What is your best WHAT IF team on the Warriors? It's got to be current players.

EDIT:
Sorry, I didn't make the rules of this post clearer before. The purpose is to try and come up with the best WHAT IF team the Warriors could have had.

Rules
1. All of the players that you get for the Warriors have to be CURRENT players. No retired or former Hall of Fame players such as Wilt Chamberlain or Run TMC.

2. No making up new trades in order to get them, e.g. We get KG in trade for Troy Murphy.

3. You can select different players in past NBA drafts from where the Warriors selected. However, you cannot select someone who was drafted ahead of the Warrior's pick. You can select players who were still available when the Warriors picked.

4. It is okay to undo a trade. For example, we traded Antawn Jamison to Dallas. We could still have Jams by undoing this trade. However, once you undo a trade, you cannot have someone who was traded for be on the same team because then the traded players would not be available. For example, Baron Davis cannot be on the same team as Antawn Jamison because he was part of a later trade which involved the players that Golden State got in the original trade.

5. It is okay to re-sign past and current Warrior players, but not if the cap or the CBA rules would have disallowed it at the time.

For example, the most famous of which is Gilbert Arenas. At the time, the Warriors could not offer enough money to re-sign Gilbert Arenas without going over the the cap. Thus, we have the Gilbert Arenas Provision in the current NBA CBA. You can say that Warriors owner Chris Cohan nodded his head or shook his hand, and Gilbert being the weirdo personality that he is, re-signed for one year and then got a huge pay boost after.

 

This is too hard. I mean it's not liking we're going to find stars or good role players unless we're trading away our only betting chips (draft picks or above average role players or stars).

If anything, we should talk about what if we didn't draft Dunleavy and found guys like Caron Butler, Amare Stoudamire, Drew Gooden, on and on and on. 2002 draft was pretty weak, but that was the highest number pick we've seen since Richardson.

I'm sure Dunleavy wouldn't get as much hate if we happened to draft him around the mid first round to late first round. Then in hindsight, he wouldn't be that bad. He was just overrated. Even Morrison is better than him, IMO because of the aggressiveness factor.

 

what about Arenas?

 

yeah your stipulations are slightly confusing and dont really allow for much freedom of choice.

 

<div class="quote_poster">oaktank88 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">yeah your stipulations are slightly confusing and dont really allow for much freedom of choice.</div>

Ditto... I sort of gave up trying to make sense of the rules. You'd have to put your own example to give us an idea.

 

My best WHAT IF team would be What If The Warriors were Really the Suns!

 

-Kept Arenas because of some under the table agreement with Cohan, ala Joe Smith and Twolves except they don't get caught.
-Drafted Joe Johnson instead of Jrich.
-Drafted Gerald Wallace instead of Murphy.
-Drafted Amare instead of Dunleavy.
-Drafted Bynum instead of Ike.
-Drafted Korver instead of Zimmerman
-Drafted Millsap instead of Perovic
-Foyle never resigned.
-Never traded Jamison
So my team would be

PG: Arenas
SG: Joe Johnson
SF: Gerald Wallace
PF: Amare
C: Bynum

Bench:
Jamison
Pietrus
Biedrins
Ellis
Zarko
Korver
POB
Millsap

 

To me the only realistic what if would be what if we did not resign any of our FA except for Jrich until the market had decided their worth and then we either resigned them for much less than they are making now, or we let them walk. Then we would have more money for free agency and resigning our own young stars now and in upcoming seasons. Then again I would have never drafted Dunleavy at the #3 spot I would have drafted someone else or traded the pick. Then again, what if we would have gotten the #1 pick instead of #3? Yao :drool:

 

For me (personal taste), a much more entertaining question is not what would have been, but what will be? We all see the mistakes that have happened/have been let to happen/have been made. Of course in hindsight, Adonal Foyle's contract is atrocious. However, at the time he was playing like an all-star, and deserved a top $$ contract for a legit double-double center.

Just kidding.

But seriously, all the crap that has happened in the past is good fuel for the upcoming bon-fire kegger Mullin is going to be hosting. It's party-time in GS, and everyone's invited (you too Custodian).

Depite the torment of the past, and the pain of the present (Foyle, Dunleavy, <insert name here>), the future is looking suprisingly bright. Don't listen to the pessimists.

Despite his total double-??-blunders (see a queen-for-pawn sacrifice in chess), Mullin has still somehow to put himself in decent position for the future. Not great. But decent.

He has a plethora of young talent. He has some large veteran contracts which will be expiring in a few years and thus will be attractive in a year or two. He has depth at the majority of positions (when everyone is healthy). he has draft picks. He has an owner who believes in him and who will spend $$ to make it happen.

I'm not saying Mully is the answer; I'm saying that despite everything, GS is sitting in a comforatble position for near future. GS will be in a position of strength, should they choose, for many trades and/or free agent signings.

