Bogus! This new 3 Guard Lineup....

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Can a team win it all with a three guard line up?

  • Yes

  • No

  • Depends(Explain)

  • Yes, but not with our guard linup

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Orion Bailey

Orion Bailey

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Yes the game has evolved into a faster shooting style game, where guards have never been more important. So I get wanting 3 star guards(can Powell be a star?)

But does that mean they need to play together in the 1-3 spots?

After watching last nights game and seeing Powell and Dame stand next to each other, he is not any taller.

For years we have been saying that we may need a bigger SG to put next to Dame. Instead Terry puts another small guy next to them.

This isn't going to be sustainable.

This is a picture on the page referencing an article stating the best 25 SF in history.

Look at these players. Recognize them? Based on this picture, Id say the average height is 6'8. Not 6'3.

105612119_268835467539923_6317877751532692034_n.jpg

https://fadeawayworld.net/2020/06/24/ranking-the-top-25-greatest-small-forwards-of-all-time/
How many of those guys have won one, if not, multiple titles?



https://www.fantasybasketball101.com/nba-average-height/
"What is the average height in the NBA for small forwards?
Small forwards are pretty much the ultimate average NBA player. In the modern era, small forwards’ heights are typically 6-foot-7, with the tallest recorded in the 2014-15 season at 6’8″ flat. Unsurprisingly, small forwards started out at 6-foot-4 in the 60s and improved over the years."


Small forwards STARTED OUT as 6'4" and have gotten bigger over the years, yet we want to go with a guy who is shorter than when the position started out as??????

As a fan who knows it takes time to build comfort-ability and cohesiveness, what is the point of waste time trying to make this work only to have to change it all up when the playoffs come, so then people are out of their comfort zone when needed to perform at their best?

I think this is by far the worst coaching mistake we have seen thus far with Stotts and to me its unforgivable. This is simply wasting extremely valuable time.
I saw someone mention putting Little next to Dame, but then still have Powell at the 3?

I simply don't see a rotation where we can trot out a 6'3" sf and win in the playoffs.

I am extremely frustrated with this decision and think it is going to be the downfall of this team and will push the rebuild over the edge. Dame is obviously getting frustrated, but is also in a comfort zone few players get to in the NBA, so i'm sure he is very concerned about change being for the worse.

I know this post comes after a win, but I see way too many flaws in having a three guard line up with the tallest guy being 6'4.


What do you think about this three guard lineup? Is it sustainable?
 
The fact is if Michael Jordan were starting next to Dame and CJ... it wouldn't be considered a three guard lineup because MJ was big enough to be considered an actual small forward. So in order to have what is considered a three guard lineup it needs to be guys that are as small as what we have and that doesn't work. Some have referenced the Bad Boy Pistons with Thomas, Dumars and Johnson but Johnson never started for them... they had actual forwards starting. Johnson was never even their sixth leading minutes getter, he was just their third guard in a three guard rotation.

No, you cannot be a contender with three guys playing starters minutes with this little of size and haven't been able to for over four decades.
 
No. You can't win a title with a small 3 guard line-up. And especially not in a small market.
 
Yes of course a team can win it all with a 3 guard lineup. It's not like you do it all game long. It's all comes down to matchups.

Whether you start with 3 guards or you finish with 3 guards will depend on the opposition and the game situation. There are 96 minutes combined for both guard positions. So you really only need to play Norman at the small forward position for about 4 1/2 minutes per half if you go with the 3 guard rotation. (and it would still get them all 35 minutes per game)

Keep in mind that NP weighs more than both Jones and Covington. So even if they are a few inches longer, it will only be a factor against certain SFs. I would gladly give up a few inches in the wingspan department to get an extra shooter and ball-handler in the lineup. Again depending on the matchups.

Having said all that my preference for next year would be to bring them all back and start Dame, NP, and Little, while using CJ off the bench as our 6th man. Nassir should be ready by then to start and CJ will get his 30+ minutes regardless. But even then does it really make a difference who starts and who comes off the bench if they are all getting their minutes?
 
On this occasion I can write this again: This guy is typical Play Station NBA player. I remember playing NBA Live with my friends, when I used 3 guards lineup a lot. The idea behind was simple. Have my best 3point shooters in S5 and fire 3s all night long.

Of course, it would backfire on the other end, but I didn't use any defensive schemes anyways. I was just trying to still the ball on one on one defense and that's it.

