Baffled and Confounded by the "Hickson Situation"

I definitely can see MM's point regarding Hickson. In some ways I've had the same concerns. It would be different if Hickson was like Brain Grant; that played great post defense to go alone with that amazing rebounding. My only knock on Hickson is his defense. I know that he is a far inferior defender. Even less of a defender than Aldridge. Doesn't mean that he can't defend though.

i've seen a few times when he went one on one with a player that pissed him off and played some great defense in spurts. If he just developed a better defensive skill; he would be a max type player at PF. I think if there is anything he should work on this off-season; it's gotta be the D.

So my final word is I wouldn't mind having Hickson or trading him. Even if he walks, I would understand why. Regardless, he has the skills to be a elite type player if he just focused and had the drive to be one. I think him and Aldridge need to improve that area of their game this off-season, IMO.

 

This is a great thread

This is the most telling statement in here, a 20 per guy that gets his lunch eaten on D as a center..HEY GUESS WHAT! the guy is a four, or a small five, for lack of a true, developed NBA center, he plays the five for us

 

That statement isn't just irrational, it's borderline insane.

 

The guy got his lunch handed to him at the 4 well throughout his career

15.2 for and 17.4 against as a 4 in Cleveland in 09-10

14.5 for and 17.6 against as a 4 in Cleveland in 10-11

JJ is an average player on a good team who gives up way more than he brings.

JJ is a good player on a bad team who gives up a little less than he brings

 

It's numbers, Wook. You statement is far more irrational than his

 

I use to give the (slight) nod to LMA on defense, but now I'm not so sure. Both are abysmally poor at team/help defense, so we'll just call that a wash. As far as man-defense I use to think LMA was adequate, and thus I thought he was a better defender than Hickson. But recently I've been watching them on the defensive end and there are two things that have at least equalized them, if not pushed Hickson slightly ahead:
1 - Hickson is TRYING. When he's guarding a guy with the ball he is engaged and working hard to stop the ball. LMA doesn't seem to put forth much energy on defense. He occasionally makes a nice poke at the ball, tipping it out for a steal, but he's not digging down and putting forth a gritty defensive effort.
2 - Hickson is guarding guys he's physically incapable of guarding while LMA is generally given the easiest defensive assignment on the floor. Makes the comparison that much more tough - this isn't apples to apples.
Since both are doing a poor job, but one of them has a very tough job and the other has a relatively easy job, I'm apt to give the nod to the guy trying hard in a tough match-up.

 

I don't know who is better or who is worse but I do know they both need to improve.

LMA needs to step it up for sure since he is practically guaranteed to be here next year.

 

He looks like a heck of a player to me. I really think the metrics would support that if he was put in the right situation. I was shocked an elite defensive contender like Chicago or Indiana didn't want to bring him in for 20 mpg alongside an anchor like Noah or Hibbert.

I don't disagree with your premise that keeping him next year depends a lot on price. I throw my entire OP out the window if he starts talking about $10M. But at a slightly higher cost than a mid-first rounder? I think that's a good investment.

 

That's all fine and dandy; but Hickson was having the same troubles with other PFs out there. Look at MM's advanced stats against other PFs. I remembered his lunch being handed to him when he tried defending Griffin and Lee. Just because he plays center on Portland doesn't mean he doesn't have stats that support his ineffective defense on other PFs.

Now on the flip-side; Aldridge is actually a much better defender at Center. If that guy would just stop being so prissy and say "Fuck it man I'm a center!" and we can really use him the right way.

Aldridge is doing everything a center does on the court but play defense against the centers in the league. His advanced stats actually show him playing much better D against other centers he's up against.

 

You use stats to show a double double player is not very good . . . while also saying other stats are misleading.

I agree with half of what you say . . . stats are misleading.

 

I'm baffled, confounded and behooved by this whole rigismort.

 

If only we had "The Stash" to bail us out of this mess!

Just kidding buddy!

 

First let me make clear that I'm not arguing that Hickson is a good defender. There, done.
Now, Griffin and Lee hand many defenders' asses to them - this isn't something unique to Hickson. LMA would get his ass handed to him if he were defending them. As for PER - well, you're barking up the wrong tree with that stat. But let's not forget that players generally get better over their first handful of seasons. It shouldn't be out of the question that Hickson has improved as a defender. Just because he was bad against PFs during his first two (?) years with CLE, and his year with probably the worst run franchise in the league, doesn't mean he's not getting better...and that he can't continue to get better. Hickson is 24 (23?). He's young. He should continue to get better. LMA? Not really developing - maybe refining, but most of his development window has come and gone.

 

Aldridge actually plays griffin well. He's really good at defending Duncan too

 

reminds me of Zbo

 

There's only two questions you need to ask, if the answer to both comes back "no" then you'll have your answer about what to do with him.

Is JJ the longterm answer at either starting center or starting power forward? Nope

Is JJ likely to accept less cash to be a backup player in a year where there's a lot of free agency money to be spent? Probably not.

So put aside stats and whether or not you like him or that his teammates like him; the economics, his natural position and lack of defensive ability/awareness make it nearly impossible that he'll be here next season. Maybe he completely strikes out in free agency and has to come back to Neil hat in hand, and takes a 3 year 4 million dollar deal to be a backup 4/5 but the odds of that happening are slim to none when they already have money committed to Freeland and Claver appears to have some promise as a backup 4.

 

Z-Bo has a low post game that 90% of NBA bigs only dream about.

 

Regardless who is our starting center, we need an over haul on defense. Boston is a perfect example of how we should be. They are old with a 17 year veteran PF as their center, yet they play aggressive team D away from the basket and get great weak side help. Lillard mentioned how physical Boston was on D, minimizing the need for someone back there blocking shots. (Paraphrasing from his In house media day interview)

Coaching is key. I went to the SA-Clipper game this week and was continually shaking my head at how well SA played with their second unit. (Let alone their 1st unit) The players on the floor were not that good, but they bought into the system. On any other team those guys would suck defensively.

I like Stotts a lot, but by next year he needs a new game plan. This starting team should be better on D. Can JJ buy into it? I don't know but I think the rest can. But yeah an upgrade is needed at center on the defensive end, AND we need a new commitment, AND a new game plan as well.

 

Sure we all would like to have Hickson come off our bench. But not at the cost of pricing us out of the ability to upgrade our starting center position, which is priority one. More and more, teams are going to lose valuable players due to economics and the cap. Under the current CBA we are not immune to it. That's the way it is. Losing Hickson, if it results in signing or trading for a better starting center, is a form of one step back to take two steps forward. Same with if we could get a top 10 lotto pick this year (which is seeming less and less likely).

 

If you think Hickson's going to ease off after his contract year, then you should also think that decreasing the rebounding will give him more energy for non-stat pursuits like defense.

He may become a decent defender once he stops building his stats for the contract.