Cops killed man at Walmart, then interrogated girlfriend

3RA1N1AC · Dec 24, 2014

XuLouDon said: ↑

This fantasy seems to have come from you, since no one has asked or wondered why police can't read minds or shoot pistols out of people hands.

People are mad because officers run into stores and blow away people before they even know what's going on. They choke people unconscious because they might be selling loose cigarettes. Because they enter a dark hallway and get spooked into instantly killing someone at the bottom of the stairs. Because they pull up and take all of 2 seconds to drop a kid that had a toy gun in his waistband.

That's a lot of what ifs and what could haves. 2 seconds is the amount of time it took for a car to come to a stop, an officer to jump out of his car, and kill a 12 year old. What's a kid gonna do in 2 seconds? What order does he follow to save his own life? He looked up and was dead.

Yes, we know. Here's how we know. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Empire_State_Building_shooting -

The problem is they don't wait. Even in a street full of people. They'll take out a shooter and anyone near him, no hesitation.

Violent crime has dropped steadily since the early 90s. That perceived constant and never ending danger is part of the problem. Yes they do need to relax, yes they do need to tone it down. Those two officers didn't die because they allowed themselves to go outside the bounds of constant paranoia. They're dead because some POS targeted them for what they were.

Using your favorite word, blaming those cops for being lazy in their training, is bullshit.

Working security, reading magazines and toting a pistol doesn't either.

A nice summation of your post.

...Sorry for this being my first post. I've lurked since the migration from BBF but, ugh, couldn't help myself.

...Merry Christmas.
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Welcome! Stick around, you seem smart and stuff.

Jade Falcon · Dec 25, 2014

[video=youtube;qwC-RHsC6gw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwC-RHsC6gw[/video]

That video explains things far better than I ever could. And even then, just a fraction. It's impossible to completely break down this subject in a 18 minute video.

Expert Massad Ayoob (blog: http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/) explains about Grand Jury decisions in a short summary. I've studied this man's work for years; he's the real deal.

The grand jury concept has been much in the news of late. People with axes to grind (including multiple talking heads on CNN) decry the fact that grand juries in Missouri and New York exonerated the police officer who shot Michael Brown in Ferguson and the one who grabbed Eric Garner and pulled him to the sidewalk in NYC. Benjamin Crump, the plaintiffs’ attorney for the families in the Brown case, the Garner case, and the Trayvon Martin death before that, has called for a prosecutor to indict without sending the case to the grand jury in yet another racially –charged case.

I know many defense lawyers – and many citizens from the far left to the far right – who hate the grand jury system and believe it should be abolished. Having worked within the American criminal justice system in one way or another for more than four decades – as arresting officer, as police department prosecutor, as expert witness for both sides – I have to profoundly disagree.

When people hear the word “jury,” they think of the regular, “petit” jury: normally six to twelve people with some alternates as “spares” who determine guilt or innocence in a full-blown criminal trial, or apportion responsibility between plaintiff and defendant in the trial of a civil lawsuit. The grand jury is exclusive to the criminal side of the justice house, and is called by the prosecutor to determine whether or not there is probable cause to believe a crime has been committed, or at least, enough question thereof that the matter should be sorted out in a full-blown trial. The grand jury will return either a “true bill,” which means that the person in question is now a defendant, stands indicted, and is fully inserted into the gullet of the criminal justice machine, or “no true bill,” which essentially exonerates the potential defendant, though that’s not exactly 100% because the prosecutor can usually re-file the case.

The grand jury is the province of the prosecutor. Often, a defense lawyer for the “person of interest” won’t even be allowed in the room, and if he is, he won’t be allowed to advocate for his client. This is what led to the famous saying that “a prosecutor can convince a jury to indict a ham sandwich.” The members of the grand jury hear what the prosecutor allows them to hear. This is what ticks off absolutists on both far left and far right.

And of course, if you are the one who wants to lead the lynch mob that hangs the defendant, you’ll be ROYALLY pissed off if the prosecutor actually allows exculpatory evidence which convinces his or her fellow citizens to return “no true bill.” This is apparently why Benjamin Crump does not want people he hopes to pillory to go in front of grand juries, and it is why CNN’s Sunny Hostin, a former prosecutor herself, was outraged that exculpatory evidence was presented to the grand jury in Ferguson, Missouri.

