Politics What sides of Political fence do you sit on?

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by magnifier661, Aug 10, 2015.

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What side(s) of Political Fence do you sit on?

Poll closed Aug 30, 2015.
  1. Liberal on social views, Liberal on economic views

    50.0%
  2. Conservative on social views, Conservative on economic views

    13.6%
  3. Liberal on Social views, Conservative on economic views

    31.8%
  4. Conservative on Social views, Liberal on economic views

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. ANARCHY!

    4.5%
  1. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Wow... So now the Republicans in the House didn't raise the rates? Are you trying to perform a Gish gallop in this debate? Paint so much bull crap that it's hard to refute it all?
     
  2. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Most of education isn't for profit. Tuition at the UofI where I went, is now $20K a year. When I went, it was $500/semester and $300 for books. Now that government is subsidizing loans, the schools raise their rates. Like piglets suckling on the government teets.

    UofI is a STATE SCHOOL, not a for profit business.

    A free market would mean very few could afford the rates so they'd have to lower them to fill up the student body. Supply and demand, Econ 101 (at UofI of course).
     
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    The house doesn't set the rates. Obama could veto, but doesn't. You trust him or a clown?

    The government sets the rates for federal loans, but those aren't all the loans taken on by students. Only one of the four kinds of federal loans is 6% or more. Those are direct loans to the parents, who presumably have some net worth.

    ALL federal loans to undergrads are at 4.29% for 2015, a DECREASE of .37% from last year.

    https://studentaid.ed.gov/sa/about/announcements/interest-rate
     
  4. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Hilarious how you will do just like most trolls do and shoot the messenger. Watch the frigging video. I bet you don't. He actually has an investigative team that does his work. Watch the video and educate yourself. Also that's not my source. That's just the source that can put it into layman's terms so libertarians can understand. Like I said watch the video. I knew you would cop out...[/QUOTE]
    I saw the video, went to his site.

    I'm no fan of religion in any form, but for good reason, the government has to be hands off religion. Like, what if they tax Catholics 80% but Unitarians 5%? That would be establishing a national religion.

    Unions are tax exempt. Why should they be? Hmmm? For the record, I am pro (non public) Union.
     
  5. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Ok, so you just found another $70B. Good work. $74B here, $70B there, pretty soon it adds up to real money. Keep going, there is more to be found!

    barfo
     
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  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    That's all of the "profits" you want to tax, barfo. There is no more than the ~$73.5B to be more exact. The HIGHEST estimate of accumulated untaxed profits is $2.1T.

    $2.1T * .35 (35% corporate tax) is $.735T

    Sue me if I round it down to $70B. Last repatriation of such funds was 2004. It's really been 11 years now. $.735T/11 = ~$67B.

    That's all there is to get your panties in a wad over.
     
  7. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    You forgot to say 'held overseas'. Not all profits are held overseas.

    You want to pretend there aren't any profits that could be taxed. There are, there are $6T in profits each and every year.

    I'm not actually arguing for increasing corporate taxes. I'm just pointing out that your DennyMath is very misleading - at best.

    barfo
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    For the companies to get to zero or negative tax, virtually all of their profit is overseas.

    Otherwise they'd be paying US taxes on it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/feb/02/apple-cash-mountain-grows

    Apple last week reported that its cash mountain had grown to $178bn (£118bn) – among the biggest of any public corporation in the world. The lion’s share is surplus profits from outside America, in large part thanks to the huge popularity of its phones, laptops and other products around the globe, but also in no small measure because of its aggressive Irish tax structure.

    As at the end of September last year, cash held offshore and beyond the grasp of the US taxman stood at $137bn and is likely to have grown since. At present, this sum cannot be reinvested in Apple’s US businesses nor returned to shareholders without incurring a colossal tax bill. In effect, it is in limbo.

    The cash pile is technically owned by Apple’s subsidiaries in Knocknaheeny, a rundown northern suburb of Cork, Ireland. But it is managed by a rarely talked-of investment subsidiary closer to home and largely invested in American assets, including billions in corporate bonds and US government debt.

    There is only one brief mention of this opaque internal investment company in Apple’s annual report, on page 114. It is called Braeburn Capital and registered in a quiet corner of Reno, Nevada. Some commentators have described it as “the biggest hedge fund you’ve never heard of”.

    It is this kind of operation – common to many US multinationals, particularly in the tech and pharmaceuticals industries – that Obama is looking to deflate, freeing up America’s largest companies to repatriate cash held in limbo, but without releasing them entirely from US tax liabilities they have been avoiding for years, often very creatively.

    My note: the remainder of the $178B is not "permanently invested" overseas, but it is overseas and the tax deferred. If they had paid 35% tax on it all along, it would have been ~$3.5B/year in revenue to the government. To make things even better for Apple, when they need cash, they borrow money from the overseas subsidiary. Borrowed money isn't taxed, and the interest paid (from apple to apple) is.

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-to-offer-more-bonds-1422888975

    Apple Boosts Size of Bond Deal to $6.5 Billion
    U.S.’s Largest High-Grade Corporate-Debt Sale This Year Finds Strong Demand; ‘A Nice, Core Holding’
     
  9. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Well, no. The tax code is really quite complex, and there are many, many ways to legally - or at least arguably legally - avoid paying tax. Big companies have entire departments dedicated to it.

    barfo
     
  10. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Strawman... tax all those motherfuckers! There's absolutely no reason that someone should be able to live in a 6 million dollar house without paying any property tax.
     
  11. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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  12. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    So it's legal?

    Wow, what are you arguing about?

    :lol:
     
  13. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Who said it was illegal?

    barfo
     
  14. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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  15. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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  16. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    So he's making crazy accusations.

    The People, and that means people assembled as corporations (and unions) have the right to petition government.

    The guys you vote for gave them whatever tax breaks they have.
     
  17. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    When he talks about illegal, it seems he's talking about actions that caused the recession, not offshore tax havens (which are legal but he'd like to change that).

    barfo
     
  18. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    "Stealing Trillions."

    When Obama does it, it's "legal" too.
     
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  19. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko Staff Member Global Moderator

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    So, you are allowed to complain about Obama, but Bernie is not allowed to complain about corporations?

    Got it.

    barfo
     
  20. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I'm fine with getting the companies to pay taxes according to a less deferred schedule.

    The issue isn't that, it's that fools think there's some giant pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

    The GIANT pot of gold to be had is the $20T in debt, mostly accumulated since 2009, plus all the money the fed printed to bolster the stock market. Or the $4T government recklessly spends.

    When you want to tackle a HUGE problem, you go after the bits that are the biggest % of the problem, not fret over the .4% bits until you've done all you can do elsewhere.
     

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