Here's a Howard vs. Hayes oped piece, from HOOPSWORLD.com, which is worth a look. I initially thought to post it in the 9-man rotation thread, but the text is somehat difficult to locate on the page linked above (it's embedded in another article). So I thought it better to paste it in full in a separate thread. Regular contributor Tony Moma argues that it’s time for Juwan Howard to hit the bench. <font size=""4"">Time for Howard To Ride Bench?</font> The answer to that question is a resounding yes. In fact, the only reason he has not rode bench since arriving in Houston 2 seasons ago is because the guys behind him have been that much worse. However, with the addition of Shane Battier, Bonzi Wells and the expected improvement of Chuck Hayes, this may be the year Houston finally has the pieces to finally place Howard where he fits best on this team. I know what you are probably thinking. He is a smart veteran role player, he brings consistency, he provides leadership in the lockeroom, etc. I am not going to dispute any of this, but none of those qualities make him the right guy for this team. It only makes him the right voice to have in the lockerroom. Since the end of the 2004-2005 season, Houston has gone in a positive direction by making an effort to get younger, quicker and more athletic by replacing the older veterans in David Wesley, Jon Barry, Derek Anderson, Scott Padgett and Moochie Norris with Luther Head, Keith Bogans (who left Houston to head back to Orlando), Kirk Snyder, Shane Battier, Chuck Hayes, and Bonzi Wells. Howard is the only 33+ year-old veteran still playing starter minutes for Houston, and it is a problem that needs to be addressed. This is probably the first time you have heard this, but the truth is that Juwan Howard is a cancer. Not by his personality or locker room impact, but by his impact on the court. Now, I know statistics do not always tell the whole story, but when they work this heavily against you, I would say it definitely becomes worth looking into. In 2005-2006, statistically, Houston was a better offensive and defensive team with Howard off the floor, scoring 107.6 points per-100-possesions while giving up 102.6, compared to 100.6/106.3 with Howard on the court. They also shot a higher percentage with him off the floor, (48.6% with him off compared to 46.2% with him) and held their opponents to a lower shooting percentage. (45.9% with him off compared to 48.0% with him). 2004-2005 was a little bit kinder to Howard statistically, but is that because Howard was a better player? Or is it because Houston won 51 games as opposed to 34? Houston scored 107.9 points-per-100-possesions on 48.7% shooting & gave up 101.1 on 44.6% shooting with Howard off the court. With Howard on the floor, Houston scored 106.5 points-per-100-possesions on 48.6% shooting, while giving up 104.9 on 47.8% shooting. Going by the statistics, Howard has possibly been nothing short of a team cancer, but coming to that conclusion already would be unfair. I am not one to draw conclusions solely from statistics. I do have eyes as well, which I have used to draw as many conclusions as I did from the statistics. You often hear about how superstars are supposed to make their teammates better. This is probably true, but you rarely, if ever, hear about role players having the exact same responsibility. It is a team sport. It is not a superstar’s job to simply do all the heavy lifting, while the role players sit back and watch their main guy fill up the scoreboard. “Role-players” are given roles not only to help your team win, but to make the game easier on your superstar, first and foremost. If you want to win a championship, it is everyone’s job to bring out the best in one another. Now, how does Juwan Howard do that exactly? Let’s start with his defense. He is as weak a help-side defender as they come, and his mobility and athleticism is not any more impressive. In his 2 seasons as a Rocket, he has blocked a grand total of 13 shots. How exactly is this making defense easier for Yao Ming, Tracy McGrady or anyone else? Come to think of it, do you think this could partially explain why Houston’s opponents happen to shoot better whenever Howard is on the floor? He is, at best, an average rebounder. For his career, he averages just 9.6 rebounds per-48-minutes, which is not much better than Maurice Taylor’s career average of 8.7. Remember all the talk about Houston planning to run more when Stromile Swift and Rafer Alston were added to the roster? Well, that plan hit a snag when Swift underachieved and never took Howard’s spot in the lineup like expected. As a result, Van Gundy assigns his perimeter players to crash the boards instead of leaking out onto the open-court to capitalize on 2-on-1 and 3-on-1 opportunities. Looking at it this way, would that explain Houston not only rebounding at a faster rate with Chuck Hayes, the 3rd best rebounder in the league per-48-minutes, but scoring at a faster rate as well? On the offensive side of the basketball, Howard is not nearly as destructive. To his credit, he has a very