Isiah has assembled the worst basketball team in the planet

I don't remember watching a team play basketball this bad. What I mean is, every little thing in basketball you can imagine, every fundamental thing possible that come in your mind...Knicks totally fail at.

The passing is terrible, no one hits his man on a screen, guys try passing in mid air, passing without knowing where teammates are, throwing the ball out of bounds. Curry is so bad at holding onto the ball, and forcing offensive fouls, its really become the reason why I change the channel.

The shot selection is terrible, especially with Francis now on this team. He doesn't look for a pick and roll, he doesn't check to see if anyone has an open lane or is open, he just goes freestyle, does a hopeless cross over move and misses the shot or lay up.

I've been defending Marbury all year, but right now, he isn't playng smart basketball either. Its probably because of this indentity issue he's facing with Brown. Marbury doesn't look like what he wants to do out there. He doesn't know when to score or pass for Brown. When you see Brown call a play to Marbury 90% of the time the execution of the play fails, and the only way we score is either from an offensive rebound or if we get fouled.

The ball movement is terrible, like I stated before. But whats WORST than all of the things I stated is the defense.

I never seen a center in my life time that doesn't look to contest shots than Ed Curry. He doesn't even throw his arm up, he just jumps and fouls the guy in desperation, it could be a guard like Earl Boykins or a scrub like Blount, Curry 98% of the time will fail defensively for this team. He doesn't box out either, which is a big part of defense, he probably boxes out 1 out of 5 chances he has to, and majority of his rebounds come from when an opponent bricks a shot, and he's the only guy there for a rebound.

Mailk Rose has owned the crown as the worst offensive player in the NBA, I don't understand why Larry Brown involves him in the offensive plays, Larry should use him like Kirilenko, off the ball, and coming into the play when something breaks down. Whenever the ball is in Rose's hands, something negative is bound to happend.

Rose is a terrible defender, its no longer 2003, he's too short, too slow to defend anyone in the NBA...I can't stand having this guy on the roster for another 2 years.

Taylor disgust me, he's a true ball hog/chucker, and once the ball goes in hands, like Curry, the ball movement stop, and turns it over or misses the shot.

Which is why, our guards and swing men, Richardson, Crawford, Marbury, and Francis scoring have been so down, they get no looks, the ball movement is dead, and the turnovers, it takes away shot attempts.



Do you guys miss this Knicks team?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=231107018

PG Ward/Eisley
SG Houston/Anderson
SF Van Horn/Anderson
PF Thomas/Harrington
C Mutumbo/Doleac




I can't respect anyone who supports Isiah Thomas, they're totally dehumanized to me, truely.

 

Yup the Knicks suck but what can you do? I said it way from the beginning after the teams flaws were exposed last season that this team would be the worst team in franchise history and I was right. There's nothing for me to add on to what you said since you were right on target on nearly everything. The Knicks team you just mentioned would not only make the playoffs under Larry Brown but would smack our current team which is pretty sad when you think about it.



Anyway I think Isiah Thomas should be fired.

 

Yes, you guys do suck... badly.

I'm not a Knick fan anymore.

Go Heat!

 

my personal thanks to james dolan for spending max contracts on houston, crawford and mle's on jerome james and vin baker.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">Yes, you guys do suck... badly.

I'm not a Knick fan anymore.

Go Heat!</div>

 

From a Rockets fan, I truly sympathize with you for having to watch Francis and Mo Taylor night in and night out.

 

I don't know about the worst team ever. I think that a lot of the Knicks' problems boil down to coaching. The talent is definitely there. You can't tell me that with Marbury, Francis, Rose and Curry in your starting five that it's about a lack of talent. At some point you have to point the finger at Larry Brown - even though the media just loves this guy.

I had an opportunity to go see the Knicks when they came to play Orlando and they're a really intriguing team to watch. The main problems that I noticed right away were the offense being very bland and players looking lost on that end of the floor. It doesn't help that only one of the starters saw consistent time on the floor either. Every time you turn around it's a different squad out there. I would imagine it's hard to build chemistry when your lineup is changing almost completely every couple minutes. Steve Francis saw 11 minutes in the first quarter and then sat the rest of the game.

