Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free agent."

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by chris_in_pdx, Jul 9, 2013.

  1. Nikolokolus

    Nikolokolus There's always next year

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    If we traded Aldridge this would definitely be a lotto team.
     
  2. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    What if Seattle picked Durant anyway? Still be fucked yes?
     
  3. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    #6 was New Jersey's pick. We had nothing to do with that, tanking or non-tanking. Our pick was #11--Leonard.
     
  4. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    So you think of we got lee and Barnes; we would be a lotto team?
     
  5. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Lotto picks are still lotto picks Brian. Okc got #6 that year from a trade too? Does that mean it doesn't apply?

    You and most of the "rebuild with lotto picks" group talk about I raining talent through the draft. Obviously you don't have to tank to do that.
     
  6. Nikolokolus

    Nikolokolus There's always next year

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    That particular trade is mostly a push, but I doubt we'd see that kind of move. In all likelihood Olshey would want an expiring contract and a young player along with a pick.
     
  7. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Example? I don't see any team that can give us that and have the cap space or expiring to absorb the contract.
     
  8. Hobbesarable

    Hobbesarable Cartoon Character

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    There comes a point where you either go with the L-Train or you get off. That time is coming very soon.
     
  9. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    I think it's unfair to think in that way when the team that was built around Aldridge couldn't stay healthy. Now that there is a good new core that we can count on, maybe its better to make that decision after we see the team play

    EDIT: And why not trade Batum? It seems he has been more inconsistent. If this team could manage to trade Batum, Matthews and Leonard for Horford; that would definitely move the needle.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
  10. Hobbesarable

    Hobbesarable Cartoon Character

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    An enormous contract is looming near for the L-Train. You gotta keep flexibility within the cap as you try to improve every year. Besides, are you paying him to be a #1 or #2 (or yikes #3)?

    There's also the defense factor. We were pretty bad last season. Look for changes if that happens again this upcoming season.
     
  11. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    He is a definite #2 option. Maybe we should be having that conversation about Batum being a 12 mil player and a weak #3 option. AT least Aldridge is consistent.
     
  12. Mote

    Mote Well-Known Member

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Which would probably mean the coaching staff.
     
  13. Hobbesarable

    Hobbesarable Cartoon Character

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Batum's contract could adversely affect our cap flexibility as well.
     
  14. Hobbesarable

    Hobbesarable Cartoon Character

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    That's one way to change things. It's not the only option.
     
  15. Mote

    Mote Well-Known Member

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    True, but with the addition of Lopez and a serviceable bench the coaching staff would take a lot of heat if the Blazers defense doesn't step it up this season.
     
  16. Hobbesarable

    Hobbesarable Cartoon Character

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Lopez is part of the solution. The starting core constitutes most of the minutes played. The bench occasionally helps. We'll see how much the interior defense actually improved. We basically took out JJ and replaced him with Lopez. The starting unit is pretty much the same. The bench IMO is improved offensively. Defensively is a different matter entirely.

    Leonard looked lost in his defensive rotations and assignments. And I'm not quite sure what we should expect from TRob. Defensively our team is an enigma at this point. Couldn't get much worse than last season, right? LOL
     
  17. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    This is a very good point. I hope the coaching staff realizes that the leeway they got last year likely no longer exists. The FO--like the fans--expects a jump this year.
     
  18. Mote

    Mote Well-Known Member

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    Yep... agree completely.
     
  19. STOMP

    STOMP mere fan

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    The greater Bay Area has roughly double the population of the entire state of Oregon... neither the Bay Area or Detroit are small markets. Also, Iguadala reportedly turned down more $ from Denver because he felt the Warriors would give him a better chance to compete for a title.

    STOMP
     
  20. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Bitter Truth: "Portland will never, ever, ever be able to sign a marquee free age

    I don't know if you're doing it on purpose or not, but you're not only misrepresenting the point of most of the people who want to trade LMA now, but also in the need for a small market team to build through the draft.

    First, this year's not a good year to pick to say we can’t get marquee FA’s, whether that’s true or not. As shown multiple times, we had "only" 11.9M in cap space. That wasn't enough for a "marquee-" or even "semi-marquee-level" player like Paul (21.4M/yr) Howard (20M/yr), Smith (14M/yr), Jefferson (13.7M/yr), West (12M/yr), Iguodala (12M/yr), Bynum (12M/yr). Pekovic would’ve been matched at any price we would’ve been able to afford. Splitter was matched at about the max we were going to go (9M/yr).