consistent mid-range jumper, solid veteran IQ, and can occasionally make for an effective 3rd scoring option. However, what makes Howard less valuable is that he gets the majority of his shots in the mid-hi post area. Is this a bad thing? Not really, but how valuable is it in comparison to the other options now on Houston? The first problem with this is that it is not far enough on the floor from the basket to keep his man from cheating in on Yao. Yao, for his career, shoots 52.4% from the field, while Howard shoots 43.2% on shots outside of the circle (where the majority of his shots come). Now, if you are the opposing defense and you were aware of this, whom would you rather want shooting the ball? Common sense says Howard. Now look at Shane Battier, a player that has range all the way out the 3pt line. Although his raw field-goal percentage is similar to Howard’s at 45.4%(compared to Howard’s 45.6% as a Rocket), his efficiency from beyond the arc gives him an effective-field goal percentage of 51.3%, meaning that it takes Battier less possessions to get his production. If you place Battier at PF next to Yao, it will likely make opposing defenses much more hesitant to collapse in on Yao in the paint because it means they will be leaving one of the most efficient shooters in the NBA wide open by doing so. Using this logic, this would explain why Houston was a better offensive team (statistically) with Scott Padgett, a long-distance shooter at the 4, on the court. Now look at Chuck Hayes. Hayes will not be able to hit the open jumper with the same consistency as Howard, but can he be more efficient? That is the question that matters. When Yao is on the floor, Hayes is good at recognizing the double-team and is quick enough to cut to the basket for the easy lay-up much better than Howard can. As a result, he shoots 57.3% on shots inside the circle. (To give you a better idea of how solid this is--Yao Ming shoots 59.4% on shots inside the area). In Howard’s 2 seasons as a Rocket, he has shot a below-average 49.9% on all his shots inside the circle, and as stated earlier, 43.2% everywhere else. This does not make Hayes a better overall offensive player than Howard, but it potentially could make him a more efficient option next to Yao, which is more important. So if Juwan Howard does not start at power forward, who does? The answer to that would be Shane Battier. I have already gone in detail on why he would be a bigger help on offense. Add that with the fact that he is a superior defender to Howard at the small forward and power forward position, and it makes Battier the much easier choice. Would starting Battier at power forward make rebounding a concern? No, it would not for two reasons. The first one being the addition of Bonzi Wells, who is coming off of a season where he averaged 7.7 rebounds per game. If he is placed in the starting lineup at SG, a lineup of Rafer Alston, Wells, McGrady, Battier and Yao is already projected to average more rebounds per game than the starting lineup did last season. Houston has been top5 in defensive rebounding each of the past 3 seasons. They've been top10 in rebounding differential in 2 of the past 3 seasons, with the one season where they were not in the top10 being where Yao missed significant time (and they still finished 13th in the NBA). Replacing Juwan Howard and David Wesley with Shane Battier and Bonzi Wells will unlikely downgrade Houston in this area, if not upgrade it. Secondly, during the offseason, Rockets GM gave a lecture at Rice University where he mentioned that Jeff Van Gundy can get above-average rebounding from bad rebounders with a good scheme, and that the valuable and rare rebounders are the guys that can get the contested balls. Statistically, Howard is a better individual rebounder than Battier, but if Houston will still be able to be above-average in rebounding in spite of it while having players in the lineup who are much better at grabbing the contested boards, then what is the reason for concern? Now if Howard is not going to start, what will be his role off the bench? Well, unless Dikembe Mutombo has nothing left in his tank and Howard proves capable of playing minutes at back-up 5, his role should be relegated to 3rd string. We saw when Howard first came to Houston that he is much more effective as a starter than he is off the bench, and we saw last season that Chuck Hayes is a very effective player off the bench with the energy and hustle he provides on the defensive end and on the glass. There will be a few nights where Van Gundy might have put some experience on the floor, but overall, Howard should not be any higher than 3rd stringer on the depth chart on opening night.
So what do you think the chances of Hayes actually getting the starting job are? I can't find myself disagreeing with him, but who knows if Van Guny would be willing to make a change like that?
I personally would like to see Howard. Hayes is only 6'6'', he is an undersized backup C. Even though Howard is inconsistent, I still like his jumper, and I like him at PF instead of Hayes.
