Forum Game How do you build a contender around Dame in the next couple years?

Yeah it seems beyond unlikely Boston would look at trading Brown. I'm not sure they'd even want to swap him for Dame.

But I guess the idea might be more that an all star on some team will be available that we currently don't expect. We usually have a few switch a year.

Can Cronin gather enough assets to make a push to trade for one and pair with Dame? Neil never could.

 

Yes.... if we stay healthy and Grant buys in.

 

I think Boston is in the same boat that we have been. The Tatum/Brown pairing isn't working. Tatum is still very young. I think you put him with someone like Dame and they have a legit shot at contending. Tatum is better than Brown.

 

You could be right, we will have to see how the year ends for them.

I also think a lot of teams will be scared off from Dame's injury. They probably want to see him healthy and playing as his old self before giving up max value.

Even if Boston offers that trade I just don't see the point for us. Neither Ant or Brown are a #1 option on a contending team, so it seems like it would have all the issues of Boston's current situation, or the DameCJ duo, but without a Dame/Tatum level #1 star player. Brown will be 26 next year which yes isn't old, but athletic wings start to decline before 30 and I don't see how we build a contender around him in 2 years. Probably easier to just keep Dame and hope peak years of his extends past 35 as Chris Paul's did.

 

this is the issue with all the trade-Dame sentiments. Portland's problem during Dame's tenure, or at least since the Aldridge team, is that they had a worthy #1 option, but never a worthy #2 option. They didn't have a 2nd elite talent even though olshey was convinced they did

It's premature at this point to say that Simons is a worthy #2 option. He might in a couple of years, but he also might be a #3. Brown may be a worthy #2. But even if you have a pair of #2 options, it doesn't make up for not having a #1.

so the question is which option is easier to find, a #1 or a #2? If it's a #2, why trade away a #1?

This all sounds like potty talk

 

The problem is that cap space doesn't have the same value to all teams, or in all years. Portland has always struggled to sign FAs, and the pickings this year are slim anyway. As for the trade exceptions, they are only of value to a team willing to use them to take on salary. I'd say there is a better than even chance the Blazers don't take advantage of them.

 

Of course. The question we have to ask is - are the Blazers selling us lies because all they wanted was salary relief or do they mean what they said and they intend to try and use these tools.

I am not going to look for conspiracy theories and going to take the Blazers at their word that they want to try and use these tools - since I have no way of knowing what is really happening behind the scenes - this seems like a reasonable expectation for me. If they succeed or not - well, that's the $64K question, isn't it?

 

We will just have to agree to disagree. I don't think it is a "conspiracy theory" that team front offices BS fans all the time.

 

In this case, they are BS'ing Dame as well - or Dame is BS'ing the fans and wants out. I do not believe it in this case, but, what do I know.

 

I would have 100% agreed with you, but is Dame going to be a #1 next season? We don't know what he's going to look like post-surgery. And if he is a #1, how much longer will he be a #1? 2-3 years?

 

That's why I think Portland is trying to only commit to young players - in case Dame does not seem like the super-star he used to be - they will likely pivot quickly and try to deal him to a contender for picks and prospects.

 

We get a top pick in the draft that is a generational level talent. No other way imo.

 

To be pedantic - That's not both, that's still intent to do what they told us they would, it is just giving them the option to quickly pivot if it does not work - I suspect they mostly went for younger prospects or short-term veterans (Bledsoe) for exactly this reason.

 

but you have been advocating trading him before any of those things are known. Trading him on speculation that is all negative. trading him as if he is either damaged goods or over the hill

let me counter by asking what if he comes back better than he has ever been? Free of abdominal pain. What if he's a great #1 option till he's 35? 3-4 more years of him being a worthy #1? For fucksakes, 9 months ago Dame averaged 34 & 10 in the playoffs. He had a 30.6PER and a TS% of .660. He led all NBA playoff performers in winshare/48 and BPM. That was only 9 months ago and some of you guys are counting him done and want to dump him to turn the team over to Ant. When Ant may never even be 50% of what Dame was in those playoffs

all I see from you guys are Dame trades that would trade away a #1 for maybe, if Portland is lucky, a #2; plus crappy draft picks and a young prospect or two. It makes not one iota of sense to me, especially not till we see what Dame can do after the corrective surgery

there's a real disconnect in the trade-Dame crowd. They are talking about him being injured, being old, being on a huge contract, being over the hill. And they are using those arguments to advocate trading him away. Then they turn right back around and talk about the great return Portland would get for trading him. As if they could evaluate Dame's true value better than 29 other front offices. If Dame is damaged, over-the-hill, and on an albatross contract why would any team offer a godfather package for him? And if he is none of those things, why the fuck would Portland trade him away?

 

My reference was just about intent. They are certainly assets and I believe they are trying to use - but if they fail to use them - it does not change the original intent imho - but we are really just splitting hairs here.

 

Well I like your POV even if I'm more depressed than you.

 

Sadly it's nearly impossible to trade a superstar and get value. It happens, of course, look at Houston and the Harden trade, or more recently Simmons for Harden trade. You're absolutely right that trading Dame makes little sense as we would never get back close to equal value. We have to hope and pray that Ant becomes a two-way star (it's possible and people who say it isn't are just being unnecessarily pessimistic) and that we can trade other assets for another star. I guess if we could bring in a certain #2 at a position of need like Jaylen Brown then I could be talked into trading Ant. I just feel like we'd then have Dame and Brown and little ability to get better. I guess in that case you hope that Nurk becomes a legit #3 and we fill out the rest of the roster with solid defensive role players. I think we would be crazy to trade Dame. I also have a very strong feeling that Ant is going to be an offensive star in this league and possibly even better than that. Ant to me has unlimited potential and I even see a lot of defensive potential based on athleticism, length and lateral quickness. Perhaps under Chauncey's tutelage Ant becomes a two-way player. Hell Dame can defend when he wants to and has buy-in. Perhaps even Dame can learn to play average defense.

So I think if at all possible I would want to build around Dame and Ant and yes I know that means we need good to elite defenders 3-5. It's a long shot and we need a lot to go right, but I think that's true of almost all NBA champions.