<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">What hasnt Billups done for Detroit that Nash has for Phoenix? </div> Take away Big Ben and Sheed, and put two small men as C, and PF and lets see how Detroit fairs. Nash has done far more than Billups, Nash deserves it more than Billups. Hell Nash deserves it more than Kobe.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Franchise4Ever:</div><div class="quote_post">Take away Big Ben and Sheed, and put two small men as C, and PF and lets see how Detroit fairs. Nash has done far more than Billups, Nash deserves it more than Billups. Hell Nash deserves it more than Kobe.</div> Boris Diaw = 6'8 Ben Wallace = 6'9 Shawn Marion = 6'7 Rasheed Wallace = 6'11 Yet Shawn Marion is 3rd in the league for rebounding, Diaw is 31st, while Ben Wallace is 4th and Sheed is 35th. Not to mention our backup PF's are 6'9 & 6'7, so dont make it out like they're at a disadvantage, they're not.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting NTC187:</div><div class="quote_post">Boris Diaw = 6'8 Ben Wallace = 6'9 Shawn Marion = 6'7 Rasheed Wallace = 6'11 Yet Shawn Marion is 3rd in the league for rebounding, Diaw is 31st, while Ben Wallace is 4th and Sheed is 35th. Not to mention our backup PF's are 6'9 & 6'7, so dont make it out like they're at a disadvantage, they're not.</div> Amare and Thomas gone yet apparently <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">so dont make it out like they're at a disadvantage, they're not</div> So its not a disadvantage.....give me a f'ing break, you don't honestly believe that garbage spewing from your mouth.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Franchise4Ever:</div><div class="quote_post">Amare and Thomas gone yet apparently</div> What are you talking about? <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Franchise4Ever:</div><div class="quote_post">So its not a disadvantage.....give me a f'ing break, you don't honestly believe that garbage spewing from your mouth.</div> It's no disadvantage. Especially when Phoenix is 53 - 28, Diaw is averaging 13.3ppg, 6.9rpg, 6.2apg and Marion is averaging 21.7ppg, 11.8rpg, 1.8apg.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">What are you talking about?</div> I said Amare and Thomas are gone yet apparently to you it isn't a big disadvantage which I quoted. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">It's no disadvantage. Especially when Phoenix is 53 - 28</div> Don't give me that! Its not a big deal because of Nash making due without. Unlike Billups, which is why Nash should win it, Nash can make anyone better even if it was garbage players. 7 Phoenix players are having career seasons, CAREER SEASONS. Can the same be said about Billups? Maybe....probably not but it doesn't escape the fact that Amare and Thomas going down was a BIG hit to them, yet like a true MVP Nash was able to pull through and make his guys better. Stats mean nothing its what the player has done. Even if Billups is only averaging 2 less APG and has a better record, Billups has yet to achieve or even comprehend what Nash has accomplished. Nash deserves MVP above all others case closed on that.
^ 2.7 apg difference actually or said another way, Nash gets 30% more assists per game Billups should not be rewarded with an MVP trophy simply becuase his team has the best record and he is the best player. He should not be rewarded the MVP becuase of things he has done in the past years..whether that be Detroits record in 2004, his Finals MVP trophy...whatever. Its irrelavent to the debate. Billups is on a great team, whose core 5 guys have not missed 1 single game due to injury. Not one game. Billups' team has a core that's been together since the dawn of time, billups has had time to get accustomed to them Bottom line is that Billups is less important to Detroit than Nash is to Pheonix, and by a good margin. Anyone that doubts that is as delusional as Ariza. Nash took a team struggling with significant injury troubles and offseason changes, and has lead them to where they are...he's pushed them, he's made them better than they've ever been individually. They're playing without Amare and Kurt Thomas and yet they're still considered contenders. Could Billups take the Pistons to the finals without Sheed and Big Ben?
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Anyone that doubts that is as delusional as Ariza.</div> Thats kind of harsh....I kind of like him, he shows potential. NTC187, its not like we don't like Billups its just that its the truth he doesn't deserve it. 7 players on the Suns having career seasons, because of Nash.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">its not like we don't like Billups its just that its the truth he doesn't deserve it</div> Your kidding me? I don't care if Nash is MVP, but by saying he doesn't even deserve it is just not even true.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Franchise4Ever:</div><div class="quote_post">Thats kind of harsh....I kind of like him, he shows potential. NTC187, its not like we don't like Billups its just that its the truth he doesn't deserve it. 7 players on the Suns having career seasons, because of Nash.</div> Has just as much to do with the suns system as It does Nash. Mike D'antoni has alot to do with It.
