<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GatorsowntheNCAA:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think anyone really has unreasonable expectations for him this year. I'm expecting something close to 11-12 ppg 5-7 rpg and around 2 bpg. That's solid center numbers while he gains experience, but I think him and Dwight could form the best big man duo in the game in 2-3 years. (that might be the expectations you are talking about)</div> Don't get me wrong, hes impressed me since he left the Pistons.. But anyone with a brain and eyes could have noticed the difference. The guy just needed a chance to play because he was buried behind the deep Piston bench. Playing 5 minutes if he was lucky was his life in Detroit, and ever since Orlando we've noticed a massive turnaround. Duh. He still had to practice with the team, defend the Ben/Sheed and co. on a daily basis and learn the game each day. I'd figure he'd show massive signs of improvements since leaving to play with Orlando. Just the experience alone against those 2 All Stars should have made him a better player. I'm not trying to be negative, but he was never a bust because he was never given an opportunity to play the game. He was always an 'undercover' player if you want to call it that.. because of the lack of minutes. The talent was always there, just never exposed to us. Therefore, making predictions for him wouldn't be unreasonable I just see him as an average player... About 10 points/6 rebounds sounds about right for the first half of the season. But who knows, he might surprise us all, just don't lose sleep over him. All I know is that he was never worth the #2 draft pick. Theres better out there and everyone will find that out. He's just average.. and will be for the next couple years.
its gonna take him like 30 shots a game to average 15 ppg, he is a bust, he maybe get better but right now i still think he's a bust a waste of money
Darko will most likely get between 10-15 shot attempts per game, averaging like I said earlier about 10 a game. I don't even think Orlando will base their offense around him, so my predictions could be a little weak. Dwight Howard needs the ball first and foremost, and if Darko can clean up his misses and knock a couple down than so be it. Otherwise, leave him to rebound and block shots. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting NYCfinest123:</div><div class="quote_post">its gonna take him like 30 shots a game to average 15 ppg, he is a bust, he maybe get better but right now i still think he's a bust a waste of money</div> Darko will almost never take 30 shots a game, and if he can't' score 15 off of 30 attempts he belongs with Jerryl Sasser. Kobe jacked up 27 attempts per game and led the league in scoring, but I doubt Darko will even compare. He's not a bust, he's just like a Kwame Brown - average and a waste of a high draft pick.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting NYCfinest123:</div><div class="quote_post">its gonna take him like 30 shots a game to average 15 ppg, he is a bust, he maybe get better but right now i still think he's a bust a waste of money</div> I hate to say it, but he would probably start at center for your beloved Knicks. He is making like 3 million a year, look at the entire Knicks roster if you want to see waste of money. I think 10-15 shots is a little much. I think we'll use him sorta like we did Dwight last year. Dwight avg 10.7 shots a game. I expect Hedo and Jameer to up their amount of shots and hopefully Dwight will get 15-17 shots a game next year. I don't think you can call him a bust when he hasn't had a full year to show what he is made of yet. Kwame Brown had plenty of opportunities as he always got minutes, while Darko still hasn't had many yet. That goes vice versa too, I don't think you can call him not a bust, since he hasn't had a full year yet to prove what he can do.
I agree with Ice saying how he's not worth the high draft pick when compared to the likes of Bosh, Wade, Kaman and whatnot, but I think you also have to take into consideration what the Magic got in exchange for Darko. That's what's the most improtant. You get a budding young big man and a servicable point guard for an old, rebound-only kind of guy. I think that what the Magic got in exchange for Cato (Darko and Arroyo) is more important than whether or not Darko's a bust when compared to the '03 draft class (I still think that he'll be able to match the likes of the second-tier players of that class). Look at it this way, Bosh is better than Darko, but you'd rather trade a sack of potato chips and a bottle of moutain Dew for Darko instead of going after an untouchable Bosh, right? As long as the Magic got a good trade that swung in their favour, I don't see Darko being too much of a burden for them in terms of expectation levels.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GatorsowntheNCAA:</div><div class="quote_post">I hate to say it, but he would probably start at center for your beloved Knicks. He is making like 3 million a year, look at the entire Knicks roster if you want to see waste of money. </div> Ha. Sad but true. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I think 10-15 shots is a little much. I think we'll use him sorta like we did Dwight last year. Dwight avg 10.7 shots a game. I expect Hedo and Jameer to up their amount of shots and hopefully Dwight will get 15-17 shots a game next year. </div> It is, but I think most of his attempts will come from Dwights missed shots. If you put it in that perspective, he could easily average more if he's positioned well in the post. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think you can call him a bust when he hasn't had a full year to show what he is made of yet. Kwame Brown had plenty of opportunities as he always got minutes, while Darko still hasn't had many yet. That goes vice versa too, I don't think you can call him not a bust, since he hasn't had a full year yet to prove what he can do.</div> Yes, he's still young but he was drafted too high and IMO will be an 'average' player for the next couple of years. Who knows what might happen down the road, but for now hes not a bust, hes just an average dime a dozen center. He hasn't done enough for us to start calling him things such as the best duo in the next 2-3 years and everything else. We'll just have to wait and see. But after this season we'll know, and no more waiting on him for improvements. This is his year to prove people like myself wrong. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">but I think you also have to take into consideration what the Magic got in exchange for Darko. That's what's the most improtant. You get a budding young big man and a servicable point guard for an old, rebound-only kind of guy. I think that what the Magic got in exchange for Cato (Darko and Arroyo) is more important than whether or not he's a bust when compared to the '03 draft class (I still think that he'll be able to match the likes of the second-tier players of that class).</div> Word. And in that aspect, the actual acquiring of him was a win win situation. The Magic really didn't give up much and thought long term. I'm not faulting them at all for getting him, I just think people expect way too much from him.
