Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. Who makes your top 5? Magic Johnson, Oscar Robertson, John Stockton, Jason Kidd, Gary Payton, Walt Frazier. Who do you guys think are the top 5?
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time That wasn't my top five, I just listed the top few off the top of my head.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time My top 5, not based on hype, but talent and ability to make others around them better.1-Magic Johnson2-Oscar Robertson3-Gary Payton4-John Stockton5-Steve Nasha lot of surprise picks, but if you dont agree with me, i can easily defend any of my choices.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Do you put Steve Nash in there when he's only had 2 standout seasons when other guys have put up huge numbers for 10 or so years?
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time 1. Magic Johnson2. Oscar Robertson3. Walt Frazier4. John Stockton5. The rest
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Im not judging careers, but what he's done. How hes changed the players around hims careers is amazing, i havent even seen Magic change players games as much as he does, and the only reason hes not higher is because of only two good seasons. And also those 2 breakout seasons, he won consecutive MVPs, and hes not slowing down at all with age.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time <span style="color:#CC33CC">1 - Magic Johnson</span> - Glimpsing back on old tapes I have of Laker games, what stood out about Magic Johnson was just how good a passer he was in the fastbreak. Say that he had alot of talent, say he had Kareem, but the only thing they did was get Magic Johnson statistics in the half-court. On the fastbreak, Magic is still untouched by the Steve Nash's and Jason Kidd's of today. Not only is Magic the greatest fast break passer I've ever seen, he also had a very underrated offensive reputoir. A great 18 foot shooter, Magic combined an array of offensive moves and an unathletic but otherwise solid finishing ability to average 19.5 PPG in his carreer. Add that with three Most Valuable Player awards, multiple NBA Championships, and an ability to hit shots in the clutch, and Magic truly was something else. Now if you factor in his influence on games... We have the Greatest Point Guard of all time.**Greatest Point Guard Ever**<span style="color:#33CCFF">2. Oscar Robertson</span> - I have seen very limited footage of this player. So limited, that I cannot say I have seen more than three of his games during his prime. What I do know however, was that he averaged a triple double for an entire season, as well as almost pulling it off several more times. A career 26 PPG, 8 APG, and 7 RPG player, Robertson possesed possibly the greatest mid-range game of all time. When watching him, I saw that he was a player who focued on getting to points. Getting to the elbow and pulling up. Getting to the foul line and pulling up. While this was perhaps his greatest ability, it is also one of two things about him that limit his greatness as a point guard to me.First, what people don't notice about him, was that he was a shoot first point guard. Just like the Stephon Marbury's of today, Oscar only passed when he needed to. Because of his great ability to "get to points" , Oscar got his assists. However, I have read and seen all too many times that Oscar thought about shot first, and passing second. That is not what a point guard should do. Second, Oscar never won. He was always in the playoffs, but he could never will his team to a championship. While Magic needed a great time around him to win, Oscar never won. Period. Aside from those two nit-picks, Oscar was the greatst scoring point guard of all time, but just couldn't get enough wins to make him the best overall.**Greatest Scoring Point Guard Ever**<span style="color:#3366FF">3. John Stockton</span> - When I saw Magic, I saw a player who would get anyone and everyone the ball on the fastbreak. When I watch John Stockton, I saw a player who would get anyone and everyone the ball in the halfcourt. The Jazz were never a team that would run, never a team that would get transition opportunities. However, Stockton still found a way to average almost 11 APG over his career. During one season with the Jazz, he averaged 14.5 APG! He did this, in an offensive system focused on an inside power game and precision sets. Because of this, because of how much harder it would be to get assists in a slow down system, I believe John Stockton is the Greatest Overall Passer ever to play basketball. What makes him #3 then? Besides a great clutch ability and a solid umpshot, Stockton quite simply did not score. Whereas guys like Magic and Oscar could beat you from all angles, Stockton's highest point average in the NBA was 16 PPG. Over his career, he averaged only 13 PPG. I myself value passing over anything else, but guys like Magic and Oscar simply had more overall skill from a scoring standpoint, and their passing ability was so close, I have to use it to give out an edge.**Greatest Pure Passer Ever**<span style="color:#666666">4. Jason Kidd</span> - Kidd was obviously not the greatest fastbreak passer ever, a title that is held by Magic Johnson. However, he might have been the second best. Going to the New Jersey Nets in 2002, Kidd took a team that struggled to win 20 games to the NBA Finals with 50+ wins. Why? The Nets established a fastbreak style of game in their team, an offense that resulted in Kenyon Martin being an All Star calibur player, Keith Van Horn having career years, and Kerry Kittles lighting the scorboard up on random occasions. Today? Kittles is almost out of the league, Kenyon Martin's career is becoming more inconsistent, and Keith Van Horn is struggling to get playing time. The common factor? All have since left the Nets.Jason Kidd simply influences games, a player who throws great passes, as well as scoring when needed. During the 2002 season, TNTs "experts" went so far as to say Jason Kidd was a Top 10 overall scorer in the NBA during the end of close games. With career averages of 15 PPG and 9APG, 6 All-NBA Team selections, and 8 All-Defensive Team selections, Kidd was perhaps the greatest defensive point guard ever, as well as one of the best passers ever. The only thing hindering him? No championships.**Best Point Guard Defender Ever**<span style="color:#FF0000">5. Isiah Thomas - </span> Thomas was like Kidd in the sense he wasn't the best passing point guard overall, but he was close. However, Isiah was also a great scorer. Winning two NBA championships in his career, Isiah's most impressive performance might have actually occured in a loss. Spraining his ankle against the Lakers in the late 80s, Isiah scored 25 4th Quarter points, strugling to move at all.However, Isiah falls to #5 on my list because he wasn't the best passing point guard. He wasn't the best scoring point guard. Finally, he played absolulety no defense. It's close between he and Kidd, but Kidd's better passing ability and superioir defense gives him the edge.**Toughest Point Guard Ever**
