Ford's latest

Discussion in 'Warriors Lounge' started by CohanHater, Jun 15, 2005.

  1. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

    Dec 4, 2003
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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting CohanHater:</div><div class="quote_post">I agree.. but that's a huge contract for a 6th man, right?</div> Pretty much, but look at what Van Exel and Jamison got paid to be Dallas' sixth men [​IMG]

    We could basically hold on to Murphy for like two years or so. hehe
  2. CohanHater

    CohanHater JBB JustBBall Member

    Sep 2, 2004
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    Enterprise Architect
    Nate, Ike impress; Marvin, Darko disappoint
    By Chad Ford
    ESPN Insider

    Stars aren't made in the NBA's summer leagues, but we did learn a few things in the last three weeks.

    First, a caveat: When judging players, take summer league performances with a grain of salt.

    Success in the summer leagues isn't a very accurate predictor of who will become an NBA star. While in previous summers LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Al Jefferson and Marquis Daniels gave us early signs that they were ready to have breakout years, players such as Qyntel Woods, Willie Green, John Salmons and Zarko Cabarkapa have also dominated in these leagues.

    A more accurate predictor is summer league failure. Nine times out of 10, it seems, if a player can't produce against the watered-down competition in the summer leagues, he'll struggle mightily to get it done against real NBA players during the season. But even that is only a short-term prediction, not a long-term one.

    This year, the NBA held four summer leagues across the country -- the Reebok Vegas Summer League, the Minnesota Summer League, the Southern California Summer Pro League in Los Angeles and the Reebok Rocky Mountain Revue in Salt Lake City.

    Who played well? Who bombed out? Insider talked to a number of NBA scouts and executives during the week to get you the skinny. Here's what the NBA Boys of Summer were up to in July.

    Summer Studs

    Nate Robinson, G, Knicks
    Stats: 17.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg in the Vegas Summer League
    Stats: 15.2 ppg, 5.8 apg at the Minnesota Summer League
    The skinny: Robinson was the most exciting player on the floor for two straight weeks and had scouts walking away convinced that he could be an instant impact player in the league. His speed and intensity can overcome any size limitations.

    In fact, scouts in Minnesota said he started to show that he could distribute the ball. Still, make no mistake, Robinson is a scorer -- much like the Bulls' Ben Gordon, Robinson's job will be to jump-start the offense (and the crowd) whenever he enters the game.

    I still can't get over the fact that the Suns traded him. He would be perfect -- perfect -- in Phoenix.

    Ike Diogu, PF, Warriors
    Stats: 18.4 ppg, 8.4 rpg in the Reebok Vegas Summer Shootout
    The skinny: The questions about whether Diogu has the size or skills to play the four in the NBA are quickly dissipating. He started off the summer slowly and finished with a flurry, dropping 37 points and 12 rebounds on the last day.

    He looks more and more like the second coming of Elton Brand.

    Hakim Warrick, F, Grizzlies
    Stats: 18.6 ppg, 8.2 rpg on 54 percent shooting at the Southern California Summer Pro League
    The skinny: Warrick was a college stud who slipped a bit in the draft because no one knew for sure what position he'd play in the NBA. That's still not settled after seven games, but the Grizzlies believe they have a versatile player who's going to find a way to get the ball in the basket and grab rebounds.

    The odd thing is that Warrick's athleticism doesn't translate into blocked shots. He blocked zero shots in seven games for Memphis.
    Chris Paul, PG, Hornets
    Stats: 15.3 ppg, 5.5 apg, 4.7 apg in the Vegas Summer League
    The skinny: Paul got off to a red-hot start (21 points, five assists, four rebounds against the Cavs and 12 points, nine assists vs. the Wizards) before a minor injury ended up slowing him down for the rest of the camp.

    The consensus among summer league scouts is that Paul will be the leading candidate for Rookie of the Year.

    Andrew Bogut, C, Bucks
    Stats: 13.2 ppg, 10 rpg, 1.4 bpg in the Minnesota Summer League
    The skinny: Bogut had an up-and-down week.

    He was outplayed by the trio of Dwayne Jones, Nick Horvath and David Simon in the first game and finished with just seven points. Then Bogut was dominated in the paint by David Harrison, the Pacers' second-year center, showing he had neither the strength nor the quickness to guard an NBA player in the paint.

