If you could only chose one to keep; Dame or Ant

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by SharpesTriumph, Jan 28, 2022.

?

Choose

  1. Dame

    37 vote(s)
    66.1%
  2. Ant

    19 vote(s)
    33.9%
  1. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    comparing ages lacks some important context, IMO. When Dame was the same age as Ant, he had 0 games played in the NBA. Ant has 215. Dame had has one training camp, Ant has had 4. Those are as big, if not bigger factors than age, especially for guards

    as for the 22M difference, it doesn't quite work that way because Dame wouldn't be traded for half his salary, and Portland is over the tax. So, almost all of that 22M would be eaten by the margin between the tax/apron and the salary cap. Blazers wouldn't have 22M in cap-space, nor would they have a 22M player to trade...unless it was Ant. Likely, all they would have would be a full-MLE; but they could have that already with some wise moves by Cronin right now. Also, it's unlikely but it's worth noting that Ant's max at a 112M cap would be over 30M/year

    finally, I remember all the over-blown hype around here about the hot 12 game stretch CJ had at the start of last season. Any realistic appraisal of that streak said it was unsustainable. Well, Ant's 'streak' has lasted just 15 games, and he's had 3 or 4 clunkers in that stretch. In fact, over the last 6 games Ant has scored 115 points on 101 shots while shooting 40.6% on FG's. He's averaged 5.5 assists vs 3.7 turnovers; that's a 1.5 assist/turnover mark.

    In other words, he had a great 9 game stretch; but has followed that with a 6 game stretch where he has averaged 19.2 points, 5.5 assists, 3.7 turnovers while shooting 40.6% on FG's. Those are not good numbers for a #1 option, yet people want to build a team around that? The question is which player is he? The 9 game Ant or the 6 game Ant? And is either worth trading away Dame?
     
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  2. Lanny

    Lanny Original Season Ticket Holder "Mr. Big Shot"

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    Not the first time 18 members have been wrong. Remember Oden? How about Aldridge?
     
  3. Tince

    Tince Well-Known Member

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    I've certainly enjoyed hearing you out and you've made some good points.

    I agree Ant + Salary Relief could be better the Dame, I just think it's the highly risky path with a far more downside and very little upside.
     
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  4. TBpup

    TBpup Writing Team

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    Absolutely there is risk. Sadly, Cowardly Leo Neil would never take any and it cost Dame his best years. Outside of somehow adding Simmons, I don't see a path to be able to add enough talent around Dame to get him to where we all hope he can go. I expect Lillard will come back very strong next year, but unless there are some dramatic changes, not sure that will make a difference in terms of being a contender. And not sure at this point if we have the assets to be able to make those significant changes.
     
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  5. blazerkor

    blazerkor Well-Known Member

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    I think with the fact that Dame's best years were the last two and he was dealing with the injury he just had surgically corrected, it's actually pretty safe to say that Dame's best years are likely going to be the next two that are ahead of him.
     
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  6. damianlillard

    damianlillard Well-Known Member

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    I think anybody that’s saying we should pick ant are not necessarily saying to build around him. Instead build around the guy that we trade dame for. Like Jaylen brown for example. Ant would be a solid #2 option. We still have other players that we can trade for young players for. Plus our very own lottery pick for this year. It would be awesome to really tank for Jabari smith. Have a big 3 of brown, smith, and ant.
     
  7. Strenuus

    Strenuus Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    This was really odd to read given the name of who posted this lmao.
     
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  8. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    I don't see any reason for Boston to trade Brown for Dame. Boston is essentially a .500 team right now. Subtracting Brown, Robert Williams, and Josh Richardson, for example....a trade that makes it legal in terms of salary does not make Boston a better team. And it leaves them with little flexibility. And that's the minimum type of return Portland should accept and it's really not enough

    seems like people expect teams to be lining up to trade for Dame and his contract; and trade a lot. The only teams that would have an interest are teams that would be convinced Dame would put them over the top. Boston doesn't fit.
     
