Is Kobe the Best Player in the NBA

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 25 2007, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You don't even watch Dirk I bet. He is killing everyone this year by taking over 4th quarters at will. He is much better than last year even. Shooting at a career high 50.2% from the field. Nothing statistically except point total favor Kobe and Dirk's team is 46-9. Much better than what Kobe's team is right now. It's not even close. Kobe wasn't even the best player on that 3 championships team. It was Shaq. Kobe also couldn't lead his team to the playoffs the first year Shaq left. Talk about how much Shaq helped Kobe's game.</div>Are you f*cking kidding me? Kobe was out 20+ games, Lamar Odom was out 15+ so you basically just had Caron Butler and Chucky Atkins carrying the load on their own. That year was a disaster...Rudy T left the team mid season and left assistant coach Frank Hamlen to coach the rest of the season...you can't blame Kobe for that. Of course Shaq was the best player in those championships. At least he was for the first two. Shaq was in his prime pretty much and made MVP in 2000. That was Shaq then....now Kobe is not only the best on the team but the best in the league. You can't compare records of the Mavs and Lakers...cmon. The Mavs have ALOT better team and depth while the Lakers have had a tremendous amount more of injuries this season.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LakersFan247 @ Feb 25 2007, 08:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Are you f*cking kidding me? Kobe was out 20+ games, Lamar Odom was out 15+ so you basically just had Caron Butler and Chucky Atkins carrying the load on their own. That year was a disaster...Rudy T left the team mid season and left assistant coach Frank Hamlen to coach the rest of the season...you can't blame Kobe for that. Of course Shaq was the best player in those championships. At least he was for the first two. Shaq was in his prime pretty much and made MVP in 2000. That was Shaq then....now Kobe is not only the best on the team but the best in the league. You can't compare records of the Mavs and Lakers...cmon. The Mavs have ALOT better team and depth while the Lakers have had a tremendous amount more of injuries this season.</div>What I've seen of Kobe and what I hear on this board are 2 completely different things. To me he is a glorified T-Mac. The difference is T-Mac never had a big man like Shaq. Yao has just started becoming dominant. I know it was just a skills competition but that shows that Kobe's dribbling skills are not at the level of Wade. Obviously the mavs have a lot better team than the lakers as lakers are falling apart right now. Once again Kobe has not been able to take the lakers to elite status though I heard you say that they were earlier in the season so that shows your homerism right there.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 25 2007, 12:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What I've seen of Kobe and what I hear on this board are 2 completely different things. To me he is a glorified T-Mac. The difference is T-Mac never had a big man like Shaq. Yao has just started becoming dominant. I know it was just a skills competition but that shows that Kobe's dribbling skills are not at the level of Wade. Obviously the mavs have a lot better team than the lakers as lakers are falling apart right now. Once again Kobe has not been able to take the lakers to elite status though I heard you say that they were earlier in the season so that shows your homerism right there.</div>You can't put all this blame on Kobe...it's not his fault. Injuries have been dramatic on this team this season. The Lakers ARE an Elite team when fully healthy and clicking. How does that show homerism? You show "homerism" by actually thinking Dirk is better than Kobe. Skills Challenge doesn't prove anything and Wade does have better handling but Kobe is still a very good ballhandler and alot better than most players in the game. I wouldn't call 32-25 falling apart...if you want to talk about falling apart look at the Heat.You probably would like to watch this... http://youtube.com/watch?v=x3dRxFqayAo

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 25 2007, 12:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kobe sure owned Dirk in the finals last year. Oh wait the lakers lost in first round.</div>Oh come on now. Wade was the one owning Dirk but we all know Kobe is better then Wade so that just proves you wrong. :happy0144:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tHe_pEsTiLeNcE @ Feb 25 2007, 03:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And Kobe admitted Dirk is the best. So did Nash.</div>No he didn't. He said dirk was the mvp

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LakersFan247 @ Feb 25 2007, 03:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>The Lakers ARE an Elite team when fully healthy and clicking.</div>I stopped reading right there.Any team in the NBA are an "Elite team" when "fully healthy and clicking."