I hope Darko breaks out this year and squelches all of the bust talk. Either way, I think he a serviceable big man with a considerable upside. He can shoot, play with his back to the basket, rebound, and block some shots. What else can you ask for? If he was a mid-to-late 1st rounder we wouldn't be talking about this. I think the Pistons fans are bitter about the fact their team screwed up big time when it comes to where they drafted him.
Darko is going to produce solid numbers now that he should start over Tony Battie which is better. If Darko can average around 15pts for us to go along with 8rbs, I'm happy. Darko is a pretty good defensive player and we got a steal trading for him along with getting Carlos Arroyo for "no ups" Kelvin Cato. Darko will need to bulk up a bit and work on consistent post moves and then he will be fine.
To be honest, I don't want Darko starting. I think if he comes off the bench he'll be very effective against second unit big men since most of them stink.
Exactly. But bringing Darko off the bench increases depth at PF and C. Like I said before, he'll be very effective against second-tier big men, especially since team's don't normally have that many effective bodies in the paint. This also helps spoon-feed Dwight a bit more, but it's not like Darko took that many shots to begin with.
Darko will most likely take more shots this year. He adds depth but should be able to start over the likes of Tony Battie. Tony Battie can play PF and Center also so what's ur point??
Oh god... Instead of piling all of the best players into the starting lineup and having a weak front court on the Magic's second unit, bringing Darko off the bench will help with that aspect tremendously. This also helps with Darko's production since he'll be the first big man off the bench and should be able to log plenty of minutes anyway since he can replace Battie or Dwight early on if necessary. Also, many of the league's second tier big men aren't very effective and are just lumps of meat until the actual starters come back on, meaning that Darko can really have a field day against them. Let's not kid ourselves here, other than Tony Battie, Darko and D12, there aren't any other solid big men on the roster unless you somehow Magically think that Bo Outlaw or Pat Garrity will turn into Amare Stoudemire. James Augustine looks solid, but I doubt he can contribute right away. Your point about Darko taking more shots also helps further my point as well. Since Darko will be demanding more shots, it will take away shots from Dwight, which I think is instrumental to help develop his offensive game. Sure they'll play together, but having Dwight get touches early on in the game helps build confidence and can make him more effective early on from the get go.
I didn't say Darko will demand shots. I'm just saying with his productivity that he will shoot around 7-11 shots per game. Dwight is still the main offensive threat on the Magic. He will get many touches and probably will get the ball on every offensive run. If Darko is to develop into a good player for us, why the heck would we have him playing against guys like Steven Hunter?? The man needs to show he can guard the likes of (am I crazy, yes) Tim Duncan and Amare Stoudamire. The Magic have no depth but Bo Outlaw is still a good defender and James Augustine is unproven but was good in college.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I didn't say Darko will demand shots. I'm just saying with his productivity that he will shoot around 7-11 shots per game.</div> Yes, but read what I said earlier, Dwight needs to be spoonfed early as possible to help boost his confidence, and even if Darko takes only 7 to 11 shots a game it still detracts from developing Dwight's offensive game regardless. You also make it sound like Dwight Howard actually has an offensive game at this point. He's shown signs of doing some things in the post and hitting the occasional jumper, but most of his points come off of rebounds, tip-ins, or dunks. In order to help develop that, getting him involved early will greatly boost his confidence. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">If Darko is to develop into a good player for us, why the heck would we have him playing against guys like Steven Hunter?? The man needs to show he can guard the likes of (am I crazy, yes) Tim Duncan and Amare Stoudamire.</div> You didn't prove anything with that last post, you're just re-hashing what you said and saying that Darko will need to guard the likes of Tim Duncan and Amare Stoudemire is absolutely crazy. Considering that Darko has hardly seen any playing time the past few years, he'll need to work his way up to develop his defensive game and help his shot blocking game progress. Throwing him head first into the likes of the best power fowards in the league isn't going to help with that. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The Magic have no depth but Bo Outlaw is still a good defender and James Augustine is unproven but was good in college.</div> So you honestly believe that Bo Outlaw can still do something? Wow, you definitely have faith in those guys. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">am I crazy, yes</div> Not really suprised there. I still don't see the point you're making, you're just throwing stuff up there hoping that I'll be convinced. By the way, Steven Hunter kicks ass.