Yeah, clutch players make things happen. Horry didn't, he just had the ball at the right place and the right time.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tmgbball15 @ Dec 13 2006, 10:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I go with Reggie, altough Jordan is a close second. Its just ive never seen someone make so many shots in such clutch situations</div>Then you obviously haven't watched Jordan play. He has hit many more clutch shots than Reggie Miller.I guess you missed all the games where Reggie was playing poor defense late in games and his man scored clutch baskets.1. Miller is not more clutch. How many defensive clutch plays has Miller made? Jordan made a lot of clutch defensive stops on the games biggest stage. Remember Jordan in the 1998 NBA Finals? Karl Malone one of the greatest power forwards of all time was stripped by Jordan with 20 seconds left on the clock, Jordan then hits the game winning shot over Bryon Russell a premier defender to win a CHAMPIONSHIP. I don't remember Reggie making a clutch defensive play like that... ever. I don't remember Reggie hitting a game winner to win a championship either.Jordan has hit game winning shots to win CHAMPIONSHIPS, Reggie NEVER did that. Jordan has made clutch defensive plays to win titles, Reggie NEVER did that. Jordan has made clutch passes to win titles, Reggie NEVER did that.Oh yeah, Jordan has hit over 26 game winning shots, If you add in clutch shots overall then the number would be in the hundreds.It's not close.Repeat of what I said in the last thread.
KOBE BRYANT is one of the best clutch performers ever. This shot against Portland was just f*cking AMAZING. Incredible. :worthy:
I'd say Robert Horry or Kobe Bryant. Those shots against the Blazers like 2 or 3 years ago immediately come to mind with Kobe. That was one of the most clutch performances I've ever seen.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BottomOfDaMapTX @ Dec 14 2006, 10:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'd say Robert Horry or Kobe Bryant. Those shots against the Blazers like 2 or 3 years ago immediately come to mind with Kobe. That was one of the most clutch performances I've ever seen.</div>Please redirect to Post #22, courtesy of Ballaholic.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Dec 13 2006, 06:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, clutch players make things happen. Horry didn't, he just had the ball at the right place and the right time.</div>I guess you're forgetting his 26 point 4th quarter and OT in Game 5 of the Finals in 2005, in a series that went the distance. He's also hit countless daggers to close the deal on playoff games. Being clutch isn't all about the game winners.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Dec 13 2006, 04:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Robert Horry? I you guys f*cking crazy? He's made like 4 amazing shots in his whole f*cking career. C'mon!The Greatest Clutch player ever was Jerry West nobody else is even close. Not even MJ.</div>Except that he lost eight of the nine times he went to the finals And his one championship was by a landslide against an overmatched team, not very clutchAnd he's 5-6 in game sevensdoesn't mean he's not clutch but I think he falls in the reggie miller category of guys who were great clutch players but didn't win enough
Michael Jordan. Tony made a great post in the "Who would you want on the Line"thread.But he made clutch plays both on ends of the floor.
Bill Russell -Only player in history with 11 championships, dont give me any jordan crap. The whole argument for jordan being clutched is based on his 6 titles, well, add 5 more and you have Bill RussellJerry West - Mr. Clutch, nickname says enoughJordan - He hit some big shots, I'll put him at third, people overrate his "clutch factor" thoMagic Johnson - Tons of buzzer beaters for him and usually when it wasnt him hitting the winning shot he was dishing the assist to the open guy for the buzzer beaterhonorable mentions:Robert Horry, John Paxson (the first 3 bulls titles he hit just about every big shot there was to take in those championship runs, not jordan like some people pretend ) Kobe Bryant, Bob Cousy, and Isiah Thomas (25 pts in the 3rd quarter of the Finals, nobody else has done that)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Dec 13 2006, 06:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Robert Horry? I you guys f*cking crazy? He's made like 4 amazing shots in his whole f*cking career. C'mon!The Greatest Clutch player ever was Jerry West nobody else is even close. Not even MJ.</div>Okay, is it very clutch to make it to 9 NBA Finals, but only win 1 NBA Championship? I think that is being overlooked on the Jerry West arguement. For me it has to be MJ. 6 rings in 6 tries, tons of game winners, and overall great play in pressure situations. I think you shouldnt just include last second shots, but should inlude 4th quarter and overall game play as well. In my opinion, thats clutch when a player comes through not just in the last seconds, but in the entire game a la game 7's and elimination games.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MrLegend85 @ Dec 27 2006, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Bill Russell -Only player in history with 11 championships, dont give me any jordan crap. The whole argument for jordan being clutched is based on his 6 titles, well, add 5 more and you have Bill RussellJerry West - Mr. Clutch, nickname says enoughJordan - He hit some big shots, I'll put him at third, people overrate his "clutch factor" thoMagic Johnson - Tons of buzzer beaters for him and usually when it wasnt him hitting the winning shot he was dishing the assist to the open guy for the buzzer beaterhonorable mentions:Robert Horry, John Paxson (the first 3 bulls titles he hit just about every big shot there was to take in those championship runs, not jordan like some people pretend ) Kobe Bryant, Bob Cousy, and Isiah Thomas (25 pts in the 3rd quarter of the Finals, nobody else has done that)</div>Good post. Mj still hit his fair share. You cant discount all of them
You probably can't even give a legit reason why he's overrated. $10 bucks says you've probably never even watched him play a full game in his prime.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (russell11 @ Feb 8 2007, 03:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yes I have $10 please. He never beat Bird or Magic in his prime when it mattered</div>Hmmm I believe Bird said MJ was God in disguise and I believe Magic Johnson once said there is Michael Jordan and then there is the rest of us. Michael Jordan is the greatest player of all time. He is a 5 time MVP, 10 time all NBA first team selection, a 9 time NBA all defensive team selection, 7 straight scoring titles, and 6 champioships in 6 visits to the finals. He was not only the best scorer of his time but also arguably the best perimeter defender of his time. He was clutch as they come and always showed up in the 4th quarter and has countless game winners. He won a championship every time he made it to the finals and what is even more incredible is he did it every time w/o a dominant big man by his side.
Michael Jordan is first. Yes, Bill Russell won 11 rings, but it wasn't because of his offense. He was rarely the leading scorer on his team and I don't recall reading or seeing many highlights of him hitting clutch baskets. I think Reggie Miller is overrated as a clutch player. Yes, he hit some particularly against the Knicks as well as that push off of MJ, but guys like Larry Bird and Magic Johnson were both more clutch because they won so many big games. Miller won some big games, but he never won a ring and when you consider that I don't see how you can rank him ahead of guys like that. For current, my top 3 would be like this:1. Kobe Bryant - I think he's in the top five all time too. So many big shots without Shaq there, but also when Shaq was there he often carried the offense in the fourth. 2. Dirk Nowitzki - Ask the Suns this year. Ask the Spurs in the playoffs last year. He wants the ball and he delivers. 3. Gilbert Arenas - First in clutch shots this year. He's gaining that rep.Guys like James, Wade, Nash and Billups also come to mind. The great players are generally clutch. That's what makes them so good.
