Who is better Deng or Nociani (sp?) I would pick Deng he has better skills since playing at Duke for a year so he has more expirence.
Luol Deng is better IMO. Deng is averaging 20 PPG and 7 RPG. Nocioni is averaging 11 PPG and 9 RPG. Deng has 9 points on Nocioni and he is only averaging 2 less rebounds. Deng is by far the better player.
I'll say Deng, because at this point he seems to be our franchise player. Kirk is the only other player who I think is untouchable. Nocioni will be and is a very valuable roleplayer, one in which I wouldn't trade unless the "right" trade offer came about.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TwinTowers:</div><div class="quote_post">Who is better Deng or Nociani (sp?) I would pick Deng he has better skills since playing at Duke for a year so he has more expirence.</div> Experiance? lol, Noc played for another country for years and into the olympics. But no matter, I couldn't say who is better because of the fact that the season is still a few games in. It is impossible to say who is better as of right now.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting M Two One:</div><div class="quote_post">Experiance? lol, Noc played for another country for years and into the olympics. But no matter, I couldn't say who is better because of the fact that the season is still a few games in. It is impossible to say who is better as of right now.</div> Exactly. Just because Deng is averaging more points in the first week of the NBA doesn't mean he's better. Nocioni has a more all-around game and although he might not be as good stat-wise, he will have a bigger impact on the team.
I think it's Nocioni. He's got more skills, both offensively and defensively. He's got the experience. He's been in the olympics and has been playing longer than Deng. I'd go with him. He may be a rookie by years in NBA, but by experience in the game, he's nowhere near. Deng however, is a rookie. He is fresh out of his freshman year in college right now, and to me, he's not as ready as some think he is.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">I think it's Nocioni. He's got more skills, both offensively and defensively. He's got the experience. He's been in the olympics and has been playing longer than Deng. I'd go with him. He may be a rookie by years in NBA, but by experience in the game, he's nowhere near. Deng however, is a rookie. He is fresh out of his freshman year in college right now, and to me, he's not as ready as some think he is.</div> Are we watching the same games? Deng's offense is clearly better. Deng has been the only one shooting anything respecatble(percentage-wise) lately. Deng's passing and court vision are impressive for a rookie. It was Deng, coupled with Duhon and Hinrich who helped the Bulls get back into the Nets game with their offense and defense. Deng's offense is superior to Nocioni's. Nocioni is shooting 32.7% from the field. That's hardly "more skills than Deng." For comparison, Deng is shooting 45.6% Deng: Ranks #15 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds Per Game(3.3) Ranks #7 in the NBA in Field Goals Per 48 Minutes(11.45) Ranks #5 in the NBA in Field-Goal Attempts Per 48 Minutes(25.11)
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Vintage:</div><div class="quote_post">Are we watching the same games? Deng's offense is clearly better. Deng has been the only one shooting anything respecatble(percentage-wise) lately. Deng's passing and court vision are impressive for a rookie. It was Deng, coupled with Duhon and Hinrich who helped the Bulls get back into the Nets game with their offense and defense. Deng's offense is superior to Nocioni's. Nocioni is shooting 32.7% from the field. That's hardly "more skills than Deng." For comparison, Deng is shooting 45.6% Deng: Ranks #15 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds Per Game(3.3) Ranks #7 in the NBA in Field Goals Per 48 Minutes(11.45) Ranks #5 in the NBA in Field-Goal Attempts Per 48 Minutes(25.11)</div> Not sure if you realize this, but it's what, 4 games into the season. Currently, stats are somewhat irrelevant this early on. You can't gauge a teams success based on how good they start the season. If you can, hell, hand Phoenix the championship for starting off 4-0. And for me, it's the same with players. You can't judge a player yet, at least a rookie. If you can, well than Deng would probably get ROY because he's been good. But, if you logically think about it, there's nothing wrong with bringing him off the bench. He provides the Bulls a spark when necessary and he can bring it offensively. That's why I like him coming off the bench. If you start him, you might lose that.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">Not sure if you realize this, but it's what, 4 games into the season. Currently, stats are somewhat irrelevant this early on. You can't gauge a teams success based on how good they start the season. If you can, hell, hand Phoenix the championship for starting off 4-0. And for me, it's the same with players. You can't judge a player yet, at least a rookie. If you can, well than Deng would probably get ROY because he's been good. But, if you logically think about it, there's nothing wrong with bringing him off the bench. He provides the Bulls a spark when necessary and he can bring it offensively. That's why I like him coming off the bench. If you start him, you might lose that.</div> YOU were the one stating that Nocioni has played better than Deng. I was using stats to prove otherwise. Deng has been clearly playing better than Nocioni. YOU stated that Nocioni was playing better offensively. I was using stats to refute that. Not only did you fail to address the issue of why you believe Nocioni is better, you bring about a weak arguement about stats being four games into the year. If you were trying to decide who is better, then yes, four games is not applicable. However, when you said that Nocioni is better offensively, the stats of the four games are open for discussion, because you were basing that statement off of those 4 games. Once again, I ask you, how is Nocioni better than Deng offensively? And to further develop the arguement, its not the fact that Deng is being brought off the bench that bothers me. Its the fact that Deng got 27 minutes the last game. He should have gotten more. He shot the bell well and should have been in the game longer. As of now, there is no reason to keep Deng from playing 30+ minutes a game, as long as his stamina can allow him too. And everything so far says he can.