When people discuss the top teams in the Eastern Conference, and possible conference champions. You always hear about the Cleveland Cavaliers from the Orlando Magic. But we are in the running for winning the Conference right now. What separates the Orlando Magic from the 'contenders' like the Cleveland Cavaliers and Boston Celtics.
The Magic still have to prove themselves in the playoffs. LeBron took his team to the Finals and the Celtics are defending champs. In comparison, the only series the Magic have won in the Dwight era is against the Toronto.
But when talking about contenders in the Western Conference New Orleans gains the reputation of being contenders. However they only got to the second round like us. Last year the Cavaliers also bowed out in the second round, however the Pistons made it too the conference finals. They are never in playoff talks either with some people. I don't think it's all to do with playoffs.
I haven't heard anybody call NO a contender in the West. Everybody just assumes the Lakers will win. But even if you have, they, at least, took SA to 7 games and the series could have gone either way. Same goes for the Cavs, they gave the Celtics their toughest series. I think the Pistons lost all of their contending credibility when they traded Chauncey for Iverson. Sure, it's not all about playoffs, but that has a lot to do with it, IMO.
Funny, all I hear about contenders are the Lakers, Hornets and Spurs. I guess it differs from forums. I'm still bagging San Antonio for championship contenders until Tim Duncan retires. The Pistons are still a great I think though, I know Billups was their floor general but aside from that they have a lot of depth and talent. I wouldn't put them out of the mix yet.
Youth is what seperates Orlando from those two teams. I think the Magic will need homecourt advantage to beat either Boston or Cleveland in a 7 game series. I also think the Magic need to add another viable big man to backup Howard. Boston and Cleveland would neutralize him and the Magic would be forced to win from the outside which doesn't work in the post season.
I wouldn't say we're that long. Perhaps lack a little experience in the playoffs. But I think these last few years have proved to be a learning curve. How many years do you need to spend in the playoffs before having enough experience in the playoffs. We've been shut down by a Pistons team which is undermanned season. So our road block is pretty much gone. Anyway, back to youth. Dwight Howard, Jameer Nelson and one of my new favorites Courtney Lee have shown me that they have the expertise and maturity which can equate to a veteran player. It's been evident in the Lakers game today. We also have our share of veterans in Rashard Lewis, Anthony Johnson and perhaps Hedo Turkoglu. All of which play solid minutes in our rotation. I wouldn't see we need it. But it definitely proposes some type of advantage as it does to most teams. I think you're forgetting that we're one of the best road teams in the league. It doesn't seem to be much of an issue. San Antonio, then the Lakers, and it's probable we beat the Nuggets tomorrow. (yes I'm caught in the hype) Debatable. But truth is that our whole game is modeled around three point shooters and Dwight Howard. If you can't shoot a three pointer, you're not going to make it in the Magic roster. However we have two quality big men who are decent when given minutes. Tony Battie is someone who's great at his role and consistent, but as he's being consistent he's smart. Marcin Gortat is still learning, he's way too raw to be called a regular player. But I guarantee in a few years the Orlando Magic will have Gortat in their rotation. I think outside shooting can win games in the post season. We demolished the Raptors through that and Dwight Howards dominance. Last season proved that our players can ball in the post season we showed signs of being a contender our whole campaign. Dwight Howard is an animal in the playoffs. I still haven't seen Boston and Cleveland completely shut down Dwight Howard to date though, so I'm still disagreeing with you. Unless you can recall something I haven't seen.
I actually meant youth was an advantage Orlando had over Cleveland & Boston. Winning tough games in the regular season doesn't mean anything during the post season. Case in point Boston last year. They dominated the regular season home and away, but in the playoffs they couldn't win a road game until the Finals. Do you trust Howard delivering from the free throw line on the road down the stretch in tight games? I wouldn't. Outside shooting can win games, but it can't win a series. Players can't consistently win the post season launching 3's. The Phoenix losing time and time again in the WCF was proof of that.
