Sheed FTW!!

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Mediocre Man said:
Sheed was a world class prick, but a fantastic player
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A fantastic 7fter who pulled down 7 rebounds per game in an average of 35 minutes. That puts him top 33 in Blazer history, and he played significantly more minutes per game than all but 4 players ahead of him (Walton, Ellis, Wicks, and Thompson).

Truly a rare accomplishment.
 
Hoopguru said:
Sheed refusing to give a autographs is one thing.
Drexler was a selfish non tipper to the max. Those that look to get out of tipping or flat refuse to tip drive me nuts, especially when they can afford too.
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I heard Pippen is similar on the tipping thing...
 
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A sampling of some players we've discussed in this thread per 36 minutes as Blazers. Also added some past and present players for reference. Only considering the 185 players who have played more than 50 games for the Blazers.

-Per 36 minutes- (All Time Blazer Rank 50+games)

Bill Walton *68 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 18.27 (# 29 )
Reb# 14.42 (# 1 )
Ast# 4.72 (# 38 )

Clyde Drexler *106 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 22.02 (# 4 )
Reb# 6.56 (# 85 )
Ast# 6.04 (# 17 )

Damian Lillard*144 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 23.31 (# 3 )
Reb# 4.35 (# 128 )
Ast# 6.25 (# 13 )

Arvydas Sabas *146 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 17.85 (# 46)
Reb# 10.86 (# 20)
Ast# 3.12 (# 80)

Scottie Pippen *166 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 12.71 (# 49 )
Reb# 5.91 (# 95 )
Ast# 5.57 (# 22 )

BrandonRoy *175 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 19.21 (# 17 )
Reb# 4.35 (# 122 )
Ast# 4.75 (# 36 )

Rasheed Wallace *249 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 17.04 (# 41 )
Reb# 7.10 (# 76 )
Ast# 2.03 (# 132 )

Zach Collins *329 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 12.00 (# 134 )
Reb# 8.14 (#61 )
Ast# 1.93 (#134 )

=============== Just for fun - only 20 games ===============

Anfernee Simons *390 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 19.27 (# 27 )
Reb# 3.55 (# 250 )
Ast# 3.55 (# 113)
 
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kjironman1 said:
It's exactly why Sheed was a complete waste of time.
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Yep. Those 313 points (fewer, actually, since folks didn't shoot 100%) definitely made him worthless.
 
Phatguysrule said:
A sampling of some players we've discussed in this thread per 36 minutes as Blazers. Also added some past and present players for reference. Only considering the 185 players who have played more than 50 games for the Blazers.

-Per 36 minutes- (All Time Blazer Rank 50+games)

Bill Walton *68 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 18.27 (# 29 )
Reb# 14.42 (# 1 )
Ast# 4.72 (# 38 )

Clyde Drexler *106 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 22.02 (# 4 )
Reb# 6.56 (# 85 )
Ast# 6.04 (# 17 )

Damian Lillard*144 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 23.31 (# 3 )
Reb# 4.35 (# 128 )
Ast# 6.25 (# 13 )

Arvydas Sabas *146 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 17.85 (# 46)
Reb# 10.86 (# 20)
Ast# 3.12 (# 80)

Scottie Pippen *166 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 12.71 (# 49 )
Reb# 5.91 (# 95 )
Ast# 5.57 (# 22 )

BrandonRoy *175 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 19.21 (# 17 )
Reb# 4.35 (# 122 )
Ast# 4.75 (# 36 )

Rasheed Wallace *249 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 17.04 (# 41 )
Reb# 7.10 (# 76 )
Ast# 2.03 (# 132 )

Zach Collins *329pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 12.00 (# 134 )
Reb# 8.14 (#61 )
Ast# 1.93 (#134 )

=============== Just for fun - only 20 games ===============

Anfernee Simons *390 pts from Blazer perfection*
Pts# 19.27 (# 27 )
Reb# 3.55 (# 250 )
Ast# 3.55 (# 113)
Click to expand...
What is "pts from Blazer perfection?"
 
blazerkor said:
Statistically speaking Sheed owned both Pippen and Sabas. He carried them more than the other way around. As far as sabotage goes, please give me an example of how he "sabotaged" the team.
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If you click the link below, you can see Sabonis and Pippen were actually quite a bit more productive than Sheed. Even though he was in his prime and they were washed up old farts.

Roy was more productive as well.

http://www.sportstwo.com/posts/4790127/
 
Ed O said:
Yep. Those 313 points (fewer, actually, since folks didn't shoot 100%) definitely made him worthless.
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If you think anything about the conversation has anything to with 313 points then I just don’t know what to tell ya?
 
I dont believe that team makes it to the conference finals without Sheed. Sabas was still really good, but he was a foul magnet at that point (at least vs shaq). Sabonis was also at least in my opinion not capable of playing really long minutes without drop off in his game. Pippen, Steve Smith, etc were all still pretty good but I dont think they get that far without any of them. They were a really complete team and I think losing one would have really put a chink in their armor.