And I think Mullin, if he stays, will have learned from the past. I don't think he'll ever make a Dunleavy or Foyle mistake again. If he were still that weak a GM, he would have signed Pietrus this off-season. Instead, he waited to see how it shakes out. Like any intelligent GM would do.

So, rather than talk about what could have been (sorry, not trying to hijack the thread, just stating my own taste) I like to think about what will be. I think this team is on the right track, and has the recipe for some exciting things in the near future.

I wouldn't say this about just any team. And it's not because I'm a homer (although I am at times a homer!), but I sincerely believe that GS has a core of younger players who could all be part of a franchise championship team. The way they're going, both Beans and Monta could be hall-of-famers one day. I know it sounds like I'm dreaming, but I believe it's possible.

Remember when Arenas started busting out from out of nowhere? Suddenly he went from being a second-round bench player to being one of the franchise-faces of the NBA and a top-10 player. He'll be a hall-of-famer one day.

It's early, but please, do me a favor and mark my words. Monta could be a hall-of-famer one day. If I had to give a yes or no answer, I'd say yes -- I think he will.

So the question is will he be in GS when that happens.

Many teams could have had an ultimate line-up if they'd maneuvered correctly. But most don't. Most make mistakes. GS could have a championship team with all the talent that's passed through here. But they don't. Now, however, is the time for Mullin to look at the future, the near future.... He MUST find a way to cut contracts so he can resign Beans and Monta.

Otherwise we'll be starting another thread like this in a few years... "Imagine what would have been if only we'd kept Monta and Beans!!!!!"

 

Maybe it would be better if we just came up with one or two scenarios and add to the team as we go along. Or if you want to put together your own team, that's fine, too.

I'll start it off by selecting Andris Biedrins with the #11 pick in the 2005 NBA Draft.

CR2 said drafting Amare at #3 instead of Mike Dunleavy Jr. authentiq said Gilbert Arenas (see his scenarios below).

PG: Gilbert
SG:
SF:
PF: Amare
C: AB

We could have drafted Gilbert Arenas in the first round at #3 of the 2002 NBA Draft instead of Mike Dunleavy Jr. Of course, then he may not have the chip on his shoulder, worn #0 and be as good as he is today. History could have changed . If we do this scenario, then we cannot have Gilbert on the same team with Amare.

However, we can do the Cohan nodding his head or shaking Gilbert's hand story as it was told (I can't remember who told it. Was it by Arenas or media?) and have Gil re-signed. He's crazy enough to re-sign for one year and then for a big raise afterwards. Gilbert said in an ESPN interview that he would've stayed at Golden State in the past day or two.

 

The day he chose Washington, Gilbert did an interview with KNBR. Golden state could have given him an under-the-table, 1-year word-of moth deal with a promise to sign him long-term the following year.

Gilbert said he would have taken the deal. His one stipulation was that Cohan quote "look him in the eyes and shake his hand." He said that was all he wanted. He had the verbal promise; he wanted a "man-to-man" promise. He said he didn't get that, so he chose the sure thing with Washington.

Who knows how it went down, but if there's one player in the NBA I trust to tell it like it is, it's Arenas (along with Nash). He told KNBR (I believe it was Ralph and Tom) "Dude, guys, I would have stayed, I'd be a Warrior right now, but Cohan refused to look me in the eye and give me a promise."

 

Can we do the shortened version of "What if..." instead?

Like "what if" we played better defense, rebounded, shot free throws, and created offense better?

Oh, and "what if" our GM didn't put all his eggs into one basket and declared his 2004 offseason building a "playoff team contender". Only one who saw the playoffs was Derek Fisher and Calbert Cheaney. That's 2/7's of an active playoff bench roster.

 

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Can we do the shortened version of "What if..." instead?

Like "what if" we played better defense, rebounded, shot free throws, and created offense better?

Oh, and "what if" our GM didn't put all his eggs into one basket and declared his 2004 offseason building a "playoff team contender". Only one who saw the playoffs was Derek Fisher and Calbert Cheaney. That's 2/7's of an active playoff bench roster.</div>

Oh.... boo hoo


j/k

Look at the bright side... At least D-Fish is becoming semi-valuable in Utah.

 

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Can we do the shortened version of "What if..." instead?

Like "what if" we played better defense, rebounded, shot free throws, and created offense better? </div>

Yeah, but we do that almost every Warrior game.

 

<div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Oh.... boo hoo


j/k

Look at the bright side... At least D-Fish is becoming semi-valuable in Utah.</div>

He was always of value when it came to clutch shooting and making the occasionally excellent bounce pass. But he needs a smart playmaker or else his overall game and his sporadic stupidity and slowness will ruin it all.

 

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah, but we do that almost every Warrior game.</div>

LOL. It hurts everytime I ponder about it too.

What if Dunleavy didn't suck at small forward?