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time 1. Magic Johnson- Its scary to think how much he would've accomplished if he didn't have to end his career early. I could go on and on about this guy.2. Oscar Robertson- I haven't really watched him play much, but I've seen him play a few times and I was really impressed. The fact that he averaged over 30, 10, and 10 in a season shows a lot right there. I do kind of consider him more of a Combo Guard though ihstead of PG.3. John Stockton- Probably the best career PG of all time. Incredible passer and assist machine. His assist record won't get touched for a while. Would be ranked higher if he would've won a ring.4. Jason Kidd- Probably the best all around PG behind Magic Johnson. Is good at almost everything including defense something so hard to find these days. Hes a triple double machine and makes players around him better. He's also a very tough player.5. Isiah Thomas- Incredible player for his size. Came into a very struggling team in the Pistons and turned them around including leading them to two championships. Incredible PG who really made players around him better. Very tough also like Kidd.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Walt Frazier needs to be on everybodys list.A top 5 point guard of all time in my opinion. He was such a great scorer and playmaker that people overlook the fact that he was a top notch defender as well. One of the greatest defensive guards in league history. He was the best player on one of the best teams in history. He dominated Jerry West in the 1970 NBA finals, He frustrated West with his tough defense and unstoppable jump shot.Frazier had one of the best stat lines in NBA history. In game 7 of the 1970 NBA finals against the great Laker team that consisted of Jerry West, Elgin Baylor, and Wilt Chamberlian. Frazier scored 39 points, dished out 19 assists, and had 5 steals. Just his points and assists alone combined for 77 of his teams total points. Those great numbers are overshadowed because of the great heroics of Willis Reed who surprised the world by limping onto the court with a major leg injury. Had this been any other night people would still be talking about Fraziers amazing performance.I posted that in my one article on Forgotten stars. I guess I rest my case.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Honestly Ive never seen Frazier play before so I don't really know enough about him to know if he's top 5 of all time. lol ive neen looking on espn classic lately for old games to learn about more players in nba history but they havent been showing any.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KMart @ Jul 2 2006, 05:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>First, what people don't notice about him, was that he was a shoot first point guard. Just like the Stephon Marbury's of today, Oscar only passed when he needed to. Because of his great ability to "get to points" , Oscar got his assists. However, I have read and seen all too many times that Oscar thought about shot first, and passing second. That is not what a point guard should do. Second, Oscar never won. He was always in the playoffs, but he could never will his team to a championship. While Magic needed a great time around him to win, Oscar never won. Period.</div>Well, there's certainly something to be said about having to play the HOFer-loaded Celtics every year. And he did win actually, in 1971. Sure, he wasn't the main option anymore with Lew Alcindor there, but he still averaged 19, 8, and 6.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>First, what people don't notice about him, was that he was a shoot first point guard. Just like the Stephon Marbury's of today, Oscar only passed when he needed to. Because of his great ability to "get to points" Oscar got his assists. However, I have read and seen all too many times that Oscar thought about shot first, and passing second. That is not what a point guard should do. Second, Oscar never won. He was always in the playoffs, but he could never will his team to a championship. While Magic needed a great time around him to win, Oscar never won. Period.</div>That's funny, Robertson won a title in 1971. He also made the Eastern Conference Finals twice. Made the NBA playoffs 9 times. I think that is phenominal considering the dynasty teams within his conference. He never had a good supporting cast which is the reason he never went far until he teamed tith Jabbar.He played in the same Conference as the great Sixer and Celtic's teams. His supporting cast just wasn't good enough to defeat those great teams.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time The reason I did not include Walt Frazier was because I have never seen him play in a game. I have seen Oscar play two or three times, Magic 15+ times, Stockton 20+ times (In his prime), Isiah 10+ times, and Kidd about a million times.I am not going to include someone I know nothing about besides stats
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Oscar Robertson is the 2nd greatest player of all-time in my opinion. He was 6'5 and had good size for a point guard. His stats are just amazing and that was when there were no threes.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time 1) Magic Johnson2) Oscar Robertson3) John Stockton4) Gary Payton5) Jason Kidd
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time Honestly, i think Jason Kidd is getting way too much love, and it may be because most people here have never really watched payton, but Payton is better then Jkidd in almost every aspect, not to mention clutchness, and he also has a championship. This isnt said much but i think Marc Jackson is underrated, though i dont agree with it, i wouldnt put up a huge arguement if someone were to say he was better then Jason Kidd. He did make that Pacers team.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PrimeTime @ Jul 3 2006, 11:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Honestly, i think Jason Kidd is getting way too much love, and it may be because most people here have never really watched payton, but Payton is better then Jkidd in almost every aspect, not to mention clutchness, and he also has a championship.</div>Come on, that's like using Mitch Richmond having a title as an argument.
Re: The top 5 PG's All-Time <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PrimeTime @ Jul 3 2006, 12:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Honestly, i think Jason Kidd is getting way too much love, and it may be because most people here have never really watched payton, but Payton is better then Jkidd in almost every aspect, not to mention clutchness, and he also has a championship. This isnt said much but i think Marc Jackson is underrated, though i dont agree with it, i wouldnt put up a huge arguement if someone were to say he was better then Jason Kidd. He did make that Pacers team.</div>WTF are you talking about? Kidd is equal to Payton in defense. Kidd is better than Payton in passing and rebounding. Payton is better in scoring..