<div class="quote_poster">Chutney Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">So what do you think the chances of Hayes actually getting the starting job are? I can't find myself disagreeing with him, but who knows if Van Guny would be willing to make a change like that?</div> I don't think Hayes has any chance of getting a starting job. Howard probably doesn't have much of a chance either. I expect Battier, McGrady, and Yao will be the starting front court. It's possible Chuck and Juwan may not even be competing for the same spot in the rotation. I could see Juwan as a backup PF/C, and Chuck as the primary backup C while occasionally playing at the four position. If I had to choose for one or the other to be ahead in the rotation, however, I'd take Chuck.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think Hayes has any chance of getting a starting job. Howard probably doesn't have much of a chance either. I expect Battier, McGrady, and Yao will be the starting front court. It's possible Chuck and Juwan may not even be competing for the same spot in the rotation. I could see Juwan as a backup PF/C, and Chuck as the primary backup C while occasionally playing at the four position. If I had to choose for one or the other to be ahead in the rotation, however, I'd take Chuck.</div> Do you remember who is coaching the Rockets? This is what You and I may want, but JVG is never going to let Hayes get minutes at C. Maybe against the Bulls, but thats it. Battier most likely wont start at PF imo, Howard will start. If Battier wants to start, it will either be at SG/SF.
<div class="quote_poster">igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Do you remember who is coaching the Rockets? This is what You and I may want, but JVG is never going to let Hayes get minutes at C. Maybe against the Bulls, but thats it. Battier most likely wont start at PF imo, Howard will start. If Battier wants to start, it will either be at SG/SF.</div> If you've watched the preseason games, and listened to JVG has said in the Chronicle, then Howard and Hayes are probably going to see most of their minutes at center. In the two preseason games so far, I don't believe the Rockets have once used a PF who doesn't shoot threes (i.e. Hayes or Juwan).
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">If you've watched the preseason games, and listened to JVG has said in the Chronicle, then Howard and Hayes are probably going to see most of their minutes at center. In the two preseason games so far, I don't believe the Rockets have once used a PF who doesn't shoot threes (i.e. Hayes or Juwan).</div> I don't care about preseason line ups. Kyle Korver was playing PF in preseason last year. They don't mean anything. Especially wheen you consider the fact that Yao wasn't in any of those games. However, I didn't know JVG said Howard/Hayes were probably going to see most of their minutes at C. Damn there is only like 11 min left at the C spot after Yao. As much as I hate the idea of Juwan playing C, I love hearing that he is getting limited minutes. Only play him when we really have to. 18-20 min a night at most.
LOL Van Gundy would be the most IDIOTIC coach in the league if he started Hayes over Howard. That's automatically a greenlight for the other team. Howard's midrange game and all around attributes are worth more than anything Chuck Hayes did last year with everybody injured. If ur a coach, why in the hell would put somebody out there who's gonna be an liability & instant mismatch? All the elite teams have a combination of legit bigmen they can throw at you (Miami, Detriot, San Antonio, Dallas etc..) You serioulsy think Chuck Hayes is gonna be a major contributor? Especially with virtually no jumpshot. Ur basically inviting teams to sag of Hayes and double Mcgrady or Yao. NO..NO..NO..Howard should either start of come off the bench. Hayes should be cut
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">If ur a coach, why in the hell would put somebody out there who's gonna be an liability & instant mismatch? All the elite teams have a combination of legit bigmen they can throw at you (Miami, Detriot, San Antonio, Dallas etc..) You serioulsy think Chuck Hayes is gonna be a major contributor? Especially with virtually no jumpshot. Ur basically inviting teams to sag of Hayes and double Mcgrady or Yao. NO..NO..NO..Howard should either start of come off the bench. Hayes should be cut</div> (a) you don't require every player on the court to have a jump shot to have a successfull offense; particularly if they are playing center ( Hayes is a far better post defender and team defender than Howard © Hayes is a better rebounder than Howard (d) Hayes is a better screener and moves without the ball better than Howard (e) Hayes runs down the court better in transition You keep saying that Hayes would hurt Yao and McGrady because he's a "liability". Funny thing is, that didn't happen last season. You did watch him last season, right? In case you didn't this is what happened: (warning: I'm going to use "numbers" now; I understand that you have some sort of phobia towards them, so look away now if you must): Last year, Yao averaged 38.4 points per 48 minutes on 54.7% shooting with Hayes on the court, and the Rockets averaged 98.7 points per 48 minutes as a whole with Yao and Hayes on the court. With Howard on the court, Yao averaged 31.1 points per 48 minutes on 52.3% shooting, and the Rockets as a whole averaged only 89.6 points per 48 minutes. Now, what about McGrady? He averaged 43.2 points per 48 minutes on 42.4% shooting with Hayes on the court, and the Rockets as a team averaged 89.7 points per 48 minutes (gave up 87.4 to the opponent). With Howard, he averaged 29.9 points on 39.9% shooting, and the Rockets scored 92.9 points (giving up 93.2 to the opponent). If Hayes is such a liability who'd negatively impact Yao and McGrady, how come it didn't happened last year? And why did the Rockets score far more points per 100 possessions with Hayes on the court (105.3) than with Howard (100.3)? Here's the difference between Hayes and Juwan. Players sag off Juwan as well, except when it happens to him he stands around 15 feet from the basket waiting to get off a jumper which is successful only around 46% of the time (by comparison, the league average eFG% last year was 49%). When defenders sag off Hayes, you know what he does? He dives to the basket for a high percentage layup or offensive rebounding opportunity.
