Might make you feel better about signing Gary Payton II

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Eli Vance

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I'm digging that defense. It's like the Blazers are building to replace Dame as much as they are trying to build around him.

It seems like this is a year away:

Ant/GP2
Sharpe/Hart
Little
Grant
Winslow
Jabari
Nurk
 
Mediocre Man said:
Me. First thing I said to myself
Click to expand...

One of the first clips is him ripping the ball away from someone and I'm thinking, "that's gonna be a foul."

Also.... so many lobs in that video. Dame is shit at throwing lobs.
 
Natebishop3 said:
One of the first clips is him ripping the ball away from someone and I'm thinking, "that's gonna be a foul."

Also.... so many lobs in that video. Dame is shit at throwing lobs.
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Watford and Winslow will probably be throwing the majority of lob passes honestly.
 
theprunetang said:
Watford and Winslow will probably be throwing the majority of lob passes honestly.
Click to expand...

I hope someone does. The guy is insanely athletic. I hope we take advantage of him and Sharpe.

Aside from defense, for some reason Dame has never been good at lobs and it's one of the few holes in his game.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I hope someone does. The guy is insanely athletic. I hope we take advantage of him and Sharpe.

Aside from defense, for some reason Dame has never been good at lobs and it's one of the few holes in his game.
Click to expand...

And moving w/o the ball. Something Steph is elite at.

Prime Shane Battier would be a fantasy for this team
 
inconceivable said:
And moving w/o the ball. Something Steph is elite at.

Prime Shane Battier would be a fantasy for this team
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That’s where Dame and Steph are like night and day. Steph is more like Ray Allen or Reggie Miller in that regard.
 
Natebishop3 said:
That’s where Dame and Steph are like night and day. Steph is more like Ray Allen or Reggie Miller in that regard.
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moving without the ball sure is easier when you have passers like Draymond, Iggy, Livingston, and Durant. Dame hasn't played with anybody close to that except for maybe Batum or Steve Blake. And players like Monta Ellis, Nate Robinson, and Jarret Jack were better at passing then Batum too. Jack averaged 6 assists/game one year with Curry

Olshey gave Stotts an iso-heavy roster and Stotts sure seemed to favor an iso-heavy offense. Dame isn't as good as Curry at moving without the ball, but I think a lot of that can be attributed to roster, coaching, and scheme. Nobody has ever said Dame isn't coachable
 
Natebishop3 said:
I hope someone does. The guy is insanely athletic. I hope we take advantage of him and Sharpe.

Aside from defense, for some reason Dame has never been good at lobs and it's one of the few holes in his game.
Click to expand...
Simons hopefully is better.
 
wizenheimer said:
moving without the ball sure is easier when you have passers like Draymond, Iggy, Livingston, and Durant. Dame hasn't played with anybody close to that except for maybe Batum or Steve Blake. And players like Monta Ellis, Nate Robinson, and Jarret Jack were better at passing then Batum too. Jack averaged 6 assists/game one year with Curry

Olshey gave Stotts an iso-heavy roster and Stotts sure seemed to favor an iso-heavy offense. Dame isn't as good as Curry at moving without the ball, but I think a lot of that can be attributed to roster, coaching, and scheme. Nobody has ever said Dame isn't coachable
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Would be great to see Dame throw the ball to Winslow ( or anyone else), get open, get the ball back with an advantage then shoot or go to the hoop.
 
HansenYang said:
GSW were limited in what they could offer GPII. They couldn't offer more than $6.5M.
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Natebishop3 said:
Yeah I don’t know why are ignoring that.
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PtldPlatypus said:
Same reason many ignored that when we "weren't willing to pay what it took to re-sign Seth Curry".

Ignorance.
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GS actually had his early bird rights. So they could've offered him up to about $11 million.

They chose not to offer a similar contract because it would've cost them an additional $60 million this year (plus who knows how much in years 2 and 3). They would've brought him back on a 1-year deal for about the Tax-MLE but were unwilling to go higher.
 
hoopsjock said:
GS actually had his early bird rights. So they could've offered him up to about $11 million.

They chose not to offer a similar contract because it would've cost them an additional $60 million this year (plus who knows how much in years 2 and 3). They would've brought him back on a 1-year deal for about the Tax-MLE but were unwilling to go higher.
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I stand corrected
 
hoopsjock said:
GS actually had his early bird rights. So they could've offered him up to about $11 million.

They chose not to offer a similar contract because it would've cost them an additional $60 million this year (plus who knows how much in years 2 and 3). They would've brought him back on a 1-year deal for about the Tax-MLE but were unwilling to go higher.
Click to expand...
I believe you are incorrect here.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q20
Under the Arenas provision other teams can offer restricted free agents salaries starting up to the Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception. If a team with the right of first refusal does not have Early Bird rights to the player and is over the Apron, it will have only the smaller Taxpayer Mid-Level exception at its disposal, and cannot match an offer for the full Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level exception.
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In investigating this further - I dont think GSW even had early bird rights.
 
