Elton Brand? Top five PF? Ya right. Lets name 10 PFs that are better than him. Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.</div> The only ones anyone will likely agree on there are KG, Duncan and JO, Jamison isn't even a real PF he's a SF-PF, and if you can use the winning thing on Brand, before the Mavs when last did Jamison have a winning season, and the Warriors weren't even injured like the Clippers. His defense isn't near as good, and he's not close to being as good a reboudner, but he is a better scorer Carlos Boozer, get real, common that's not even sensible to say Boozer is better than Brand, especially since Brand has offense, defense, rebouding is a decent passer, etc Boozer is not a good defender, he's good on the boards and a decent scorer but how does that compare. Karl Malone, maybe three years ago when he was better than all these guys. Rasheed Wallace, give me a break, the guy that can't control himself, hasn't passed 20 ppg, and is a 6'11 F-C who's highest rebounding average in his career was 8.2 rebounds per game, okay. Lamar Odom, as a PF no he's not better, he could be later though, could be the next KG but he's not consistent enough in putting up his numbers, and he's not close to Brand on the defensive end. Chris Webber, if he could still jump, and play more than 50 games. Kenyon Martin, I think we already settled this one in the other 4 pages of this thread, common man this is getting sad when someone is saying Antawn Jamison and Carlos Boozer are better PF's than Brand.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Cap'n Ken:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand? Top five PF? Ya right. Lets name 10 PFs that are better than him. Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.</div> Thank you for making my day
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Cap'n Ken:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand? Top five PF? Ya right. Lets name 10 PFs that are better than him. Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.</div> ^ if you honestly believe Elton is not even a top 10 PF, let alont top 5, you have either never watched him play, or just don't know what the hell you're talking about. og15 summed it up pretty good on why he is better than most of those players you named, and you he is definitely a top 5 PF on my list.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Cap'n Ken:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand? Top five PF? Ya right. Lets name 10 PFs that are better than him. Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.</div> Are we talking about the same sport?? Antwan Jamison???? Antwan Jamison for crying out loud, lol ....
LO? Lamar Odom? Huh???? PF = Power Forward. LO = Small Forward. Different positions. Carlos Boozer isn't even close to Elton Brand. Ya'll really need to actually watch the guy play abit before talking smack. Oh, and learn what positions these players are actually playing.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting westsidecronicl:</div><div class="quote_post">NO WAIT! Scratch dat last post. 1. KG 2. JO 3. Ben Wallace 4. KMART 5. LO</div> Lamar You really jumped on the Heat bandwagon. It's all good though. <u>My list</u> 1. KG 2. JO 3. Ben Wallace 4. Elton Brand 5. KMart
Elton Brand is a top 5 power forward and easily top 10, even though It may look like I think Odom is better than him after my comments in the Heat forum he is better fit to that team, so just in case someone brings that point up again. Elton is a consistant 20 and 10 guy that can block a few shots but again he would be suitted better as a 2nd option. He isn't the type of guy who can lead a team into the playoffs or deep into the playoffs. He has enough talent around him now to make some noise in the west but that hasn't been the case. Yes he is playing for a cursed franchise but they should still be winning more games than they have done the past few seasons. For the people who mentioned Randolph, he needs to learn to defend better and know when to pass the ball out when he gets tripled teamed before he can be put in the same sentence as "top 5 power forward" I expect Amare to be top 5 next year, the kid averaged 25 and 11 in the last two months of the season. And he still has alot to learn about the game. He still needs to develop a jump shot and some post moves but once he learns that WATCH OUT
Not PFs (even if size justifies): Lamar Odom, Rasheed Wallace, Dirk Nowitzki, Jamison Top PFs: 1. DUNCAN (come on people) 2. Garnett (Not really a pure PF) 3. Webber (When healthy) 4. Jermaine O'Neal 5. Ben Wallace (Hasn't played C in two years) 6. Elton Brand (He doesn't even have a PG) Second Tier: Kenyon Martin (no offensive skills) Karl Malone (too old) Pau Gasol (inconsistent) Amare (Give him time) Randolph (No D) Abdur-Rahim (No D) Marcus Camby (injuries keep him down) Antoine Walker
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand? Top five PF? Ya right. Lets name 10 PFs that are better than him. Carlos Boozer, Rasheed Wallace, Antwan Jamison, Jermaine O'Neal, Karl Malone, Lamar Odom, Kevin Garnett, Kenyon Martin, Chris Webber, Tim Duncan, etc. Elton Brand is nowhere near these guys.</div> Boozer? No. Simple. Jamison? No. He isn't even a PF. Karl Malone? No, a few years back, yes, today, no. Odom? No. He really isn't a PF either. Because Miami is undersized he plays PF, but he is a wing, SF. Webber? Webber is never healthy. He has really messed up the Kings flow in the playoffs also. Martin? No. Kidd makes him look real good, when in fact, he is not. Of course Elton Brand is a top 10 PF easily, and a top 5 PF. Just because he is on a horrible team where people care about money, more than winning, doesn't mean he isn't a great player. He goes and gets 20 and 10 every night. He can put the ball in the basket, rebound, and play defense. If he was on a team like Dallas, then everyone would be all over him. A year ago, no one would say Jamison is better than Brand. But since Jamison got traded, all of a sudden his game improved? No, it doesn't work that way. 1. Tim Duncan 2. Kevin Garnett 3. Jermaine O'Neal 4. Elton Brand 5. Ben Wallace 6. Kenyon Martin