Just thought I'd point this out, todays game against Washington, Billups isnt playing: R.Hamilton - 9 Points, 3 Rebounds, 2 Assists B.Wallace - 6 Points, 5 Rebounds, 2 Assists R.Wallace - 9 Points, 3 Rebounds, 1 Assist T.Prince - 6 Points, 2 Rebounds, 1 Assist Detroit lost the game by 16 points (96 - 80). Now tell me Chauncey isnt a valuable asset to the team.
That doesn't prove your point, the starters played on average about 18-19 minutes. The Pistons bench basically lost to a team playing all their starters.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AllNet:</div><div class="quote_post">That doesn't prove your point, the starters played on average about 18-19 minutes. The Pistons bench basically lost to a team playing all their starters.</div> Thank you! I'm not saying Billups is garbage, I'm saying he doesn't deserver it as much as Nash or Kobe.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting hustler:</div><div class="quote_post">Your kidding me? I don't care if Nash is MVP, but by saying he doesn't even deserve it is just not even true.</div> he doesnt deserve it though. Its an opinion that he stated, and i also have about the MVP race. Because we think that Billups hasnt lead his team the way Nash has, we think Nash deserves the MVP. Whats wrong with saying someone doesnt deserve the MVP award?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting NTC187:</div><div class="quote_post">Just thought I'd point this out, todays game against Washington, Billups isnt playing: R.Hamilton - 9 Points, 3 Rebounds, 2 Assists B.Wallace - 6 Points, 5 Rebounds, 2 Assists R.Wallace - 9 Points, 3 Rebounds, 1 Assist T.Prince - 6 Points, 2 Rebounds, 1 Assist Detroit lost the game by 16 points (96 - 80). Now tell me Chauncey isnt a valuable asset to the team.</div> I'm guessing you didnt see the Suns play the Lakers without Nash recently? now THAT shows how necessary Nash is for their success, much better than your supposed Detroit without Billups game
My point was more to show you how we perform without Chauncey, we already know Nash is a vital part in Phoenix, no one is debating that.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> My point was more to show you how we perform without Chauncey, we already know Nash is a vital part in Phoenix, no one is debating that. </div> You used a season-ending game where the opposite team played thier starters while the Pistons rested most of thiers as your primary example to prove your point? I'm sorry but even you yourself know your point is evidently useless. I would use that the Suns lost a blowout to the Lakers in thier final game as an example as well but with everything sealed up in the season, thats pretty much a useless example to use; especially when the other team is striving towards clinching a playoff birth. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Really, how is Billups not a focale point in the Detroit team, how? You still have yet to give me a reasonable explanation for this, probally because you simply cant. Picture Detroit without Billups, who is going to take control of the offensive game? who is going to run the floor like Billups does? Ben? Sheed? Prince? LMAO, gimme a break. </div> Picture Detriot without Big Ben, picture Detriot without Rip, picture Detriot without Rasheed, do you still think they'd be the same? I've said it earlier and I'll say it again: Detriot is Detriot because they play in an equal system where ONE SINGLE PERSON does not dictate thier team concept, but rather the cohisiveness of all of them as a team is what makes them win and win consistently. It's not always the best player on the best team that has to win it, because if that was the case then with that logic, someone like Tim Duncan would have won it almost every year. Billups deserves to be in the running definetly, but you can't tell me that he is the number one candiate. We can't even use "replace him" or "exchange them" comparisons because frankly, they wont happen so we have to debate based on what we have infront of us. What we have infront of us is a Suns team with many new players, all of whom posess career highs in numbers due to the system of the team, whose system is basically run and carried by Steve Nash; thus, he is the ONE PERSON who is valueable enough that he makes the difference between the Suns winning or losing EVERY SINGLE GAME they play. Can you say that about Billups? If you can, can't you say the same about Ben Wallace as well though? Rip? Exactly. And that's the difference between Billups and Nash.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Lostmyluggage:</div><div class="quote_post">For MVP award: LeBron>Kobe>Dirk>Billups>Nash So in retrospect, Billups > Nash</div> I'm sorry but LeBron>Kobe>Dirk>Billups>Nash? I don't think so, this is by far the biggest fan boy post ever. THis is the order i think appropiate. Nash>Kobe>Billups>Lebron>Dirk.
I'm sorry, but you will find out how wrong you are when you see lebron holding up the MVP award on national TV. I'm done with this topic.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Lostmyluggage:</div><div class="quote_post">I'm sorry, but you will find out how wrong you are when you see lebron holding up the MVP award on national TV. I'm done with this topic.</div> Lebron will not be the MVP, Steve Nash will get It for the 2nd straight year.
