA!) and I say:

TRADE DAME, KEEP CJ
Calm down, CJ-haterz - we just need to keep CJ for the first half of next season. He's at a low in value right now, but if he can start next season like he started this one, then some team is going to be tempted into offering us something of value, and once Dame is gone, it can be a package of picks (trading CJ for picks when we still have Dame would further piss him off, demonstrating that we're not serious about contending).

I'm ready for the Anfernee Simons Era to begin!
 
I asked this in another thread but might as well ask it here too:

Are there any examples of a small-market team trading their only star, their franchise player, for lesser player(s) and a collection of lower picks and ending up better than they were prior to the trade, over the next 5 seasons?...7 seasons?

I'm trying to remember; it didn't with Melo or Deron Williams or Chris Bosh or KG or Westbrook or PG13 or Kawhi or Jimmy Butler. Who am I forgetting?
 
wizenheimer said:
I asked this in another thread but might as well ask it here too:

Are there any examples of a small-market team trading their only star, their franchise player, for lesser player(s) and a collection of lower picks and ending up better than they were prior to the trade, over the next 5 seasons?...7 seasons?

I'm trying to remember; it didn't with Melo or Deron Williams or Chris Bosh or KG or Westbrook or PG13 or Kawhi or Jimmy Butler. Who am I forgetting?
Click to expand...
Now ask the same question about hanging on to their only star until he demands a trade.
 
wizenheimer said:
I asked this in another thread but might as well ask it here too:

Are there any examples of a small-market team trading their only star, their franchise player, for lesser player(s) and a collection of lower picks and ending up better than they were prior to the trade, over the next 5 seasons?...7 seasons?

I'm trying to remember; it didn't with Melo or Deron Williams or Chris Bosh or KG or Westbrook or PG13 or Kawhi or Jimmy Butler. Who am I forgetting?
Click to expand...

Blazers and Drexler.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
So wait, our GM can't build a championship contending team in 9 years so we should have him trade away our greatest player in franchise history so he can fuck that up too?

Not sure if I agree with that.
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Olshey can fuck up anything. Of course everything would be better with a new GM, but then s/he would be faced with the same dilemma.
 
If you disagree, what's our path to relevance again? "Zach Collins will propel us past the first round"? "Someone's BOUND to overpay for CJ"?
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Now ask the same question about hanging on to their only star until he demands a trade.
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that doesn't fucking matter and is just deflection

can you come up with an example where trading the franchise player made the team better over the next 5 years? whether he asked for a trade or not
 
Rastapopoulos said:
If you disagree, what's our path to relevance again? "Zach Collins will propel us past the first round"? "Someone's BOUND to overpay for CJ"?
Click to expand...

Us playing a preseason game in Israel and a giant meteor hits north america.

Last team standing! Champions by default!
 
wizenheimer said:
that doesn't fucking matter and is just deflection
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Bullshit. You're acting like your path is better than the path I'm suggesting. I say we're fucked either way, but maybe less fucked my way. And I guess it depends on what you mean by "star" anyway. How about Indiana trading away Paul George?
 
Boston trading KG?
Memphis trading Marc Gasol?
Utah trading Deron Williams?
The Pelicans trading Davis hasn't paid off fully yet, but everyone expects them to put it together sooner rather than later.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
If you disagree, what's our path to relevance again? "Zach Collins will propel us past the first round"? "Someone's BOUND to overpay for CJ"?
Click to expand...

I think the answer in people's hearts is "The Blazers aren't likely to win a title either way within Lillard's career so, in a title-free environment, we'd rather see a franchise great remain with the franchise."

I'm fine with exploring the market for any player on the roster, but I certainly wouldn't pre-commit to trading Lillard and then just trying to find the best offer. Trading superstars for a group of lesser, younger players virtually never pans out, so my default would be to keep him and then be open to another team blowing me away with an offer, if I were GM.
 
Minstrel said:
I think the answer in people's hearts is "The Blazers aren't likely to win a title either way within Lillard's career so, in a title-free environment, we'd rather see a franchise great remain with the franchise."

I'm fine with exploring the market for any player on the roster, but I certainly wouldn't pre-commit to trading Lillard and then just trying to find the best offer. Trading superstars for a group of lesser, younger players virtually never pans out, so my default would be to keep him and then be open to another team blowing me away with an offer, if I were GM.
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What if Lillard starts making more and more noises about how unhappy he is?
 