Then there's the turnovers. Just sloppy handling of the ball coming up the court and sloppy, lazy passing. It doesn't help matters when all the players aren't really running sets on offense, just just clumping together near the top of the key. That's coaching, not talent issues.

Then on the other end you have mediocre defenders and Eddy Curry looking exhausted all the time and committing stupid fouls. So yeah, it's coaching in my opinion. You put a good coach with this team and they could get in the playoffs - a low seed, but still the playoffs.

 

Even the Looney Tunes team from Space Jam can kill that team (even without Bill Murray)

 

I don't think Isiah should take all the blame that the Knicks aren't as good as they were because:

1. Larry Brown should take more blame. I think he is the most overrated coach. See how the Pistons and 76ers improved so much after he left? Brown keeps on trying to change his star players to take on different roles (AI and now Stephon) Instead of changing superstars into garbage players, Larry should instead change his own coaching method.

2. Isiah has proven that without depending on Larry, he is an excellent GM. He drafted Frye (awesome player), Nate Robinson (ball-dominant but could develop into a good shooter), and before Larry came, he had a pretty good Knicks team.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting spyware:</div><div class="quote_post">Even the Looney Tunes team from Space Jam can kill that team (even without Bill Murray)</div>
Dude, Bill Murray was the glue that held the team together. Don't you remember that last play? MJ knew Murray was the better option in the clutch.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't know about the worst team ever. I think that a lot of the Knicks' problems boil down to coaching. The talent is definitely there. You can't tell me that with Marbury, Francis, Rose and Curry in your starting five that it's about a lack of talent. At some point you have to point the finger at Larry Brown - even though the media just loves this guy.

I had an opportunity to go see the Knicks when they came to play Orlando and they're a really intriguing team to watch. The main problems that I noticed right away were the offense being very bland and players looking lost on that end of the floor. It doesn't help that only one of the starters saw consistent time on the floor either. Every time you turn around it's a different squad out there. I would imagine it's hard to build chemistry when your lineup is changing almost completely every couple minutes. Steve Francis saw 11 minutes in the first quarter and then sat the rest of the game.

Then there's the turnovers. Just sloppy handling of the ball coming up the court and sloppy, lazy passing. It doesn't help matters when all the players aren't really running sets on offense, just just clumping together near the top of the key. That's coaching, not talent issues.

Then on the other end you have mediocre defenders and Eddy Curry looking exhausted all the time and committing stupid fouls. So yeah, it's coaching in my opinion. You put a good coach with this team and they could get in the playoffs - a low seed, but still the playoffs.</div>

You are correct that this Knicks team isnt the worst team ever. It's simply the worst team in franchise history that's all. It's unfortunate that's one of the few things you were correct about in your post. Who cares about talent? Talent doesnt win anything! All of the players you just mentioned have more or less underachieved for their entire careers and their underachieving now. Was Brown the reason why they underachieved before they got to New York as well?

You say you went to see the Knicks-Magic game but bring up the offense as the main problem? Well I saw that game on television and while you probably had a better view from where I was sitting it looked like the main issue was the absolute lack of defense. By the way I can see how passing the ball would be considered "bland". There's a reason why Francis only saw eleven minutes in the first quarter. Not only was he not guarding anybody, he was turning the ball over like a madman.

Oh yes the turnovers was a big problem too. Are you seriously blaming Larry Brown for the sloppy ball handling and the sloppy passing? Do you think he should have gone out and started handling the ball himself? The way the players were handling the ball I thought he should have started handling the ball himself too. So the players arent running any sets and that's Larry Brown's fault too? And here I thought it was the point guard's job to run the offense. Silly me.

In your final paragraph you finally brought up the Knicks biggest problem. And you're blaming Larry Brown again. So it's Larry Brown's fault that a team full of players notorious for their lack of effort on the defensive end long before they came to New York doesnt play a lick of defense? Explain your logic please. As I said in the summer: No coach(living or dead) can get this team anywhere near the playoffs but please name me a coach that can get this team into the playoffs I need a good laugh. This team is living proof that talent doesnt win games. Team work and effort win games and no player on this team is known as a hard working, team orientated player with the possible exception of Malik Rose and the rookies. This team was bad before Larry Brown got here and will continue to be bad long after he leaves as long as Isiah Thomas is running this team!