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting asdf:</div><div class="quote_post">Yes, but read what I said earlier, Dwight needs to be spoonfed early as possible to help boost his confidence, and even if Darko takes only 7 to 11 shots a game it still detracts from developing Dwight's offensive game regardless. You also make it sound like Dwight Howard actually has an offensive game at this point. He's shown signs of doing some things in the post and hitting the occasional jumper, but most of his points come off of rebounds, tip-ins, or dunks. In order to help develop that, getting him involved early will greatly boost his confidence. You didn't prove anything with that last post, you're just re-hashing what you said and saying that Darko will need to guard the likes of Tim Duncan and Amare Stoudemire is absolutely crazy. Considering that Darko has hardly seen any playing time the past few years, he'll need to work his way up to develop his defensive game and help his shot blocking game progress. Throwing him head first into the likes of the best power fowards in the league isn't going to help with that. So you honestly believe that Bo Outlaw can still do something? Wow, you definitely have faith in those guys. Not really suprised there. I still don't see the point you're making, you're just throwing stuff up there hoping that I'll be convinced. By the way, Steven Hunter kicks ass.</div> HAHAHA. THANK you asdf... i would have said it all myself, but i knew someone else would. Best post in this thread thus far.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting asdf:</div><div class="quote_post">So you honestly believe that Bo Outlaw can still do something? Wow, you definitely have faith in those guys. </div> Bo Outlaw can still do "something". He did a lot of dirty work last season as well as grabbing an ocassional board. He also played good d in the time he got. Not to mention his veteran leadership that is invaluable especially with these young guys. I've also heard he helps Dwight on his post moves and defense in practice.
But is it enough to warrant playing time on the court? Absolutely not. An occasional board?... With the way you put it, you make it sound like Nate Huffman is capable of being a good player. I'm all up for hard working players that grind it out, but let's be real here, the Magic are a young team and they can't waste playing time on playing some has-been that is a complete and utter liability on offence. Sure he's a decent defensive player, but he's not getting any quicker or stronger at 35 years of age.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting asdf:</div><div class="quote_post">But is it enough to warrant playing time on the court?</div> Yes <div class="quote_poster">Quoting asdf:</div><div class="quote_post">An occasional board?... With the way you put it, you make it sound like Nate Huffman is capable of being a good player. </div> d00d, Nate Huffman is god. Don't question him ever in my presence again. But more seriously Nate Huffman and Bo Outlaw are two different cases. Nate can't play as good d as Bo, as well as not bringing what Bo can bring. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting asdf:</div><div class="quote_post"> I'm all up for hard working players that grind it out, but let's be real here, the Magic are a young team and they can't waste playing time on playing some has-been that is a complete and utter liability on offence. Sure he's a decent defensive player, but he's not getting any quicker or stronger at 35 years of age.</div> The guy is only getting 11 minutes tops when coming off the bench, for the numbers and intangibles he brings in those 11 minutes I think its perfectly fine that he stays. He only comes off when Dwight, Darko, or Battie get benched and thats no problem at all. You never ever want a raw team with almost no veteran leadership. This isn't to say that Battie isn't a veteran however. Regardless you act as if his 11 minutes ,which I am thinking will go down a lot this season, is killing our young guys severly. It's not like he is dead weight on the court. Granted he doesn't get the ball on offense much if at all but he does like I said, intangibles. I remember him creating a lot of opportunities last season from him doing something so simple such as boxing out his man, playing good d, grabbing an offensive rebound, etc. I remember BKS and Brian had a similar arguement about Aaron Mckie on the Lakers board.
The way I see it, the only way for Darko to shed his 'bust' label is to be more than just a solid big man. While 12/7 and 2 blocks are good numbers for a big man, you have to take into consideration his draft position: 2nd overall. It gets even worse when you factor in three players he was taken over - Anthony, Wade, and Bosh - are already on the All-Star level. Granted, no one knew those three would be this good, but all three were rated higher than him during the draft. Since the Pistons were already solid at every position, they should have just drafted the best available talent or trade the pick. Unfortunately for Darko, this means the success of the '03 class combined with his lack of playing time for the Pistons will make him a bust in the eyes of most. Even if he somehow manages to average big time numbers, it is highly doubtful he can match the success of a Wade, Bosh, Anthony, or even a Josh Howard. So is Darko a bust? Yes, but you also have to remember he's also a good player too.