 

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">He was always of value when it came to clutch shooting and making the occasionally excellent bounce pass. But he needs a smart playmaker or else his overall game and his sporadic stupidity and slowness will ruin it all.</div>

? Dude, excellent bounce pass?

The only bounce-passes I remember from D-Fish were when he was trying to do the "Jordan-meets-AI" triple cross over shake-n'-bake spin move and he'd bounce the ball off his toe to a defender for a fastbreak the other way. Oh, that and when he tried to go 1-on-4 and he'd pound it for 20 seconds at center court and then do a triple spin move jab step fade-away three from half court and it'd be a bounce pass of the backboard to one of the fans sitting in the third row.

 

<div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">? Dude, excellent bounce pass?

The only bounce-passes I remember from D-Fish were when he was trying to do the "Jordan-meets-AI" triple cross over shake-n'-bake spin move and he'd bounce the ball off his toe to a defender for a fastbreak the other way. Oh, that and when he tried to go 1-on-4 and he'd pound it for 20 seconds at center court and then do a triple spin move jab step fade-away three from half court and it'd be a bounce pass of the backboard to one of the fans sitting in the third row.</div>

I was watching Dfish, he had some nice bounce passes when people like Jrich or Pietrus were moving. He wasn't that bad at passing, he just wasn't also that good at creating or decision-making, especially if the other team players aren't that good at finishing or creating plays either. Just look at who he shared the starting spots with: Troy Murphy, Mike Dunleavy Jr., and Adonal Foyle. The only guy he could reliably pass to for an inside play assist was Jrich around the basket because he moved a lot more aggressively and finished stronger than the other guys did. And who was the team's best free throw shooter and overall shooter? The Fish.

The other three starting guys next to Fisher (and not named Jrich) suck or are very limited in what they can provide to a team. So arguably the 2nd best scoring option was either Fisher or Murphy, both who I think are too slow to surround our best player with and are horrible creating their own shot or finding the open man. We also didn't have much bench production because Dunleavy was at his worst, Pietrus wasn't that trustworthy to increase his role, and our former coach hated rookies more than Larry Brown or Don Nelson.

So, it was obviously lose-lose once the 2004 team proved they couldn't do anything without at least one player who can play big minutes each game and break somebody down and deliver the ball. (a la Speedy Claxton and somewhat healthy NVE) and later Baron Davis. Fisher was not that guy. No quickness or court awareness/creativity whatsoever. Claxton, NVE, Baron Davis are far better creative players than the type that Dfish was. But then again, that's the difference between a pure point guard that can score (or defend) vs. a combo guard that mostly made his mark playing a catch and shoot role player that took charges once in a while and fed entry passes into Shaq.

 

Actually I should say that Dfish was creative when he wasn't moving at all. LOL. hence, bounce passes could be made when other guys were cutting and the floor spacing was good. But Dfish would rather shoot first, and then pass second, especially if there's no rebounders underneath the hoop before he shoots. Absolute momentum killer right there. I guess he figured Murphy wasn't going to get positioning for offensive boards, Dunleavy would hightail it back to defense when the shot went up, and Foyle would be too clumsy to rebound or too unselfish to go after it (because he boxes out)

Let's just say Dfish sucks and forget trying to make this a positive post about a player.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Gohn Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">-Kept Arenas because of some under the table agreement with Cohan, ala Joe Smith and Twolves except they don't get caught.
-Drafted Joe Johnson instead of Jrich.
-Drafted Gerald Wallace instead of Murphy.
-Drafted Amare instead of Dunleavy.
-Drafted Bynum instead of Ike.
-Drafted Korver instead of Zimmerman
-Drafted Millsap instead of Perovic
-Foyle never resigned.
-Never traded Jamison
So my team would be

PG: Arenas
SG: Joe Johnson
SF: Gerald Wallace
PF: Amare
C: Bynum

Bench:
Jamison
Pietrus
Biedrins
Ellis
Zarko
Korver
POB
Millsap</div>

Nice lineup Gohn. I like the Joe Johnson instead of JRich. That's one few people think of including myself.

EDIT: We could've drafted Gilbert instead of Troy Murphy at #14. That ESPN interview really got to me. Gil said he wouldn't have mind remaining a Warrior and he likes the West Coast.

(I was wrong in my post earlier. Gilbert Arenas could've been drafted instead of Murphy not Dunleavy.)

I'm not as sure about Bynum as other people, but he has been impressive and certainly a better pick than Ike.

What about selecting Tracy McGrady at SF instead of Adonal Foyle? I couldn't believe my ears when PJ said they never really considered him. I was rooting hard for T-Mac when the Warriors were about to announce their pick .

The other draft that got to me was the one for Jamison. We had similar players like Jamison already and he was labeled a tweener. I wanted Vince Carter because of his unbelievable hops. Second was Paul Pierce and he was a hometown favorite. I was scratching my head on how and why we got Jamison as Garry St. Jean explained afterward.