What else... If I had this 3guard 3point shooters lineup in use, I did never care about what team I play with. I never checked other team rotation. I trusted in my brilliant, novel idea of using as much 3point shooters without basically doing nothing else.

Main thing is, it was very shallow and lazy thinking. To use this "tactic" I didn't even have to know all the buttons.

And funniest part here. It worked well, when I played weak ass friends and it seemed to work with guys on my level of recognition of the buttons on the pad. Of course better players, that used buttons combinations (like alley oops, pivots and tricks) kicked my ass badly.

It was 20 years ago.

So, there's that. Answer is, it's not gonna win even second round without 60% 3point shooting games on the way. Thank you and goodnight.
 
Blazers need to bring Powell off the bench.
 
But Stotts is a head coach in the NBA, so he is smarter than anyone who would disagree with him or even dare question what he does.

~Ter-Bear Apologist
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Yes of course a team can win it all with a 3 guard lineup. It's not like you do it all game long. It's all comes down to matchups.

Whether you start with 3 guards or you finish with 3 guards will depend on the opposition and the game situation. There are 96 minutes combined for both guard positions. So you really only need to play Norman at the small forward position for about 4 1/2 minutes per half if you go with the 3 guard rotation. (and it would still get them all 35 minutes per game)

Keep in mind that NP weighs more than both Jones and Covington. So even if they are a few inches longer, it will only be a factor against certain SFs. I would gladly give up a few inches in the wingspan department to get an extra shooter and ball-handler in the lineup. Again depending on the matchups.

Having said all that my preference for next year would be to bring them all back and start Dame, NP, and Little, while using CJ off the bench as our 6th man. Nassir should be ready by then to start and CJ will get his 30+ minutes regardless. But even then does it really make a difference who starts and who comes off the bench if they are all getting their minutes?
Click to expand...
Yep. Time and a place. But not every game every time.
I think Stotts is tinkering around with it and plugging Little into spots. I think (Maybe i should say HOPE) the coaches are taking notes and watching tons of film dissecting what is working and what isn't.
They also need Nurk back 100% and healthy. That would help a bunch. This minutes restriction thing is getting in the way of him not only getting into better shape but learning to play as a team again.
 
Offseason priorities:
Sign Powell, then have him come off the bench next year (ditching the 3-guard lineup AS STARTERS)
Fire Stotts
Don't re-sign Melo

I really like what Neil has been doing lately, but he still could easily go 0-3 on these...
 
Wizard Mentor said:
Offseason priorities:
Sign Powell, then have him come off the bench next year (ditching the 3-guard lineup AS STARTERS)
Fire Stotts
Don't re-sign Melo

I really like what Neil has been doing lately, but he still could easily go 0-3 on these...
Click to expand...

What's the most amount of money you'd be willing to give to Powell as our backup?
 
Tince said:
What's the most amount of money you'd be willing to give to Powell as our backup?
Click to expand...
I'll take it a step further. It all depends on how this season works out.
If this team gels and starts playing at the level i feel they should be able to. That means stays in the playoffs without having to go through the play-in and then performs respectably in the playoffs. You will see much of the same unless the team is sold and then you might see huge changes? Not sure Powell is part of that scenario?
The other option is this team never really gets it going and they barely make the playoffs or even miss them. If that happens you again will see huge changes. In my mind (Remember I'm just an idiot that posts on a message board) i think CJ's days here are over. Powell stays and CJ is traded giving the Blazers more flexibility and a possible upgrade at the 3 while being able to afford Powell.
In both of the major changes scenario Terry Stotts will retire or be fired or both? The next 20 games will tell the story pretty much. Hopefully it will be more like 40 games? I get the feeling the team knows this.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
Offseason priorities:
Sign Powell, then have him come off the bench next year (ditching the 3-guard lineup AS STARTERS)
Click to expand...

My offseason priority would be to re-sign Powell as the starting two and trade McCollum for a good small forward, one that has an interesting mix of offensive contribution and defensive versatility. Not necessarily a star, as I don't think McCollum will bring back a star wing, but a good two-way wing.

Also to see if there are any takers in trade for Nurkic and work on getting a more switchable center who can at least be a lob threat. If he can shoot, too, that would be great but that's starting to push the limits of what's realistic.