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MaRdYC26 @ Feb 25 2007, 01:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I stopped reading right there.Any team in the NBA are an "Elite team" when "fully healthy and clicking." </div>I stopped reading all your posts about a month ago when I realized how biased and ignorant you truly are. Not all teams are elite when fully healthy and clicking because not all teams have talent. The Lakers have been plagued by injury this season far more than I have seen in years and when they have the main pieces out there on the court and they are clicking like last game against the Celtics for example they are very hard to beat.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ballerman2112 @ Feb 25 2007, 12:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And how many guys does he come across that can shut him down? I can think of about.....zero. Bruce Bowen is the best perimeter defender in the NBA, and Dirk torches him everytime he plays him. I think above you said something about T-Mac playing good defense agaisnt him, but he isnt going to do good agaisnt him everytime. Dirk causes so many matchup problems agaisnt the oppostion that it is ridiculous. If he has a big man on him, he will either take him out to the 3 point line (where he is very good), or he can up fake him and go right or left AND finish very well. If he has a small man guarding him, he just shoots over him. And why question him if he does it so well and so efficiently?</div>Bowen is far from the best perimeter defender in the league anymore. He has been torched MANY times this season, and it isn't like it's a huge accomplishment anymore to drop 30 or more on him. Not to mention he is half a foot shorter than Dirk. It;s like asking Jason kidd to guard LeBron James.Exactly, everything he does is restricted to 10ft and out, and a jumpshot. When that jumpshot isn't falling or he has someone that actually matches up with him (both rare, but still happens) then he has trouble scoring. No matter who is on Kobe or if he is having a bad night jumpshooting, he can still score. He can post up from 5ft and out, can drive to the basket, and can shoot from anywhere. As great as Dirk is, and as great of a shooter he is....that is just what he is, a jumpshooter. He has become much more well rounded since coming into the league, and has many pet moves to get himself free, but he is still not nearly as well rounded as Kobe as a scorer (for the record, I do think he is the best scoring big man in the league). mavsfan:<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Dirk can take players to the 3 point line, shoot the midrange shot over smaller players, and His most used move now is that midrange shot with his back to the basket, has an amazing shooting ability.</div>Bingo. Everything he does as a scorer relies on his jumpshot 10ft and out. Yes, he has many ways to get off that jumpshot, but he is stillf airly one dimensional that he is restricted to just doing that. He cannot post up a bigger player in the low post, rarely (if ever) drives past defender for a dunk, and he is just overall a player that does his scoring 10ft and out. He is not nearly as well rounded as Kobe as a scorer, and while his season averages are nice, they tell half the story.

 

Oh God Mavsfan... You have no right to call anyone an ignornt homer ever again.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (iversonfan268 @ Feb 25 2007, 10:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Oh God Mavsfan... You have no right to call anyone an ignornt homer ever again.</div>Brilliant post there. Is this one of melo061's aliases or something?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 25 2007, 04:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kobe sure owned Dirk in the finals last year. Oh wait the lakers lost in first round.</div>Kobe sure had the talent to get to the finals right? Kobe and the Lakers almost took down one of teh best teams in the NBA last year, and he is leading a team right now to a pretty good record as well. If Kobe had the supporting cast that Dirk has, his team would be doing very well also. Don't go by team achievments because Dirk has SO much more help than Kobe does....Dirk is a hell of a player, and I think he is top 5 in the league, but he doesn't have the ability to take over games like Kobe does. Kobe is a better scorer all around, he is a better defender, a better passer, and he has proven to be a hell of a leader, and has the killer instinct that alot of players in the league dont have. He is just the most clutch and explosove player in the league. I like both Dallas and the Lakers, and I have to go with Kobe being the better player...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 25 2007, 03:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Brilliant post there. Is this one of melo061's aliases or something?</div>You think that IversonFan, a VIP with 3,000+ posts is an alias? He is absolutely right calling you a homer. Everyone can see it but you.

 

