Climatologists Baffled by Global Warming Time-Out

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by Denny Crane, Nov 19, 2009.

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  1. bluefrog

    bluefrog Go Blazers, GO!

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    Nasa's data is bunk?
     
    bluefrog, Dec 2, 2009
    #41
  2. yakbladder

    yakbladder Grunt Third Class

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    You mean like the science adviser to the President stating that the manipulation of data should be investigated?

    He still made a good point - while there were some questionable activities around manipulation of data (and by manipulation I do not mean simply bad manipulation), the studies that they had argued against were flawed.

    I think that you're trying to apply your solution to the framework and it makes an easy fit.
     
    yakbladder, Dec 2, 2009
    #42
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I have two questions that I'm sure you have answers to.

    1) Why do they need to collude to destroy their data and documentation if there were a FOIA request?
    2) Why do they need to collude to keep conflicting studies from being published and peer reviewed?

    I look forward to the answers. I can't figure it out.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 2, 2009
    #43
  4. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    Thanks for the link. I tried to rep you, but I have to spread some more around.:cheers:
     
    maxiep, Dec 2, 2009
    #44
  5. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

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    I remember hearing/seeing something about pockets of de-oxygenated water and pretty much everything dies in it. It isn't running rampant in the world, but the idea of a dead ocean is frightening.
     
    Eastoff, Dec 2, 2009
    #45
  6. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/1...ntry5866076.shtml?tag=contentMain;contentBody

    http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-december-1-2009/scientists-hide-global-warming-data
     
    maxiep, Dec 3, 2009
    #46
  7. yakbladder

    yakbladder Grunt Third Class

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    I can answer the second one. From what I have heard ..and granted this could be a load of BS... they were trying to keep studies out because they were based on bad science or performed with bad data. In fact Obama's science adviser stood by his statement found in an email that one of the studies was just out-and-out bad...as in performed poorly.

    The biggest part of this issue that I see is that the topic has become too politicized. Everyone wants to fit the argument into their framework and I think it would be not be in the least surprising to find out that the people who hacked the accounts wanted to spawn all of this "disturbance" and questioning.

    It's idiotic to me that both sides can't put down the guns for a few moments, apoliticize the discussion and look through the facts while trying to tamper down the obvious bias. If one side is right then we're speeding the Earth towards irreversible doom. If the other side is right then we're pouring a crap load more money into something that's a scientific scam. With stakes such as these it just galls me that an objective evaluation of the facts could probably never be run and never be accepted if it were. The unfortunate consequence, of course, is that most likely one of the two catastrophic events will occur and then it's too late.

    We might as well just start picking out states now and divide the U.S. if we're never going to work together. I don't even remember the last time we did that politically.
     
    yakbladder, Dec 3, 2009
    #47
  8. bluefrog

    bluefrog Go Blazers, GO!

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    So, is Ron Bailey accusing all climate data collecting organizations of being cohorts?

    This data has been publicly available for years. Seems unlikely that all these data sets could be manipulated without detection
     
    bluefrog, Dec 3, 2009
    #48
  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    It is irrelevant what Obama's science advisor thinks. The studies should be published and peer reviewed, not kept out of publication by some cabal who has now been exposed. To top if off, when guys publish their studies anywhere they can, they're accused of publishing stuff that's not peer reviewed. Nice how that works.

    It's looking like a whistleblower is responsible for uploading the files.

    The raw data has been erased. Strange, eh?

    The emails made public show a collusion between these European scientists and many in the United States. In fact, Michael E. Mann of the Mann Hockey Stick Graph is under investigation at Penn State over all this. The emails also discussed plans to destroy their data and research if it were ever under a FOIA request.

    It really looks bad, no matter how you slice and dice it.
    :dunno:
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 3, 2009
    #49
  10. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    You know what peer review is, right?

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 3, 2009
    #50
  11. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    It isn't peer review if it's one peer or a small number with an agenda.

    It IS peer review if it's made public so EVERY peer can review the report and data and arrive at the same conclusions.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 3, 2009
    #51
  12. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    That might be your definition of peer review, but it is not the commonly accepted meaning.
    The commonly accepted meaning is a small cabal which decides whether something should be published or not. Pre-publication review, not post.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 3, 2009
    #52
  13. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    So it would be OK in your book for creationists to "peer review" scientific works and prevent them from being published.

    gotcha.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 3, 2009
    #53
  14. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I said nothing of the sort. I was simply explaining to you what the term meant.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 3, 2009
    #54
  15. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    What I posted is the equivalent.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 3, 2009
    #55
  16. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Not unless you consider creationists and scientists peers.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 3, 2009
    #56
  17. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I consider "scientists" who fake their data and plot to keep accurate information out of journals, to not be peers of real scientists.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 3, 2009
    #57
  18. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Wow, that's a pretty radical stance you got there. I suppose you are anti-genocide too?

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 3, 2009
    #58
  19. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    If you have a point, I don't get it.
     
    Denny Crane, Dec 4, 2009
    #59
  20. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    You said you were anti-cheating. I was implying that that is a universal enough viewpoint that it doesn't really need to be stated.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Dec 4, 2009
    #60
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