Anyway I think Isiah Thomas should be fired.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting The Prophecy:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think Isiah should take all the blame that the Knicks aren't as good as they were because:

1. Larry Brown should take more blame. I think he is the most overrated coach. See how the Pistons and 76ers improved so much after he left? Brown keeps on trying to change his star players to take on different roles (AI and now Stephon) Instead of changing superstars into garbage players, Larry should instead change his own coaching method.

2. Isiah has proven that without depending on Larry, he is an excellent GM. He drafted Frye (awesome player), Nate Robinson (ball-dominant but could develop into a good shooter), and before Larry came, he had a pretty good Knicks team.</div>

Detroit did not really get better. They just remained the elite team that they already were. Not to mention the jury's still out on Flip's Pistons, we'll have to see how they do in the playoffs and i am really starting to smell an upset.

And Philly did not get better either are you crazy?

Look, Larry is not overrated. He's improved every team he's coached. I think the reason he's having a bad time is year is this may be the year where the most was expected. Correct me if I'm wrong, but when he took over the 76ers and the Pistons, he was considered a very good coach, but not The Savior The Legend, etc. and to add to that the New York market/fanbase and a $10m paycheck which is way more than he has made in the past.... it's bound to mess with him. He'll bounce back. One bad year does not make you overrated. If a player has one bad game out of 20, is he overrated?

The finger of blame should go to Isaiah who is a narcissist that built this team out of his own ego rather than trying to construct a team and personnel that gels together. Isaiah is like a little kid in a man's body with a $100 m vanity project, not a "team".

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">Dude, Bill Murray was the glue that held the team together. Don't you remember that last play? MJ knew Murray was the better option in the clutch.</div>

hehe remember when Bill Murray was setting up this wicked play on offense when they were defending the ball.

 

I could see Isiah giving a max contract to Newman.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">From a Rockets fan, I truly sympathize with you for having to watch Francis and Mo Taylor night in and night out.</div>

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">You are correct that this Knicks team isnt the worst team ever. It's simply the worst team in franchise history that's all. It's unfortunate that's one of the few things you were correct about in your post. Who cares about talent? Talent doesnt win anything! All of the players you just mentioned have more or less underachieved for their entire careers and their underachieving now. Was Brown the reason why they underachieved before they got to New York as well?</div>

Where to start? Where to start? Yes, I agree...talent doesn't win games. Never said that it did. The talent is there, but the chemistry isn't, the fundamentals aren't there either. These guys are NBA players, but they play like they're in high school with the senseless turnovers and horrible defense. Some of the guys on this Knick team are habitual underachievers and haven't ever done anything notable in the postseason (see Marbury and Francis). Losing begets losing and these guys seem to go out there every night and not care about losing, they don't play with any resolve or heart. You can see that by just watching a couple of their games. No passion.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">You say you went to see the Knicks-Magic game but bring up the offense as the main problem? Well I saw that game on television and while you probably had a better view from where I was sitting it looked like the main issue was the absolute lack of defense. By the way I can see how passing the ball would be considered "bland". There's a reason why Francis only saw eleven minutes in the first quarter. Not only was he not guarding anybody, he was turning the ball over like a madman.</div>