Well what else can I post? Nitro basically summed everything up in his 1st post. I don't see how any of the evidence you have used makes Dirk better. You say he improved his defense, but it's still mediocre, you say his scoring is so effecient this season but he hasn't had to caryr an offense like Kobe has. You also use thas as a reason why you feel he's a better scorer when Kobe has the most versatile scoring game in the league. You say Dirk is better because his team is doing better than Kobe's even though you guys have the most complete team in the league compared to Kobe who has one of the worst supporting casts in the league. Your arguements are horrible.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Feb 25 2007, 05:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Bowen is far from the best perimeter defender in the league anymore. He has been torched MANY times this season, and it isn't like it's a huge accomplishment anymore to drop 30 or more on him. Not to mention he is half a foot shorter than Dirk. It;s like asking Jason kidd to guard LeBron James.Exactly, everything he does is restricted to 10ft and out, and a jumpshot. When that jumpshot isn't falling or he has someone that actually matches up with him (both rare, but still happens) then he has trouble scoring. No matter who is on Kobe or if he is having a bad night jumpshooting, he can still score. He can post up from 5ft and out, can drive to the basket, and can shoot from anywhere. As great as Dirk is, and as great of a shooter he is....that is just what he is, a jumpshooter. He has become much more well rounded since coming into the league, and has many pet moves to get himself free, but he is still not nearly as well rounded as Kobe as a scorer (for the record, I do think he is the best scoring big man in the league). mavsfan:Bingo. Everything he does as a scorer relies on his jumpshot 10ft and out. Yes, he has many ways to get off that jumpshot, but he is stillf airly one dimensional that he is restricted to just doing that. He cannot post up a bigger player in the low post, rarely (if ever) drives past defender for a dunk, and he is just overall a player that does his scoring 10ft and out. He is not nearly as well rounded as Kobe as a scorer, and while his season averages are nice, they tell half the story.</div>No, he is not restricted from just outside of ten feet. He can take bigger guys to the basket, and he can take smaller guys to the basket. What you are saying isnt true at all. And even if he only had a game outside of 10 feet, what is so bad about it? Him and Carmelo have the best mid ranges in the game, AND he can go out to the 3 point line. It doesn't matter if he isnt an inside player if he is amazing from 10 feet and out.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (iversonfan268 @ Feb 25 2007, 04:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Well what else can I post? Nitro basically summed everything up in his 1st post. I don't see how any of the evidence you have used makes Dirk better. You say he improved his defense, but it's still mediocre, you say his scoring is so effecient this season but he hasn't had to caryr an offense like Kobe has. You also use thas as a reason why you feel he's a better scorer when Kobe has the most versatile scoring game in the league. You say Dirk is better because his team is doing better than Kobe's even though you guys have the most complete team in the league compared to Kobe who has one of the worst supporting casts in the league. Your arguements are horrible.</div>Bingo. Which is why he wouldn't reply when I shut him up earlier in the thread.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ballerman2112 @ Feb 25 2007, 04:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>No, he is not restricted from just outside of ten feet. He can take bigger guys to the basket, and he can take smaller guys to the basket. What you are saying isnt true at all. And even if he only had a game outside of 10 feet, what is so bad about it? Him and Carmelo have the best mid ranges in the game, AND he can go out to the 3 point line. It doesn't matter if he isnt an inside player if he is amazing from 10 feet and out.</div>I don't think he's necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but just that Dirk's offensive agme isn't better because of that.

 

I never said that Dirks offensive game was better what so ever. If he actually read my post, he would know that. Instead, he just likes to be arguementative. I just said that Dirk's offensive game wasn't limited just to him shooting, and he thinks it is.

 

I don't even understand why people continue to respond to mavsfan's posts... he doesn't know anything outside "Dirk and the Mavs."

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigMo763 @ Feb 25 2007, 08:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't even understand why people continue to respond to mavsfan's posts... he doesn't know anything outside "Dirk and the Mavs."</div><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Feb 24 2007, 11:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm not trying to be a homer here</div> :happy0144: Scoring: KobeDefense: KobeClutch: KobeLeader: KobeAs you can see, Kobe > Dirk in practically everything.Kobe can score from anywhere on the court, 3 point, post up, driving it or from the line. Kobe always has a way to score, even in his off shooting nights he finds ways to score because of how good of a player he is. Quote from your own Jason Terry from the link Lakersfan posted"3 pointers from half way to half court, any which way you want it"Now from Dirk:"That's why he is the best scorer in this game right now"Defense wise I will give Dirk the fact he is improving but even Kobe who has had his problems is still a good defender. Clutch I don't think there is any question who has this, Kobe is top 3 when it comes to clutch, no arguing here.Really isn't much more to say here.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ballerman2112 @ Feb 25 2007, 07:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>No, he is not restricted from just outside of ten feet. He can take bigger guys to the basket, and he can take smaller guys to the basket. What you are saying isnt true at all. And even if he only had a game outside of 10 feet, what is so bad about it? Him and Carmelo have the best mid ranges in the game, AND he can go out to the 3 point line. It doesn't matter if he isnt an inside player if he is amazing from 10 feet and out.</div>He RARELY goes to the basket and finishes with a layup or dunk. He has no low post game, and basically is just a player who plays his game 10ft and out. There is nothing wrong with it (especially since he has been amazing past few seasons with this), but we are comparing him to a guy who can do everything as a scorer, and do everything very well. If Dirk is matched up with someone who is tall and long enough to actually contest his jumper, he has no other options but to force up tough jumpers and his %'s go way down. Yes, it is very rare you will get a defender that matches up well with Dirk, but those kinds of players are out there. With Kobe, you can put a smaller player, taller player, faster player, slower players, or whoever you want on him....he can score anyway he wants to. In low post due to his amazing footwork, slashing because of his great athleticism, he can pullup or take a fadeaway over anyone, he has so many moves to get free for a clean look it's not even funny, he can run the break, and he can shoot from anywhere on the floor. He is dangerous in every aspect as a scorer, Dirk is dangerous just as a jumpshooter (a damn good one at that). For the record, outside of Kobe, there are only a few select scorers that don't really have any true weaknesses as scorers, and can do pretty much everything pretty well (T-Mac and AI come to mind). Dirk is an amazing scorer, but he is not as well rounded as Kobe, and IMO his game is still basically 10ft and out.