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> Look, I know ur a fan favorite of Chuck Hayes. But the fact is, he's just not gonna cut it at center (let alone PF). There is NO WAY in hell he's gonna produce in a 82 game season on a winning team.</div> Says who? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Ryan Bowen was similar in the fact that he produced good numbers during the regular season, that's UNTIL we got in the playoffs and Dallas exposed him for the scrub he is.</div> Good numbers? My god, you're absolutely clueless when it comes to this stuff. No wonder you can't appreciate what Hayes did last year. Bowen had terrible numbers. In 2005, he had the fourth worst PER in the league for players who had played at least 500 minutes. And last year, he had the second worst PER. Hayes had an above average PER (18.0) in his rookie year, which is very rare. By contrast, Howard's PER was well below average for a starting PF who was so involved on the offense end -- only 12.5. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">There is too many young big men in the world for us to be playing a 6'6 undersized center. San Antonio, Dallas, Miami, Detroit etc....all have talented bigs who can finish above the rim. The Rockets will NOT compete for a championship without a REAL back up for Yao Ming. It WON'T HAPPEN</div> Dallas and Detroit do not have strong offensive threats at center. And if the Rockets need a bigger player to play against Duncan and Shaq, they can use Mutombo in those situations (if you think Juwan could handle those two any better than Chuck, you're crazy). There simply aren't that many big centers in the league anymore who are significant low post threats. Anyways, I'm going to be very happy if Chuck gets the minutes he deserves (15-25 minutes a night) this season and ends up being a key contributor. You'll look like a blithering idiot, and that shall put a smile on my face.
That is what I really like about Hayes' game. Unlike Howard, when teams double off of him he runs straight to the basket. Now if only we could somehow get JVG to limit Howard's minutes.
Amazing job breakin it down, Durvusa. How much howard impacts T-mac's scoring per 48 minutes is shocking. From 43 to 30.
I'm kind of surprized that a 6'6 238 pound player is being considered to play C. I guess its like Marion playing C at 6'7 228 pounds. It just doesn't happen very often.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">(a) you don't require every player on the court to have a jump shot to have a successfull offense; particularly if they are playing center ( Hayes is a far better post defender and team defender than Howard © Hayes is a better rebounder than Howard (d) Hayes is a better screener and moves without the ball better than Howard (e) Hayes runs down the court better in transition You keep saying that Hayes would hurt Yao and McGrady because he's a "liability". Funny thing is, that didn't happen last season. You did watch him last season, right? In case you didn't this is what happened: (warning: I'm going to use "numbers" now; I understand that you have some sort of phobia towards them, so look away now if you must): Last year, Yao averaged 38.4 points per 48 minutes on 54.7% shooting with Hayes on the court, and the Rockets averaged 98.7 points per 48 minutes as a whole with Yao and Hayes on the court. With Howard on the court, Yao averaged 31.1 points per 48 minutes on 52.3% shooting, and the Rockets as a whole averaged only 89.6 points per 48 minutes. Now, what about McGrady? He averaged 43.2 points per 48 minutes on 42.4% shooting with Hayes on the court, and the Rockets as a team averaged 89.7 points per 48 minutes (gave up 87.4 to the opponent). With Howard, he averaged 29.9 points on 39.9% shooting, and the Rockets scored 92.9 points (giving up 93.2 to the opponent). If Hayes is such a liability who'd negatively impact Yao and McGrady, how come it didn't happened last year? And why did the Rockets score far more points per 100 possessions with Hayes on the court (105.3) than with Howard (100.3)? Here's the difference between Hayes and Juwan. Players sag off Juwan as well, except when it happens to him he stands around 15 feet from the basket waiting to get off a jumper which is successful only around 46% of the time (by comparison, the league average eFG% last year was 49%). When defenders sag off Hayes, you know what he does? He dives to the basket for a high percentage layup or offensive rebounding opportunity.</div> Ok...Well give me the numbers Hayes had with Yao & Tmac on the court? And how many games did Hayes play with the full compliment of players? Go ahead I'll wait. P.S. Our record with Bowen starting was undefeated one season, does that mean we should throw him in the starting line up too?