It's time to start trying to make this roster actually fit the times, rather than having ill-fitting pieces that seem good in a vacuum.
 
kjironman1 said:
Go with Powell and DJJ in the second unit? Could work well?
Click to expand...

As long as Powell plays the most minutes of anyone besides Lillard. I think he's Portland's second-best overall player. Beyond that, mix and match away.
 
Keeping track tonight. 3 guard lineup up 24-15 when Powell went out in the 1st. Butler only took one shot.

Down 23-17 in the 3rd when CJ went out
 
Last edited:
Pinwheel1 said:
Yes of course a team can win it all with a 3 guard lineup. It's not like you do it all game long. It's all comes down to matchups.

Whether you start with 3 guards or you finish with 3 guards will depend on the opposition and the game situation. There are 96 minutes combined for both guard positions. So you really only need to play Norman at the small forward position for about 4 1/2 minutes per half if you go with the 3 guard rotation. (and it would still get them all 35 minutes per game)

Keep in mind that NP weighs more than both Jones and Covington. So even if they are a few inches longer, it will only be a factor against certain SFs. I would gladly give up a few inches in the wingspan department to get an extra shooter and ball-handler in the lineup. Again depending on the matchups.

Having said all that my preference for next year would be to bring them all back and start Dame, NP, and Little, while using CJ off the bench as our 6th man. Nassir should be ready by then to start and CJ will get his 30+ minutes regardless. But even then does it really make a difference who starts and who comes off the bench if they are all getting their minutes?
Click to expand...

I apologize if I wasnt clear, I meant starting. Not during the game in spots.

I kinda assumed that was a given considering our starting lineups as of late?

Anyhow, regarding matchups, Do you think Powell is better at the three than Little for most matchups? Against KD, LBJ? and many other larger small forwards? These guys all start, so the matchup would be against them. The start of games are the most important. Who can get the first punch. I don't see this team able to do that starting 3 guards every game.

What's Powell gonna do against Middleton when they both start?



Don't see it working having all three start.
 
Orion Bailey said:
I apologize if I wasnt clear, I meant starting. Not during the game in spots.

I kinda assumed that was a given considering our starting lineups as of late?

Anyhow, regarding matchups, Do you think Powell is better at the three than Little for most matchups? Against KD, LBJ? and many other larger small forwards? These guys all start, so the matchup would be against them. The start of games are the most important. Who can get the first punch. I don't see this team able to do that starting 3 guards every game.

What's Powell gonna do against Middleton when they both start?



Don't see it working having all three start.
Click to expand...

Take the matchup against who would currently be our 1st round opponent.

Paul George vs CJ McCollum
Kawhi Leonard vs Norman Powell

To be fair, they have more talent for a large part because both those players play well on both sides of the ball and our 2 best players do not. Little would at least stand a bit more of a chance even thought he would be very inexperienced.
 
TBpup said:
Take the matchup against who would currently be our 1st round opponent.

Paul George vs CJ McCollum
Kawhi Leonard vs Norman Powell

To be fair, they have more talent for a large part because both those players play well on both sides of the ball and our 2 best players do not. Little would at least stand a bit more of a chance even thought he would be very inexperienced.
Click to expand...

I see CJ and Powell getting worked.
 
Orion Bailey said:
I apologize if I wasnt clear, I meant starting. Not during the game in spots.

I kinda assumed that was a given considering our starting lineups as of late?

Anyhow, regarding matchups, Do you think Powell is better at the three than Little for most matchups? Against KD, LBJ? and many other larger small forwards? These guys all start, so the matchup would be against them. The start of games are the most important. Who can get the first punch. I don't see this team able to do that starting 3 guards every game.

What's Powell gonna do against Middleton when they both start?
Don't see it working having all three start.
Click to expand...

I don't think it matters much who starts or not when more than likely the minutes will be the same. Who got the first punch last night and did it matter?
Butler was 0-1 last night during the 3 guard lineup to start the game. He ended up with 20. The Blazers were up 24-15 when Powell went to the bench. Who guarded Butler better last night......Powell, Little, or Jones? Are the refs going to give any respect to Little when guarding LBJ or Durant? or would the superstars go right at him resulting in the young player getting into foul trouble.

Long term yes I would prefer Little to keep improving and be the starter next year at SF. However, right now I wonder if the slightly smaller Powell (5 lbs) who is also a good defender, is better starting with Dame and CJ when teams trap Dame. They caught the Blazers by surprise last night by starting out the game with it, but that particular lineup did adjust after being down 3-0 by scoring the next 11 straight.