    All that said, Bogut definitely had his moments. He was great in games against the Rockets, Raptors and Knicks. He showed tenacity on the boards, patience on the offensive end and an ability for moving the ball out of the post.

    The talent is there, but questions remain about whether he's physically ready to come in and play center in the NBA.

    SLEEPER: Andrew Bynum, C, Lakers
    Stats: 10.6 ppg, 7.5 rpg at the Southern California Summer Pro League
    The skinny: No one was expecting anything from Bynum for at least two years, but he played as though he belonged in his first seven games.

    He has soft hands and great size, and he runs the floor pretty well. Bynum was out of shape and needs to get stronger, but he was much more skilled than most scouts thought.

    It doesn't mean he'll get a sniff of playing time in L.A. next season, but it looks like the Lakers may have a keeper.

    Honorable Mention: Wayne Simien, PF, Heat (17.1 ppg, 7 rpg); Sean May, PF, Bobcats (14.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg); Channing Frye, C, Knicks (13.8 ppg, 5 rpg); David Lee, PF, Knicks (12 ppg, 6.2 rpg); Jason Maxiell, PF, Pistons (15 ppg, 3.6 rpg); Linas Kleiza, F, Nuggets (15.2 ppg, 6.2 rpg); Eddie Basden, G/F, Bulls (14 ppg, 5 rpg); Lawrence Roberts, PF, Grizzlies (13.6 ppg, 11.7 rpg); Alex Acker, G, Pistons (14.4 ppg, 3.2 rpg); Ryan Gomes, F, Celtics (12.2 ppg, 6.2 rpg); Monta Ellis, G, Warriors (15.8 ppg, 3 rpg); Antoine Wright, G, Nets (16.4 ppg, 2.8 rpg); Raymond Felton, PG, Bobcats (12.5 ppg, 5.5 apg); Julius Hodge, G, Nuggets (13.3 ppg, 5.8 rpg); Martell Webster, G, Blazers (12.7 ppg, 4.3 rpg).

    Breakout Performers

    Travis Outlaw, F, Blazers
    Stats: 18.6 ppg, 6.5 rpg in the Reebok Vegas Summer Shootout
    The skinny: Outlaw looked last summer as though he was going to be one of the few high school-to-pros busts. However, some good playing time toward the end of last season seems to have bolstered his confidence.

    Armed with a nice mid-range jumper, a ton of athleticism and great energy, Outlaw was definitely the surprise player in Vegas. Within days, GM John Nash said he was getting phone calls from teams offering first-round picks for Outlaw. But the Blazers would prefer to move Darius Miles and put Outlaw on the floor more this season.

    Chris Kaman, C, Clippers
    Stats: 20.2 ppg, 8.6 rpg in the Vegas Summer Pro League
    The skinny: If the Clippers are going to make a serious push for the playoffs next season, some of the responsibility is going to rest firmly on Kaman's shoulders. Elton Brand and Corey Maggette will deliver. Shaun Livingston has great promise at the point. And Cuttino Mobley will improve the team's shooting. But they need more help in the middle and Kaman showed in Vegas that he's capable of delivering -- at least against summer leaguers.

    Sebastian Telfair, PG, Blazers
    Stats: 18.7 ppg, 6 apg in the Vegas Summer Pro League
    The skinny: I wasn't a fan of Telfair last summer and still have my reservations about him, but it's tough to deny that he continues to improve. His court vision is excellent and he has a knack for getting to the rim. His jump shot is as ugly as ever, but if he can push the ball and keep turnovers down, he's got a chance to be special.

    Kevin Martin, G, Kings
    Stats: 19.4 ppg, 4.8 rpg on 47 percent shooting
    The skinny: The Kings have spent the summer (and another draft pick on Francisco Garcia) trying to find a replacement for Cuttino Mobley this summer. After Martin's excellent summer league performance, have they found him?

    Martin was also awesome last summer, but he didn't score with this efficiency or with this accuracy (41 percent) from 3-point country. Though his relative lack of strength still makes him a defensive liability, he's an awesome scorer.

    Lonny Baxter, F/C, Rockets
    Stats: 21 ppg, 6.2 rpg on 59 percent shooting in the Minnesota Summer League
    The skinny: Baxter's another summer league warrior who never quite gets the minutes he needs to produce in the NBA. The Rockets love his ability to score around the basket, but with Stromile Swift set to join the team this fall, will Baxter ever catch a break?