Well at least everyone agrees that post was a little of base, I mean Antawn Jamison? Common, of all guys, at least if you were saying Amare or Randolph it'd be better but Jamison wow. A lot of people neglected Tim Duncan, I'm not sure if they forgot or they're considering him a center? <div class="quote_poster">Quoting "westsidecronicl":</div><div class="quote_post">1. KG 2. JO 3. KMART 4. LO 5. Brand</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quoting "30 standing ver":</div><div class="quote_post">My list 1. KG 2. JO 3. Ben Wallace 4. Elton Brand 5. KMart</div> Duncan?? I'm not a fan of Duncan but the guy's got skills, unless you guy consider him a Center that's just playing PF. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting "SportsFiend":</div><div class="quote_post">Second Tier: Kenyon Martin (no offensive skills) Karl Malone (too old) Pau Gasol (inconsistent) Amare (Give him time) Randolph (No D) Abdur-Rahim (No D) Marcus Camby (injuries keep him down) Antoine Walker</div> Isn't Camby a center, you're right though Ben Wallace hasn't played C in a while, and its so true that Brand doesn't even have a PG. Ben Wallace yea I'd put up their too, his defense and rebounding gives him a lot of props but he's the least capable of carrying a team, he needs to be on an established team and but their as a defensive anchor, which is what would bring him down, but that's much better, none of this Antawn Jamison thing. Second Tier Add: Boozer
tim duncan, kevin garnett, jermaine o'neal, rasheed wallace, c webb, k mart, carlos boozer, Dirk, randolph, abdur-rahim. no way
Ok, to everyone that even mentioned the name Lamar Odom in this thread, ya'll really jumped the Heat bandwagon. Lamar is NOT a PF. He was an SF in Clippers and will always be an SF. He played a little PF in the Heat because they were undersized but other than that, he's NOT a PF. I don't know if I agree with some of the posts ranking Big Ben above Elton. Sure Ben is one of the best defensive players in the game and I'm not taking anything away from him, but it is a lot easier to just focus your game on just defense. Ok he showed some offense in this series but in the end, it's not nearly as good as Brand. So the comparison here: Ben = Super D + Non-existant or crappy offense at best. Elton = Super offense + VERY decent defense (ranks #10 in blocks per game) You know what, Elton averages around 14 shots attempt per game and he gets fouled at least half of those shots. Those of you that have seen his game knows alot of his shots are off putbacks too (after all, the guy averages 4 offensive boards per game). What's interesting is whether Elton would have a bigger impact IF he's actually the team's leading FGA guy. Quentin is actually the team's leading FGA guy at 16, Brand is at 14 FGA and Cmag is just under 14 FGAs. Now imagine what Elton would average if he has an actual PG, the Clippers ACTUALLY goes to him as their main man, gets 18 shots per game, just like Jermaine O'Neal... Assuming he makes only 2 more baskets, he'd be averaging around 25 and 10. I don't get the coaches sometime... or maybe it's just the Clippers that's cursed.. but Elton in my mind has not been the go to guy. So, keep that in mind when ya'll are comparing him with JO.
^Have you ever asked why Elton is not given more shots on offence as compared to JO? You say that a lot of his scoring comes from his offensive rebounds so there must be some reason he is not given the ball in the post or is not a focal point in the offense right?? You watch the games, please enlighten as to why this is. You would think that the Clippers are smart enough to have a guy shooting 50% from the field and averaging 20 points shooting the ball more no? Maybe you answered your own question by saying that he grabs offensive boards and scores the bulk of his points there. Can you tell me that Brand has a better post game than JO? Looking at how he gets the bulk of his points it does not seem that way at all. Maybe if Brand had JO's offensive game (and height) he would probably be more involved in the offence rather than relying on offensive putbacks to score a bulk of his points. It's just a theory <font size="1">(because I don't watch Brand on a regular basis)</font> but it's actually quite logical.
He doesn't get the ball because Quentin Richardson wants to shoot lol, I don't think he gets a put back on all 4 offensive boards a game he gets, and even if he did that would only be 4 shots attempted, the other 10 shots have to come from somwhere don't they? The guys on the team aren't smart that's why, Brand should get about 16-18 shots, Maggette 16 shots, and Q-Rich about 12-14, but ah well it happens.
Most positive scenario: The Clippers want to develop the other young guys such as Q, Cmag and Kaman so they go to them a little more often than they should. Most negative and likely scenario..: The Clippers as an organization doesn't care about winning. Every player out there are fighting for contracts so they can get a good deal out of there when they're FAs. Elton Brand is too nice of a man to be selfish and take more shots than the coach tells him to. He could easily average more than a mere 14 shot attempts per game but he's not a selfish guy like that.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting SportsFiend:</div><div class="quote_post">Not PFs (even if size justifies): Lamar Odom, Rasheed Wallace, Dirk Nowitzki, Jamison Top PFs: 1. DUNCAN (come on people) 2. Garnett (Not really a pure PF) 3. Webber (When healthy) 4. Jermaine O'Neal 5. Ben Wallace (Hasn't played C in two years) 6. Elton Brand (He doesn't even have a PG) Second Tier: Kenyon Martin (no offensive skills) Karl Malone (too old) Pau Gasol (inconsistent) Amare (Give him time) Randolph (No D) Abdur-Rahim (No D) Marcus Camby (injuries keep him down) Antoine Walker</div> Put Pau Gasol on a team with Jason Kidd or any team where he gets as many shots and minutes as martin and he'd have much MUCH better numbers than Kmart. Kenyon is an overrated player and NO coach or executive would take him over elton brand if they had the choice. not ONE