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Vintage:</div><div class="quote_post">YOU were the one stating that Nocioni has played better than Deng. I was using stats to prove otherwise. Deng has been clearly playing better than Nocioni. YOU stated that Nocioni was playing better offensively. I was using stats to refute that. Not only did you fail to address the issue of why you believe Nocioni is better, you bring about a weak arguement about stats being four games into the year. If you were trying to decide who is better, then yes, four games is not applicable. However, when you said that Nocioni is better offensively, the stats of the four games are open for discussion, because you were basing that statement off of those 4 games. Once again, I ask you, how is Nocioni better than Deng offensively? And to further develop the arguement, its not the fact that Deng is being brought off the bench that bothers me. Its the fact that Deng got 27 minutes the last game. He should have gotten more. He shot the bell well and should have been in the game longer. As of now, there is no reason to keep Deng from playing 30+ minutes a game, as long as his stamina can allow him too. And everything so far says he can.</div> You sure do like putting words in my mouth. I never once stated that Nocioni was playing better. I simply stated that he has more skills on offense. Now, if in my post, you can show me where I said that, I'll believe you, til then, nope. And I wasn't basing my thought off those four games. I'm basing it the way that Nocioni played overseas and so far. He was great overseas. I don't remember his stats, but he was touted to be the best international player not in the NBA. He's got some great athleticism, I know that much. He's a good slasher and he can shoot the ball. Granted he hasn't shown all these yet, he is capable of doing it. To top it off, he's been great on the boards, last I knew at least. So, to me, aside from his horrid shooting percentage, there's no reason to bench him right now. He has not worked his way out of the starting lineup yet.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post"> I don't remember his stats, but he was touted to be the best international player not in the NBA. </div> And Deng was touted as the best HS prospect behind LeBron. Your point? I don't care what he was touted. I care about performance. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> He's a good slasher and he can shoot the ball. </div> His field goal percentage suggests otherwise <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> So, to me, aside from his horrid shooting percentage, there's no reason to bench him right now. He has not worked his way out of the starting lineup yet.</div> The last game, against the Clippers, we outrebounded the Clippers 46-41. Nocioni had 5 rebounds. Deng had 6, for that matter. 35-82 42.7% Somehow, the Clippers shot worse than us. So, if you are asking me which is more important, an extra two rebounds a game(average) or better shooting, I will take the better shooting.
I think Deng just because he come's in with energy and doesnt take bad shots,Naconi is good shooter but still needs to be more agressive on the offensive side Without a doubt DENG
Alright Vintage, you want me to prove to you that Nocioni can score, can shoot, whatever. Take a look at this. Those are his stats for his career in the Euroleague. Note the experience he has (been playing since he was 16). Also, you say he can't shoot, take a look at those percentages. He was a career 52% shooter over in the Euroleague. Now, are you going to continue to tell me he can't shoot the ball? The one unfortunate thing about that site is all it shows is scoring stuff, no rebounds, blocks, steals, assists, etc. But, nonetheless, that does show he can shoot. It's like I said, he's getting adjusted to the American style of play.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">Alright Vintage, you want me to prove to you that Nocioni can score, can shoot, whatever. Take a look at this. Those are his stats for his career in the Euroleague. Note the experience he has (been playing since he was 16). Also, you say he can't shoot, take a look at those percentages. He was a career 52% shooter over in the Euroleague. Now, are you going to continue to tell me he can't shoot the ball? The one unfortunate thing about that site is all it shows is scoring stuff, no rebounds, blocks, steals, assists, etc. But, nonetheless, that does show he can shoot. It's like I said, he's getting adjusted to the American style of play.</div> I don't care what he did in Euroleague. Last time I checked the NBA and Euroleague were seperate. As of now, Deng is better offensively. He has produced better thus far. The stats prove it. Deng should be starting because AS OF NOW, he has shown better abilities on the offensive end.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Vintage:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't care what he did in Euroleague. Last time I checked the NBA and Euroleague were seperate. As of now, Deng is better offensively. He has produced better thus far. The stats prove it. Deng should be starting because AS OF NOW, he has shown better abilities on the offensive end.</div> See, I'm just showing those to you to prove that he CAN shoot. He hasn't shown it in the NBA YET, but he is very capable of shooting the ball. That's the point that I was trying to get across by digging those up.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">See, I'm just showing those to you to prove that he CAN shoot. He hasn't shown it in the NBA YET, but he is very capable of shooting the ball. That's the point that I was trying to get across by digging those up.</div> I am not saying he can't shoot; period. I am saying, as of now, he cannot shoot. Bad shot selection and rushing his shots are contributing to his low percentage. Which is why I believe we need Deng in the starting lineup ASAP because we cannot afford to get behind in games early on. Until Nocioni demonstrates better shooting, Deng should be starting. Otherwise we will be fighting from behind every game.