I dont really have any strong feelings about Sheed. He was pretty good as a player, probably couldve been a lot better (but thats not super rare), He was an interesting personality and divided teams because people seemed to Love or Hate him. Its not really his fault that the vets on that team werent stabilizers, Pippen should have been. Wallace went to Detroit fit in and never really gave them a ton of trouble because they had leaderships.

The whole thing where he was mad at Sabonis. Id be mad too if I thought he had flopped into me multiple times and was actually injuring me. Did he handle it very well? I guess not, but why does Sabas get such a pass for flopping all the freaking time, when most of us complain about other guys who flop and throw there arms around.

Guess my point is, I think everyone on that team had their issues, but also on the court all had talent and they needed each other. The failures were partially on Rasheed but it was a group problem.
 
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STOMP said:
Yeah I read it. It directly contradicted your forever rant about Wallace being mad for no reason and that Sabas was just doing his job. Flailing one's gigantic arms wildly to try to draw a foul and repeatedly striking teammates in the face isn't textbook D, it's a dangerous play. Was it an ideal or even an appropriate response by Wallace? Again, of course not. Should Sabas have been repeatedly wildly flailing his arms in the first place trying to emphasize Shaq's ridiculous bull rushes to the hoop, especially after previously injuring a teammate? Nope, thats not ideal either. Were both of their behaviors completely equal in every way? No of course not. But both were behaviors that could have been modified.

Lol at the responses saying PDX would have won a title had it not been for Wallace's behavior. Those were the heavy handed David Stern days when the small market teams were always smacked down by his minion officials. The infamous 4th Quarter, Sabas picked up 3 fouls in 4 minutes fouling out for repeatedly throwing his neck into O'Neal's elbows. PIP was limping around and (of course) had dislocated 2 fingers on his shooting hand that caused him to miss game 6, so that left Wallace as the best PDX Blazer player. While D and team play on offense was always his calling card, he led Portland in scoring 5 of those 7 games including 30 in game 7. But the Lakers knew they could throw the Blazers around without consequence when it mattered and did so on both ends as thats how it was always officiated it for the big markets... hell, thats why Kobe & Shaq had forced their way into LA! I recall Smitty losing his shit over how he was being absolutely manhandled without calls. That was that Portland teams only real shot but the results were all Stern. The next season Sabas, Pip & Smith were another year further along on the wrong side of 30 and Bonzi then blew out his knee. In Portland's void, small market Sacramento famously got the same exact business from Stern's officials the next season. Called straight up, both the Blazers & Kings were superior teams to those Lakers. The Pistons got the straight up officiating vs that same lineup a couple years later and easily swept them.

STOMP
Click to expand...
Exactly correct.

Great fucking post.

Miss you man.

:cheers:
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I dont believe that team makes it to the conference finals without Sheed. Sabas was still really good, but he was a foul magnet at that point (at least vs shaq). Sabonis was also at least in my opinion not capable of playing really long minutes without drop off in his game. Pippen, Steve Smith, etc were all still pretty good but I dont think they get that far without any of them. They were a really complete team and I think losing one would have really put a chink in their armor.

I dont really have any strong feelings about Sheed. He was pretty good as a player, probably couldve been a lot better (but thats not super rare), He was an interesting personality and divided teams because people seemed to Love or Hate him. Its not really his fault that the vets on that team werent stabilizers, Pippen should have been. Wallace went to Detroit fit in and never really gave them a ton of trouble because they had leaderships.

The whole thing where he was mad at Sabonis. Id be mad too if I thought he had flopped into me multiple times and was actually injuring me. Did he handle it very well? I guess not, but why does Sabas get such a pass for flopping all the freaking time, when most of us complain about other guys who flop and throw there arms around.

Guess my point is, I think everyone on that team had their issues, but also on the court all had talent and they needed each other. The failures were partially on Rasheed but it was a group problem.
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Correct. That team doesn't make it there without Sheed, Pip, or Sabas.

Everybody flopped like that vs Shaq after his 1st or 2nd year. Everybody. It's the only chance you had against him. If you stood your ground while he came through you, you were called for the foul.

Sure Pip could have been a better leader. So could have Damon, and Smitty. But those players never did anything to hurt the team's chemistry like Sheed did.

We don't blame a player's bad actions on another player's lack of leadership.

Sheed was finally embarrassed by being dealt twice in one season. He thought he was untouchable. He learned he wasn't. So he was extremely motivated for the second half of that season.

He understood he wasn't the top dog in Detroit. We gave him too much control. Too much respect and responsibility and he couldn't handle it. Detroit didn't make that mistake.

He was just another player there like Steve Smith was here.

But none of that excuses the team destroying activities and childish behavior he displayed here. None of the other veteran players on that team were involved in any of that.

That's my problem with Sheed. His own actions. Not a lack of productivity, not a personality issue or anything personal like that.

His stats don't put him in the discussion as a Blazer Great. Neither do his behavior, or leadership qualities.

He's like the 3rd best #30 in Blazer history (IMO) and his jersey will never hang in the rafters. He doesn't have good memories or a good legacy here in Portland and that's his own fault.
 
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