Yes, I did see the game and offense was the main problem. Poor shot selection, poor passing, poor ball handling. They turned the ball over 21 times that night. That's a huge reason why they lost. I call the passing "bland" because it's just that, bland. They don't rotate the ball enough and as a result some of the best offensive players on the team never see the ball. Jalen Rose saw the ball a couple times, played ten minutes and scored only three points. The majority of their points were scored on the inside and as a result, the Magic just had to clamp down on the paint and it didn't matter about the perimeter, the Knicks wouldn't move the ball around to create anything on the perimeter. Don't get me wrong, they scored decently in the paint, but not well enough to completely forget about the mid-range game. If you read my entire post though, and I think you did, I did point out the mediocre defenders that this team has...defense is also an issue, and a big one. But you can't improve on defense if you're turning the ball over and making things even harder on the other end having to defend the fast break all night long.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">Oh yes the turnovers was a big problem too. Are you seriously blaming Larry Brown for the sloppy ball handling and the sloppy passing? Do you think he should have gone out and started handling the ball himself? The way the players were handling the ball I thought he should have started handling the ball himself too. So the players arent running any sets and that's Larry Brown's fault too? And here I thought it was the point guard's job to run the offense. Silly me. </div>

It's not Brown's fault directly, but this is about a coach being adamant about having his team play to their fullest potential. As a coach, if you have a team turning the ball over consistently and not really running the offense corrently, it's up to you - not the players - to correct the issue. Yes, the players aren't doing what they should, but Brown is letting them get away with it.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">In your final paragraph you finally brought up the Knicks biggest problem. And you're blaming Larry Brown again. So it's Larry Brown's fault that a team full of players notorious for their lack of effort on the defensive end long before they came to New York doesnt play a lick of defense? Explain your logic please. As I said in the summer: No coach(living or dead) can get this team anywhere near the playoffs but please name me a coach that can get this team into the playoffs I need a good laugh. This team is living proof that talent doesnt win games. Team work and effort win games and no player on this team is known as a hard working, team orientated player with the possible exception of Malik Rose and the rookies. This team was bad before Larry Brown got here and will continue to be bad long after he leaves as long as Isiah Thomas is running this team!</div>

Ever watch a Larry Brown press conference? He's the most negative, pessimistic person I've seen in sports. He does nothing but badmouth his team and attack his players through the media, playing into a media frenzy that ends up dividing the team with one side behind him and another behind his starting point guard. If you basically give up on your team as a coach from the beginning, getting them to play to their fullest potential is going to be damn near impossible. Don't get me wrong, I don't think that there is a guy that can come into New York and get these guys contending, but I think that if someone came in with the right mindset as a coach and tried to work with what you guys have, you could easily be close to the playoffs.

It's not all Larry Brown, it's a lot of things. The egos, the media, and a GM that doesn't clean up the mess from the past, he just adds to it. It's a bad situation, but Larry Brown doesn't seem to do anything to try and improve it. The same could be said about the players I suppose as well. They go out, get blown out just about every night and don't seem to really care that much. I've never seen a team lose that much and show no real frustration or desire to change the situation. Two years ago when the Magic lost 61 games in a season, by the end of the season, those guys were playing so aggressive it wasn't funny because they were just tired of being considered the worst team in the league. Granted, they were the worst team record wise, but they did actually show some passion. I don't see that here.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">Anyway I think Isiah Thomas should be fired.</div>
I agree 100%.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">Where to start? Where to start? Yes, I agree...talent doesn't win games. Never said that it did. The talent is there, but the chemistry isn't, the fundamentals aren't there either. These guys are NBA players, but they play like they're in high school with the senseless turnovers and horrible defense. Some of the guys on this Knick team are habitual underachievers and haven't ever done anything notable in the postseason (see Marbury and Francis). Losing begets losing and these guys seem to go out there every night and not care about losing, they don't play with any resolve or heart. You can see that by just watching a couple of their games. No passion.</div>

Agreed!

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">Yes, I did see the game and offense was the main problem. Poor shot selection, poor passing, poor ball handling. They turned the ball over 21 times that night. That's a huge reason why they lost. I call the passing "bland" because it's just that, bland. They don't rotate the ball enough and as a result some of the best offensive players on the team never see the ball. Jalen Rose saw the ball a couple times, played ten minutes and scored only three points. The majority of their points were scored on the inside and as a result, the Magic just had to clamp down on the paint and it didn't matter about the perimeter, the Knicks wouldn't move the ball around to create anything on the perimeter. Don't get me wrong, they scored decently in the paint, but not well enough to completely forget about the mid-range game. If you read my entire post though, and I think you did, I did point out the mediocre defenders that this team has...defense is also an issue, and a big one. But you can't improve on defense if you're turning the ball over and making things even harder on the other end having to defend the fast break all night long.</div>