Against the Clippers I thought Powell matched up well against Kawhi in the last game(probably because of familiarity being they were teammates)
Paul George is an issue though for Dame or CJ so yes I would change up the lineup if we face them. Against LBJ, AD, and Drummond......does it really matter who we start? As for the rest of the west, I think the 3 guard lineup to start is just as good as any other starting lineup we can try.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I don't think it matters much who starts or not when more than likely the minutes will be the same. Who got the first punch last night and did it matter?
Butler was 0-1 last night during the 3 guard lineup to start the game. He ended up with 20. The Blazers were up 24-15 when Powell went to the bench. Who guarded Butler better last night......Powell, Little, or Jones? Are the refs going to give any respect to Little when guarding LBJ or Durant? or would the superstars go right at him resulting in the young player getting into foul trouble.

Long term yes I would prefer Little to keep improving and be the starter next year at SF. However, right now I wonder if the slightly smaller Powell (5 lbs) who is also a good defender, is better starting with Dame and CJ when teams trap Dame. They caught the Blazers by surprise last night by starting out the game with it, but that particular lineup did adjust after being down 3-0 by scoring the next 11 straight.

Against the Clippers I thought Powell matched up well against Kawhi in the last game(probably because of familiarity being they were teammates)
Paul George is an issue though for Dame or CJ so yes I would change up the lineup if we face them. Against LBJ, AD, and Drummond......does it really matter who we start? As for the rest of the west, I think the 3 guard lineup to start is just as good as any other starting lineup we can try.
Click to expand...

sorry but if you are talking aBout matchups doesn't it start with the starters? Minutes can be the same without them all on the court at once starting the game.
So are you saying we shouldnt have s stable five man starting rotation?

that the starting lineup should change based on the opponent?

i disagree vehemently for three significant reasons.
First, thats adapting to other teams when we should be forcing them to adapt to us.
Two, it will be much harder to maintain cohesion if players are comfortable and know thier roles.
Three, when have you seen a team go deep in the playoff where they switch around the starting lineup based on the opponent?

im sorry I'm just not following your logic.
I guess i just dont think switching the starters up on a regular basis provides any cohesion Nd will get us anywhere in the playoffs.
 
Orion Bailey said:
sorry but if you are talking aBout matchups doesn't it start with the starters? Minutes can be the same without them all on the court at once starting the game.
So are you saying we shouldnt have s stable five man starting rotation?

that the starting lineup should change based on the opponent?

i disagree vehemently for three significant reasons.
First, thats adapting to other teams when we should be forcing them to adapt to us.
Two, it will be much harder to maintain cohesion if players are comfortable and know thier roles.
Three, when have you seen a team go deep in the playoff where they switch around the starting lineup based on the opponent?

im sorry I'm just not following your logic.
I guess i just dont think switching the starters up on a regular basis provides any cohesion Nd will get us anywhere in the playoffs.
Click to expand...

I am only talking about making adjustments against elite players in the playoffs. (Lakers and Clippers) And yes elite coaches have made changes to their lineups over the years in the playoffs when needed. Do you really think that we can force LBJ or Kawhi to adjust to us?

Only a few teams have SF's that Norman Powell can not guard as well as our other small forwards can. Why start a bigger player in all the other games if it is not needed. I am pretty sure that we could flip Jones back into the starting lineup without causing a lack of cohesiveness. He plays with the starters later in the quarter anyways.

If you don't want to make an adjustment for the Clippers that is fine. But our 3 guards are our best offensive players. Dame from deep, CJ from mid-range, and Norman attacking the basket. They need to be on the floor as much as possible.
 
Dame - Norm - Nas - RoCo - Nurk

That line up still has a ton of firepower at the guard spot, elite 3pt shooting and can FUCKING PLAY DEFENSE
 
BigGameDamian said:
CJ off the bench would be more ideal but this isn't NBA2K. We can't forget that it's a players league.
Click to expand...
It is a players league there is no denying that but this team... it's coach and GM... could forget that for one fucking second and show some backbone. If these players aren't on board for the changes that it's going to take to win, then this should be the most active off season in team history. I don't want to be opaque, I mean if anyone including Dame gives ultimatums that keep this team from improving, they're not who we want and need to be moved immediately.
 
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