I like Wallace the player. I however don't like his durability. If he could be acquired without giving up too much, I'd be happy. I'm not sure if I'd want to give up what he's probably perceived to be worth though simply due to the injury issues.
Yeah. I know. I never said otherwise. Your statement could be construed as a copout though and I want to clarify. "Nobody stops the stars". True. "Nobody stops the stars, so don't bother trying so hard to do it." False. I have already pointed out that most championship caliber teams have a quality wing stopper on their roster. You don't "stop" the star wing. You make things hard on them. Without a quality defender to make them work, even double teaming a star if mostly ineffective. The star has to be funneled into the defensive scheme. Sometimes in a series, one bad game by the star is all you need. Sometimes lowering their effeciency a bit is all you need. Sometimes forcing the star to into too much solo offense is all you need. In order to do those things you need one of the better defenders on your side. Not a "good enough" defender because they are homegrown on your roster, or because they are "improving every year" like Webster. They must be one of the top defenders in the NBA. We currently have no one on the roster even close. Maybe. Batum is a prospect and hasn't proven anything yet. Until he proves to be an excellent and consistent defender we won't know.
Maybe. Many of us have set similar lofty goals for guys like Telfair, Jack, Webster, Outlaw and Qyntel Woods in the past. (Not just as defensive stoppers--I mean we saw glimpses of talent and extrapolated from there that they would be key parts of our future.) Which was fine back then, because we sucked and we had to gamble that if we had enough youngsters, eventually some of them would pay out. But that's the thinking of a lottery team. We have to get out of that mindset now. When you are trying to make a push into the second round of the playoffs, you don't hold up the show because you expect a youngster to eventually fill today's need. You go out and fill that hole now if you can, and if the youngster eventually fills that spot you adapt then. If Batum turns out to be as good as I hope, a guy like Wallace will be easy to trade in two years. Or we trade Batum. Or we trade Outlaw or Webster or Fernandez or whomever to balance out the roster. The one thing we don't do is stand pat because we think in two years our problem will be solved. Young, talented players are too easy to move, and too many things can change between now and then, for us to wait on a promising young guy like Batum.
It's not like you're trading for an aging superstar. You're trading for a great defender and scorer who's not in his prime yet. The price will be high.
I am not saying that we should not trade for Wallace if he comes cheap enough - but I am not sold on the idea that he is a huge defensive upgrade given his injury history and the number of games he misses each year... This team is going to do some kind of talent consolidation sooner or later (sooner, given the cap-space window and Raef's contract - it is going to happen this year or before next year's trade deadline because of this issue - I just question if losing one of the two guys that have a real chance to be stars in the league (Rudy / Bayless) and as such be real bargaining chips down the line if they do not fit with the core (more an issue or possibility with Bayless than Rudy, IMHO). Personally, I would hate to lose either Bayless or Rudy for Wallace - I just question his real worth given the injury concerns. In 7 years in the league he had only 2 years where he played 70 or more games (70 and 72, to be specific). I am glad that it is my job to make these decisions...
Well, since my original post never had the Blazers sending out Rudy or Bayless, I don't really know what your argument is. I will restate the trade proposal: Raef and Frye for Wallace and Carroll
I think most ANY Blazer fan would do Frye/Raef for Wallace and a contract to match. But it would probably have to be somethin' like... Raef, Frye, Bayless/Outlaw, 1st for Wallace and a bad contract... at least.
You are right. I am sorry. Minstrel suggested Rudy or Bayless - but it was for Granger, not Wallace. I somehow got it confused now that I am re-reading the thread. Carry on the good work... I would hate to lose Frye - but it sure is worth it for Wallace.
That's an interesting point I hadn't considered. It starts making Frye + Raef seem a little more reasonable from Charlotte's perspective. Wallace is owed $9.5 mil/year for the next 5 years. That's a fair contract if he stays healthy, but it's a little risky because history says he won't.
Portland, with a deeper bench, can perhaps afford to moderate his minutes. At least during the regular season. Then let it fly in the playoffs. It would be kindof annoying to have Oden, Roy, Aldridge and now Wallace all as players who you maybe hold your breath when they get knocked to the floor...but the talent level is breath-taking.
I don't think so. Add a 1st, sure. But not Bayless or Outlaw unless they send something back that isn't stinky. Wallace has played 70, 55, 70, & 62 games the last 4 seasons. Not real durable. And he is owed $50 mil from a franchise that can no longer afford to pay it. They HAVE to dump the contract of either Richardson, Okafor or Wallace. It really doesn't matter. Portland is in the driver's seat. They don't have to make a move. Wallace isn't perfect with his durability questions and lack of a 3 pt shot. If Charlotte won't give us a sweat deal - fine. No deal then. They can try to find another team who will give them instant savings this season of millions of dollars....... oh, oooops, there is no other team that can and will do that. Only Memphis and Oklahoma have cap space to make lopsided deal, and Memphis won't take on salary. Oklahoma is the only possible, savings limited to Charlotte limited to appx $5 mil, though they aren't in a strong cash flow position either, and already have Durant and Green at the SF spot. Guess Robert Johnson will have to sell some assets (at fire sale prices) to cover for the millions in red ink that the Bobcats are generating.
I love how everyone wants to throw Martell under the bus the second they think a middle-tier SF is on the market. Don't you people realize that Webster is only 21 years old, and has improved every year he's been in the league so far? He's a far better defender than given credit for, he moves well without the ball, his shot is one of the sweetest and purest in the league, and as far as his mental issues in the past, put yourself in a 19-20 year old's shoes and try to shoulder the expectations that were weighed on this kid. He has the skills and the potential to be a top-5 SG/SF in this league, and paired with Oden, Roy, Aldridge, and whomever settles out to be the PG of the near future, his success is almost guaranteed. I don't understand the hate.
I wouldn't call it "hate". I'm sure he is a perfectly nice young man. I'm sure his dog loves him and his grandmother thinks he's handsome. None of which changes the fact that he is an alarmingly average player who was drafted at least 15 spots too high. This is not Jermaine part II. Webster has been given every chance to prove himself - and what he has proven is that he is a useful, but replaceable, player. He is good enough to bounce around the league for the next 10 years and make a nice living....but he will never be a key player on a good team.
I think the point is that Portland isn't under the gun to make a trade. We can wait for the right deal to come along.
Wow. If that's non-hate from you, I don't think I want to hear you talk about a player you dislike. Let me repeat my main points, for the others who are reading this, and not for you, since you've already made up your mind: 21 years old. Three years in the league, beginning his fourth. Has improved in statistics, maturity, defensive ability, and responsibility every year. Did I mention he's 21 years old. Has mad hops, a sweet shooting stroke, and seems to be highly coachable. Throwing Webster under the bus and trading him before he is given an opportunity to realize his nearly limitless potential with the solid pieces of Championship puzzle the Blazers have would be a mistake. In my opinion.