The Magic I believe are averaging about 94ppg this season and scored 111 points. The Magic shot over 50% from the field. Seven Magic players scored in double figures. I'm sorry but the defense was the real issue here. That's not to say the offense was running like a well oiled machine, far from it. But the fact of the matter is defense was the biggest problem that night and has been for virtually the entire season. You did indeed mention the defense but you called it mediocre. That is practically a compliment to this squad. I wish the defense was mediocre. Layden's Knicks played mediocre defense. This team doesnt even exist on the defensive end. The passing and overall ball handling was indeed terrible. The reason why some of the best offensive players on the team never saw the ball enough is because we have so many guys that demand shots so that's bound to happen. But you are right about the turnovers leading to fastbreak points.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">It's not Brown's fault directly, but this is about a coach being adamant about having his team play to their fullest potential. As a coach, if you have a team turning the ball over consistently and not really running the offense corrently, it's up to you - not the players - to correct the issue. Yes, the players aren't doing what they should, but Brown is letting them get away with it.</div>

Apparently you havent heard what's been going on with the Knicks. Larry Brown has been calling out his players from the very beginning. He's not letting them get away with not doing what they should be doing(i.e. taking care of the ball, playing defense and a thousand other things). If the players dont listen then the players dont listen. A coach can only do so much. Brown can only tell them what to do, the players have to execute. Marbury has already stated publicly that he wont play Larry Brown's way. So what's a coach to do? He cant go out on the floor and play himself.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">Ever watch a Larry Brown press conference? He's the most negative, pessimistic person I've seen in sports. He does nothing but badmouth his team and attack his players through the media, playing into a media frenzy that ends up dividing the team with one side behind him and another behind his starting point guard. If you basically give up on your team as a coach from the beginning, getting them to play to their fullest potential is going to be damn near impossible. Don't get me wrong, I don't think that there is a guy that can come into New York and get these guys contending, but I think that if someone came in with the right mindset as a coach and tried to work with what you guys have, you could easily be close to the playoffs.</div>

Larry Brown is certainly not the most pessimistic person in sports believe me. Jeff Van Gundy takes the title without a doubt. But I dont care what he does to get his team to play winning basketball as long as they win. Does he badmouth his players and attack them through the media? I guess. Although it really isnt bad as you made it sound. The fact of the matter is his methods work. Just ask Chauncey Billups. There is no coach that can get this team near the playoffs because there is no way to coach effort. This team simply refuses to put the effort into defending and that's why no coach will ever be successful with this collection of players.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">It's not all Larry Brown, it's a lot of things. The egos, the media, and a GM that doesn't clean up the mess from the past, he just adds to it. It's a bad situation, but Larry Brown doesn't seem to do anything to try and improve it. The same could be said about the players I suppose as well. They go out, get blown out just about every night and don't seem to really care that much. I've never seen a team lose that much and show no real frustration or desire to change the situation. Two years ago when the Magic lost 61 games in a season, by the end of the season, those guys were playing so aggressive it wasn't funny because they were just tired of being considered the worst team in the league. Granted, they were the worst team record wise, but they did actually show some passion. I don't see that here.</div>

Larry Brown is just a coach. He cant do much about the media or the egos or the mistakes of the GM. You said it yourself the players dont seem to care anymore. There's nothing a coach can do about that. The drive, the effort, the competitive fire has to come from within the player and they just dont have it. Maybe that's why their all career underachievers.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting explosive:</div><div class="quote_post">I agree 100%.</div>

Happy to hear it. And by the way congratulations on the Darko trade. Darko looks really good! You guys got a steal. An aging, injured center who would have probably signed with someone else after the season for a young center with lots of upside. I wish my GM was that smart but oh well.


Anyway I think Isiah Thomas should be fired

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">I could see Isiah giving a max contract to Newman.</div>

Newman would pwn anyone in the NBA.

 

I used to like the Knicks so much....