Oh my bad on the first thing. Anyway. I still think regular season games do mean something in the post season. It allows the team to gain home court advantage and is a learning curve when coming into the season. And you make an example of the Boston Celtics although they won the championship? Which proves having a good record during the season reflects on performance in the playoffs? They obviously won. I don't trust Dwight Howard taking free throws down the stretch. However I do trust his defensive games down the line and his offensive presence in spreading the floor. Which is extremely valuable to the Magic franchise. Without him we're pretty much done. But teams can win the season with a dominant big man and good supporting cast. Perfect case: Shaq and the Miami Heat. Tim Duncan and the San Antonio Spurs. Dwight Howard is making similar dominance to these players on the Orlando Magic.
it seems pretty simple to me. when the game is on the line, cleveland can give the ball to lebron. he'll attack and either get something good or find a teammate. same goes for pierce on boston. orlando can't do that with dwight. it's much easier to deny the ball to a post player and howard can't hit his free throws anyway. so that leaves the ball in the hands of hedo or nelson. and while both guys are playing great, only an idiot would want the ball in their hands over lebron or pierce.
So you're talking about closing out games? The Orlando Magic have 3 people who are capable of scoring down the stretch. Hedo Turkoglu, Jameer Nelson and Rashard Lewis. Dwight Howard can also score down the stretch but hasn't shown it consistently.
you're missing the point completely. of course the magic have guys capable of scoring down the stretch. but they don't have guys on the level of lebron/pierce to score down the stretch which is what puts them behind the cavs/celtics.
So what makes you a playoff team is having a superstar you can look to down the stretch? I know I'm completely missing the point, because there's been great teams like the Detroit Pistons, Minnesota Timberwolves and perhaps San Antonio Spurs who has won championshps/been contenders with no superstar wing player like Paul Pierce and LeBron James.
what are you talking about? i never said that's what makes them a playoff team. what makes them a playoff team is that they are in the east and have a record at or above .500. the twolves were never really contenders. they had one good run where they a couple of good pieces were playing really well around garnett, but that's it. nothing special there. detroit was special. they were good enough that not having a superstar closer didn't matter because they were that much better than their eastern conference competition. it really shouldn't be too hard to that with them being a team that came close to making the finals and then adding a player like sheed. and the spurs? really? you can't be serious. duncan is the unique big man in very recent memory that can be a go to guy down the stretch. him and hakeem are the guys in that category who immediately come to mind and really have that category to themselves for the past 10-15 or so years.
A fine question/thread! I'm responding to everyone's posts in general, not anything specific to any one of them. For a few seasons, Phoenix was considered a contender. They had strong winning records in the regular season and even the league's MVP for two straight seasons, yet failed miserably in the playoffs. This should be an indication that winning a series is a lot different than regular season play. You play against a team that gets to focus 100% of its practice time on you, try things in game 2 and look at the results and films of the game, then play you in game 3, etc. Championship teams seem to have at least one player you could argue is the very best in the league, and certainly a couple of other players who would be "the man" on a lot of other teams if they played for them. Detroit gets an undeserved reputation as the "exception" to this rule. I'd argue that Ben Wallace was the very best in the league for his defense alone (nobody in league history like him but a few: Russell being one). If not Ben, Sheed or Billups. There you go, one player (in this case 3) you could argue is the best in the league and a couple of other players... There's an age factor, too. The champions have certainly had a lot of NBA experience. Kobe is the rare superstar who won a title early in his career at a young age. But he had Shaq, who was the best player in the league at age 27 and Glen Rice at age 32 and Rick Fox at age 30 and Ron Harper at age 36. Duncan won his first championship at age 22 paired with DRob, but four seasons passed before he won his second, at age 26. The point being, that even the best players at a young age don't seem to be part of the winning equation. The east is weak. At least that's the perception and the trend in recent seasons. For that reason alone, it's hard to get respect for a winning record. I mean, you go in and beat a "weak" 9th seed Dallas team and you're beating Dirk (former MVP) and Howard; go in and beat the Nets and you're beating a team that's rebuilding on the fly with a couple of standout players. There's no doubt Orlando is playing well right now. Given the right matchups, they could win it all. If you're pinning your hopes on Dwight Howard, consider that Moses Malone couldn't win championships but once, and he needed teammates like Dr. J (MVP, 32 years old).