Having been on both sides of this two-way street, I support the grand jury concept, and I applaud prosecutors who perform their duty as ministers of justice to allow exculpatory evidence (indicative of innocence) to go before the grand jurors as well as inculpatory evidence (indicative of guilt). Their job is as much to exonerate the innocent as it is to prosecute the guilty.

Some say, “But if the prosecutor is the sole arbiter of the evidence, he can get anyone he wants indicted!” To which I say, “SO WHAT?”

Please understand: IN MOST JURISDICTIONS, THE PROSECUTOR CAN INDICT ON HIS OR HER OWN WITHOUT A GRAND JURY ANYWAY, under what is generally called an “offer of information.”

In the cases currently under media scrutiny, the grand juries heard both sides of the story, while the public and the talking heads only heard one side’s narrative. Before anyone joins in the howl of the lynch mob, they should ask themselves one question: “If I was the one accused, would I want my side of the story and the evidence supporting me to be heard, before I was sent to trial in a case that would likely cost me six figures worth of dollars and incalculable suffering for myself and my family, before the decision was made to put me through that ordeal?”

The grand juries in the Brown death in Ferguson and the Garner death in New York did hear both sides. Having heard that, they each issued no true bill.

I for one respect that, and the prosecutorial authorities who allowed those grand juries to hear both sides.
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He also goes into detail regarding the entire Ferguson case in that blog, if anyone's interested. I'm awaiting his writing regarding Tamir Rice. But I think that's a good start.

But hey, what do I know? I'm not an expert. Just a self-taught hobbyist. A hobbyist who trusts FACTS and EXPERTS, not EMOTIONAL ARGUMENTS and RACE BAITERS ("hysterical reporters" can also be added to that list).

Yes they do need to relax, yes they do need to tone it down. Those two officers didn't die because they allowed themselves to go outside the bounds of constant paranoia.
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http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/24/justice/missouri-officer-involved-shooting/

You're bullshit is laughable. I'd love to hear your excuse for this one.

Even more: I'd love to hear someone's excuse for the rioting over what is CLEARLY a lawful case of self-defense.

XuLouDon · Dec 25, 2014

Jade Falcon said: ↑

You're bullshit is laughable. I'd love to hear your excuse for this one.

Even more: I'd love to hear someone's excuse for the rioting over what is CLEARLY a lawful case of self-defense.
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You sure do love that word.

There doesn't need to be an excuse. He pointed a gun, and he's dead. It is what it is.

92 year old Kathryn Johnston
19 month old Bounkham Phonesavanh
7 year old Aiyana Jones
Jonathan Ferrell
Peyton Strickland
Oscar Grant
Yvette Smith
Dillon Taylor
Victor White
Akai Gurley
Rekia Boyd
Kenneth Chamberlain
James Brissette/Ronald Madison
Henry Glover (Particularly bad)
Roy Middleton (Not Dead)
John Crawford (Thread Topic)

What's the excuse for them?

People aren't rioting/protesting/mad because this is a shock to the system. Nothing that is happening is new. They're mad because it continues.
__________________

I appreciate the welcomes.

Of all the things I've read over the years, Draft days, Oden, mixum, BenDavis, sorry again for this being what I decided to post on...

SlyPokerDog · Dec 25, 2014

XuLouDon said: ↑

Of all the things I've read over the years, Draft days, Oden, mixum, BenDavis, sorry again for this being what I decided to post on...
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Wow! You have been stalking the forum for a long time. Props for finally joining!

oldmangrouch · Dec 25, 2014

One point that gets over-looked here.

The DA can stack the deck to get an indictment - but the defendant still gets their day in court. If the DA tanks the Grand Jury - the victim is SOL.

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Cops killed man at Walmart, then interrogated girlfriend

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Jade Falcon Just to piss you off.

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Cops killed man at Walmart, then interrogated girlfriend

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3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

Jade Falcon Just to piss you off.

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oldmangrouch persona non grata

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