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  9. SharpesTriumph

    SharpesTriumph Well-Known Member

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    So your right, others are wrong, and no discussion is warranted on a discussion board?
     
  10. SharpesTriumph

    SharpesTriumph Well-Known Member

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    Don't necessarily disagree with this.

    But no matter the action with Dame or Ant or trades or not trades, I find it extremely unlikely the Blazers will be a contender.
     
  11. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    well, Simons had that 9 game stretch when he averaged 28.7 points on 50% shooting while averaging 7.2 assists and 2.3 turnovers (3.13 assist/turnover ratio). He averaged 1.61 points/shot. It was during that stretch when this thread was made and people were suggesting trading Dame and building around Ant

    over the last 8 games Simons has averaged 19.2 points on 41% shooting while averaging 4.9 assists and 3.3 turnovers (1.48 assist/turnover ratio). He's averaged 1.14 points shot
     
  12. Haakzilla

    Haakzilla Well-Known Member

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  13. SharpesTriumph

    SharpesTriumph Well-Known Member

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    After the Powell Roco trade this has swung far more in favor of keeping Ant.

    Losing two starters with zero rotational players coming back puts the Blazers much farther away from being able to contend.

    Before you could argue if everyone was healthy the team could've traded a guard for a forward and possibly contended. That is no longer the case.

    The Blazers are at the least multiple trades away of brining in quality starting players in to contend. They have two less assets to do it.

    I don't see any realistic chance of this team building a contender while Lillard is in his prime. Before it was a very difficult door to open with a tiny crack. Now that door is completely shut.

    I don't see why we trade Ant now, it doesn't make sense for a rebuilding team.

    My only question is if we trade Dame for what we can get or have him around for many years of mediocrity as Kobe and Dirk did late in their careers.

    I know what the Blazers plan to do to start next season. But after another year of losing does that plan change?
     
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  14. Strenuus

    Strenuus Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I'll never say to hand the keys of the franchise to someone who has only shown one month of great play. That's just asking for trouble.

    If he has a great SEASON next year, then you can argue it.

    But a month? No. God no. Fuck no. No man. (Someone will get that reference, I won't say the last part for fear of it not being known where it came from lol)
     
  15. illmatic99

    illmatic99 formerly yuyuza1

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    he needs a practice or deep dive film session in the worst way after building up all this game video.

    making so many bad reads and decisions. 3 to 5 ATO ratio is not acceptable, even given the circumstances.

    He hasn't had a good game since Houston.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2022
  16. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    it wasn't even a month. He had 9 great games, a real hot streak. Since that he's had 9 not-so-great games. The type of low shooting efficiency and bad play-making efficiency that people hate from CJ

    19 pts/game on 41% FG's (a poor 1.14 points/shot).....4.8 assists vs 3.4 turnovers. A pretty bad 1.39 assist/turnover ratio for a supposed PG

    hot streaks are a bad gauge of a player. A better gauge is where the player lands after the hot streak. Everybody needs to put the brakes on the idea of trading Dame to turn the team over to Ant
     
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  17. Hoopguru

    Hoopguru Well-Known Member

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    Besides Ant may just want another destination, he's an East Coast dude, that could very well think its not always about money but also where you want to live.
     
  18. MickZagger

    MickZagger Well-Known Member

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    Exactly my thoughts.
     
  19. Strenuus

    Strenuus Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    For. Fucking. Real.

    It's ludicrous.
     
  20. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    I'll add , in Ant's defense I guess, is that unlike CJ, Ant has the type of game where he could significantly increase his FT rate, if he was determined to do so. A .134 FT rate is poor. Dame struggled getting to the line for nearly 20 games. But after he adjusted his current FT rate is .328, not much off his norms. Ant probably can't get that high but he could get to at least .250, especially as he builds some respect from officials
     

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