    SLEEPER: Nikoloz Tskitishvili, F, Timberwolves
    Stats: 13.5 ppg, 5.5 rpg in the Minnesota Summer League
    The skinny: Skita was awesome in the first game, scoring 25 points, grabbing 10 rebounds, and shooting 4-for-5 from 3-point land, all in 17 minutes. Unfortunately, he broke his hand nine minutes into the next game and missed the rest of the summer league.

    But his performance was impressive enough that the Wolves and Skita agreed to a free-agent contract late Thursday night. Still, before the Dirk comparisons begin again, it's important to point out that Skita put on a show in Vegas last year as well, leading all scorers with 25.7 ppg and shooting lights out from behind the 3-point line.

    Honorable Mention: Dwight Howard, PF, Magic (19 ppg, 7.5 rpg); J.R. Smith, SG, Hornets (20.6 ppg); Tony Allen, G, Celtics (16.8 ppg); David Harrison, C, Pacers (14.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg); Luke Jackson, G/F, Cavs (11.5 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 4 apg); Matt Carroll, G/F, Bobcats (15.4 ppg); Britton Johnsen, F, Spurs (15.7 ppg, 8.7 rpg); Dion Glover, G, Rockets (18.8 ppg, 5.8 rpg); Josh Powell, F, Mavs (11.2 ppg, 9.8 rpg); Leandro Barbosa, G, Suns (18 ppg); Olumide Oyedeji, PF, Cavs (9.6 ppg, 7 rpg); Maciej Lampe, C, Hornets (11.7 ppg, 7.2 rpg); Andris Biedrins, C, Warriors (7.2 ppg, 6.8 rpg).

    Summer Duds

    Marvin Williams, F, Hawks
    Stats: 7.8 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 28 percent shooting in the Rocky Mountain Revue
    The skinny: Williams has been, in a word, awful. That doesn't mean much for his long-term future. As we've said before, the summer league isn't the most accurate predictor of what a player will or won't do in the season.

    But scouts claim that Williams looks tight and often lost on both ends of the floor. That can't be what the Hawks were hoping for from the guy that should be their franchise player.

    I still believe that Williams will end up being the best player in the draft. But he isn't off to a great start.

    Al Jefferson, PF, Celtics
    Stats: 7.5 ppg, 6 rpg in the Vegas Summer League
    The skinny: Jefferson's great summer league performance last season coupled with flashes of brilliance during the season had Celtics fans already clearing out a spot for Jefferson in Springfield. He definitely didn't take another step forward in Vegas. He shot just 44 percent from the field and never did much to impact the games. That's what the Celtics expected from Jefferson last summer, not this one.

    Darko Milicic, PF/C, Pistons
    Stats: 9.8 ppg, 5.8 rpg on 36 percent shooting in the Vegas Summer League
    The skinny: The excuses are about to stop. With Larry Brown out in Detroit, it's now time for Darko to respond.

    We can talk all we want to about rust (he hasn't played in two years) and conditioning (it's tough to keep in shape when you're the towel boy), but the Pistons had to be disappointed in what appeared to be an indifferent effort by Milicic.

    The rust will come off with playing time and the conditioning will improve. But what happened to the aggressive play that convinced the Pistons that Darko was not your typical Euro softie? Darko had flashes when he looked very good, but much of the time he just didn't look like he cared.

    That had better change or Flip Saunders will put him on the same seat on the bench that Larry did.

    Jonathan Bender, F, Pacers
    Stats: 8 ppg, 5 rpg on 25 percent shooting in the Minnesota Summer League
    The skinny: Who else is sick of hearing about how awesome Bender's potential is and how great he looks in practice?

    He's always hurt and extremely inconsistent when he is healthy enough to play. He played exactly one lackluster game for the Pacers in Minnesota and his body language was awful. He acted like he didn't want to be there, according to numerous scouts in the building.

    Kirk Snyder, G, Jazz
    Stats: 6 ppg, 1 rebound on 33 percent shooting in the Rocky Mountain Revue
    The skinny: With only one season under his belt, it's too early to call Snyder a bust. But if he keeps playing the way he has in Salt Lake, a monumental bust is exactly what he's going to be.
  3. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

    Dec 4, 2003
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