    We had enough for either Evans (11M/yr), Millsap (9M/yr) or Mayo (8M/yr) and a spare part left over. I don’t consider them “marquee”. We could’ve afforded JJ Redick (6.2M/yr), but it seems he wanted to play in LA with CP3 and Lob City. You want Kevin Martin (4yr/32M)? Jack, Calderon or JR Smith at 4/25M+?

    Second, someone (Jayne?) stated that our offseason was like picking up a couch of the sidewalk. That’s kind of dumb. It was more like buying a drug-runner’s Lamborghini at a police auction, or Iverson’s Bentley at a bankruptcy auction. The rules stated that a team (in this case, HOU) wanted to do something the law wouldn’t allow, and so they had to have assets re-po’d (or sold at fire-sale prices—in this case, Robinson) to be able to get what they wanted (in this case, Howard). Same for NOP and Lopez. They wanted Tyreke, and the price for that was fire-saling their starting center. Doesn’t mean that they aren’t still useful assets, it means that because of extenuating circumstances you didn’t have to pay full price for them. Could we have traded cap space for the #5 pick 12 months ago? Or even 4 months ago (when SAC gave up Robinson)?

    Third, you don’t have to tank to get good draft picks. But you do have to get them. Trading 30 y/o All-Star Gerald Wallace for the #6 pick was not the catalyst for our 2011 slide, it was a move that gathered assets after seeing that he wasn’t going to be here long-term. Yes, the team was hurt in the short term because Mehmet Okur and Shawne Williams were not as good as Crash was, but the team got a pretty good value (in Lillard) going forward. CLE doesn’t have Kyrie Irving because they sucked—they have Kyrie Irving because they traded their 28 y/o All-Star PG (Mo Williams) for LAC’s lotto pick—which won the lotto. They were slightly worse short-term because Baron Davis’ broken-down body wasn’t as good as Williams. But they got around 8+ years of Kyrie Irving instead. OKC used cap space to take on Kurt Thomas (and got two 1sts—Serge Ibaka included—for their trouble), and then traded him for another future first. Didn’t matter how good or bad they were—the picks were other teams’ assets that they were able to leverage. By trading 27 y/o All-Star Chris Paul two years before they knew he was going to not re-sign with his team, NOH got a not-quite-as-good player (Gordon), some young pieces and a lotto pick. Didn’t matter how much they sucked, they were getting a pick based on how bad LAC was (and it ended up at #10). Deron forcing his way out of Utah got Favors, a lotto pick (that ended up at #3), a mid-round pick (Dieng) and a point guard that actually played better than Deron did for the rest of that year. Didn’t matter how bad they tanked or not—they were in the running all this year for a playoff spot. I can go on, but there’s more.

    Going back to the point of the article, we can’t Spend Paul Allen’s Money to circumvent a cap anymore. It doesn’t matter if we actually wanted Hibbert so bad we would’ve paid 40M a year to get him, we were limited by the CBA and IND could match whatever we wanted (BTW, Hibbert was a pretty marquee FA that would’ve signed here, so there’s one). Did anyone ever think that POR was in the running for one of the “marquee” FA’s this year (CP3 or Howard), even if we did have oodles of cap space? When we had Roy, Oden and Aldridge, and 11M in space, which marquee FA’s lined up to sign here? Not Hedo. Millsap got matched. We went with Andre Miller. Instead of having RLEC traded for Vince Carter and 2 firsts at the previous deadline.

    What we (as a non-"glamour" city) need is to continually get assets to keep building up a team. In Portland, the FA method for getting marquee players has proven to be one that is lightning-in-a-bottle at best, and non-existent at worst. Getting future draft picks is a way to maintain the flexibility and ability to get good players on inexpensive contracts, maintaining cap flexibility to go after future assets like we did this year (or Presti did with Kurt Thomas or Utah did with Jefferson and Biedrins) and setting yourself up if a Pippen/Howard/Deron/Melo trade comes along. Letting an All-Star-caliber player walk for nothing is beyond short-sighted, and has been shown to be that throughout recent NBA history.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
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