If olshey continue his moves likes every season the only move you might see is Nurk being traded so he can now have Zach be the starting center next year. First he will guarantee Nurk contract then trade him and I think DJJ will opt in and also be traded. Olshey will take offers for CJ but not pull trigger just my opinion.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Bullshit. You're acting like your path is better than the path I'm suggesting. I say we're fucked either way, but maybe less fucked my way. And I guess it depends on what you mean by "star" anyway. How about Indiana trading away Paul George?
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Indiana didn't become better after trading PG13. They won 181 game in the 4 seasons before the trade, and played in the EC Finals. And 175 games in the 4 seasons after, didn't win a series, and are in the lottery this year

I know what you're suggesting, and here it is: the current GM has fucked up the situation so bad, the most loyal superstar ever is unhappy. So, the path is to keep that fucking GM, trade the superstar on spec just in case he demands a trade 2 years from now, and go down a path that hasn't ever worked for any other team

all I'm saying is fuck that...and if I'm coming across too aggressive I apologize
 
Rastapopoulos said:
What if Lillard starts making more and more noises about how unhappy he is?
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For people who just want a franchise great to remain with the franchise? I'm not sure. That's not really me, I'm not the sentimental type when it comes to sports.

As for what I said my own attitude would be--him suggesting he's unhappy wouldn't change a lot, since he's under contract for 4 years. I still wouldn't be interested in trading him for less than, essentially, a rip-off deal to account for the fact that superstar deals are almost always won by the team getting the superstar.
 
wizenheimer said:
So, the path is to keep that fucking GM, trade the superstar on spec just in case he demands a trade 2 years from now, and go down a path that hasn't ever worked for any other team
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I have been bitching about Olshey since long before it was fashionable. I wanted him gone years ago. But even if we get rid of him, the dilemma remains.
 
Minstrel said:
For people who just want a franchise great to remain with the franchise? I'm not sure. That's not really me, I'm not the sentimental type when it comes to sports.

As for what I said my own attitude would be--him suggesting he's unhappy wouldn't change a lot, since he's under contract for 4 years. I still wouldn't be interested in trading him for less than, essentially, a rip-off deal to account for the fact that superstar deals are almost always won by the team getting the superstar.
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What if it's a fair deal?
 
I guess the Jazz should've traded away their stars for picks because they were a 1st round exit 2 years in a row.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
What if it's a fair deal?
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That's a no. As I said, what's considered a "fair deal" never actually pans out that way--teams that get the superstar generally always win the deal. To account for that, it has to be much more than what seems like a fair deal. It has to be a complete rip-off in Portland's favor.
 
Minstrel said:
That's a no. As I said, what's considered a "fair deal" never actually pans out that way--teams that get the superstar generally always win the deal. To account for that, it has to be much more than what seems like a fair deal. It has to be a complete rip-off in Portland's favor.
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What if Dame has a career-ending injury in his first game for his new team?


(I can keep this up indefinitely)
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Boston trading KG?
.
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he was 36 when he was traded and he was traded with Paul Pierce, Jason Terry, DJ White and a pick swap. I guess all Portland has to do is find a stupid Russian owner desperate for attention. And, the Celtics really haven't looked all that improved from the KG days, especially not lately

Rastapopoulos said:
Memphis trading Marc Gasol?.
Click to expand...

he was 34 and all the Grizz got was Valunciunas and a couple of future 2nd round picks. Memhis had 7 straight winning seasons with Gasol leading the way, including 3 season os 50+ wins, 3 appearences in conference semi-finals and 1 in the WCF. Then it was 3 straight lottery teams and the 1st round exit this year

Rastapopoulos said:
Utah trading Deron Williams?
Click to expand...

Utah won an average of 52 games in the 4 seasons before trading Deron, played in 3 conference semi-finals and 1 WCF. After the trade, 5 of 6 seasons in the lottery

Rastapopoulos said:
The Pelicans trading Davis hasn't paid off fully yet, but everyone expects them to put it together sooner rather than later.
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the problem with that example is that the Pels only won an average of 36 games a year with AD. They didn't have any high standard to get back to

********************************************

I'd respect your position more if you'd stop saying keep CJ. There is not reason to go all the way to trading dame without dumping CJ too.

If Portland goes that route, they need to get as bad as they can, as soon as they can, and start collecting high lottery picks by sucking badly. IMO, they won't be getting any lottery picks for Dame unless it's some kind of fantasy 5 team trade
 
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