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Natebishop3 said:
Funny.... I had just started watching this video.

Does anyone else watch his defense and think, "you're not getting away with that on the Blazers."
Click to expand...

I am willing to let him try. It's not like we can avoid signing good defenders because they might not be as successful as they were with other teams.
At some point, the refs will give us more respect. Plus I saw enough good D from Winslow and Hart in those few games that make me think GP2 can as well.
 
Last edited:
Eli Vance said:


I'm digging that defense. It's like the Blazers are building to replace Dame as much as they are trying to build around him.

It seems like this is a year away:

Ant/GP2
Sharpe/Hart
Little
Grant
Winslow
Jabari
Nurk
Click to expand...

Lillard and Brown for Durant and you can have that team today!
 
HansenYang said:
I believe you are incorrect here.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q20


In investigating this further - I dont think GSW even had early bird rights.
Click to expand...
1) Gary Payton II wasn't a restricted free agent, wasn't a 2nd round pick, and wasn't coming off year two in the NBA. Therefore the Gilbert Arenas rule doesn't apply.

2) He did have early bird rights because even though GS cut him the year before, no one else signed him so it reverts to basically GS had him for two consecutive years. Therefore, early bird rights.
 
TSN: What kind of advice did you give your son Gary Payton II about defense? That seems to be his calling card on the Warriors.

Payton: What happened was that being around me so much when he was young and seeing a lot of things that I was doing, he just got a knack for it. Especially when he went to Oregon State and followed behind me. I had so many records on defense [at OSU] and he came in a short period of time in two years and broke many of them.

nba-plain--cc6277d5-4d7d-427b-a8c0-56cddb0e1e16_0.jpeg

I'm happy for that because right now I'm getting a lot of feedback from a lot of players that tell me, “Your son, I hate when he gets in the game. I hate it, I hate it, I hate it.” And I say, “Yeah, I bet you do hate it.” They’re like, “We just try to get him out of the game and get him away from things.” And that's what they did against me. They did me the same way.


TSN: What makes him so good on that end?

Payton: I think that he has a mindset. I always tell people when they ask me how to play defense, you have to have a mindset. You have to worry about just trying to stop people.

I think he's gotten really good at being patient and timing. I always tell him, give the guys about two or three times down the floor to see what they're going to do because they're going to do the same thing. And once he times that, they get relaxed. Then all of a sudden, he has the steal.

TSN: There was a viral clip of your son earlier this season. I wonder if you saw it. During a break, he knocked over a fan’s drink. He was super polite, went to the usher, asked for a new drink and got it to the fan.

Payton: Yeah, he’s like that. What makes me so proud of him and proud of my kids is that every time I go to anyone, the first thing they say is they don’t care about his basketball. They care about how polite he is and how much of a gentleman he is and how sweet he is. I’ve been getting that his whole life, and I’m proud of that.

He does that. You saw it when they were playing somewhere else, he stepped on somebody’s brand new Jordans, and he went over there and brushed them off. He’s just that type of kid.

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nba...player-of-year-award/h9ues7oxlh0pblpzqafc5xzt
 
bobf said:
Go take a look at his EPM rating (estimated plus minus) if you want to get happy or if you want to not believe in advanced stats. It is considered to be the best advanced stat by many and if I recall correctly by predictive power.
https://dunksandthrees.com/epm
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Justise Winslow ranks pretty favorably there as well on the defensive end. I like that site because most the names match the eye test.
 
Scalma said:
Justise Winslow ranks pretty favorably there as well on the defensive end. I like that site because most the names match the eye test.
Click to expand...

Yeah looks like we finally have some defenders. Let’s hope it translates over to the Blazers.

Here is some info on EPM. Looks like it is primarily an adjusted +/- stat but also uses box scores and player tracking data to help it along.

“We asked Steve Ilardi, co-creator of ESPN’s Real Plus-Minus who has worked as a consultant for NBA teams including the Phoenix Suns, what he thought about the metric.

“[EPM] does a superb job of reducing the high noise level inherent in basic RAPM modeling estimates by integrating Bayesian priors derived not just from box score stats (a la BPM) but also from player tracking metrics,” said Ilardi, during his recent conversation with HoopsHype. “[EPM] has gone one step beyond the RPM estimates that Jerry Engelmann and I developed for ESPN, as we began that project without access to player tracking metrics.”

“I regard EPM as the obvious gold standard of all-in-one metrics,” added Ilardi.”

https://hoopshype.com/lists/advanced-stats-nba-real-plus-minus-rapm-win-shares-analytics/
 
bobf said:
Go take a look at his EPM rating (estimated plus minus) if you want to get happy or if you want to not believe in advanced stats. It is considered to be the best advanced stat by many and if I recall correctly by predictive power.
https://dunksandthrees.com/epm
Click to expand...

hard to gauge a stat that is behind a paywall...unless you pay...which I won't
 
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