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Says who?</div> Says me... <div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Good numbers? My god, you're absolutely clueless when it comes to this stuff. No wonder you can't appreciate what Hayes did last year. Bowen had terrible numbers. In 2005, he had the fourth worst PER in the league for players who had played at least 500 minutes. And last year, he had the second worst PER. Hayes had an above average PER (18.0) in his rookie year, which is very rare. By contrast, Howard's PER was well below average for a starting PF who was so involved on the offense end -- only 12.5.</div> We were UNDEFEATED with Ryan Bowen starting in the regular season one season, then got exposed by Dallas in the playoffs. My point? You can't go off stats everytime, especially with players injured. Teams are gonna expose his offensive weakness's, and it's gonna hurt the team eventually. Truth is, we know what Howard can do with Tmac & Yao on the court. NOT HAYES. Hayes should 3rd, 4th string player on a NBA team. <div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Dallas and Detroit do not have strong offensive threats at center. And if the Rockets need a bigger player to play against Duncan and Shaq, they can use Mutombo in those situations (if you think Juwan could handle those two any better than Chuck, you're crazy). There simply aren't that many big centers in the league anymore who are significant low post threats.</div> Actually, Howard's defense on Duncan has been pretty good. Ur biggest problem is you don't watch too many Rocket games, and it's evident. I'm pretty sure any team in the NBA would take a veteran like Howard over Hayes anyday. <div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Anyways, I'm going to be very happy if Chuck gets the minutes he deserves (15-25 minutes a night) this season and ends up being a key contributor. You'll look like a blithering idiot, and that shall put a smile on my face.</div> He doesn't derseve anything but a spot at the end of the bench. Playin a few games with the whole team injured doesn't earn you spot on championship driven team.
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> We were UNDEFEATED with Ryan Bowen starting in the regular season one season, then got exposed by Dallas in the playoffs. My point? You can't go off stats everytime, especially with players injured.</div> You're talking about 6 games Bowen started in the regular season, and then 7 games in the playoffs. It is a statistically insignificant sample. You cherry pick one stat (a useless one) that might favorable to Ryan Bowen, and therefore conclude that stats don't mean anything? What kind of logic is that? This is just absurd. I notice you just ignored the PER numbers I cited. What a surprise. Why do I even bother? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Teams are gonna expose his offensive weakness's, and it's gonna hurt the team eventually. Truth is, we know what Howard can do with Tmac & Yao on the court. </div> Exactly. We know what Howard can do with Tmac and Yao. Which is why I'm not looking forward to him getting a lot of minutes. It hasn't been very good overall. Conversely, what little I've seen of Hayes has been pretty good. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Actually, Howard's defense on Duncan has been pretty good. Ur biggest problem is you don't watch too many Rocket games, and it's evident. </div> I suppose Van Gundy must not watch many Rockets games, considering he's said multiple times that Chuck Hayes is our best post defender. And actually, I watched more Rockets games than you last year. My psychic powers are even more powerful than yours, so I know this to be a fact. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">He doesn't derseve anything but a spot at the end of the bench. Playin a few games with the whole team injured doesn't earn you spot on championship driven team.</div> Again, where's the logic here? Chuck Hayes played well last year. He played mostly against reserves, but he excelled against those reserves. That's why he deserves a spot on the roster. What does it matter that the team was injured when he got his chance? The Rockets have already acknowledged that they made a mistake sending Hayes to the D-league at the beginning of the season.
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Ok...Well give me the numbers Hayes had with Yao & Tmac on the court? And how many games did Hayes play with the full compliment of players? Go ahead I'll wait.</div> Hayes didn't play much with Yao and McGrady last year, because one or the other was usually injured in the second half of the season. He played only 32 minutes with them both on the court last year. We outscored the opponent 65 to 61 in those minutes. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">P.S. Our record with Bowen starting was undefeated one season, does that mean we should throw him in the starting line up too?</div> I don't care about what the team's record is when a player starts in a handful of games. That means nothing. What was his PER (per possession "boxscore" productivity)? Did the Rockets have a strong point differential with him on the court? In 2005, it was mixed. He had a very poor PER, fourth worst in the league, but in his brief stints during the season the Rockets were energized and typically were able to outscore the opponent. I thought he was useful reserve type player that year. He wasn't totally incompetent offensively (at least he shot over 40%). And when Juwan went down in the second half of that season, the Rockets continued to win games with Bowen playing more minutes. And we took a superior Dallas team to 7 games with him (he played 24.3 mpg in the wins, and 13.0 mpg in the losses). Last year was a total disaster for him. Maybe he finally reached the point in his career where his body couldn't keep up fast enough to make up for dearth of talent. His PER sanked even further, second worst in the league. He couldn't buy a shot; he had one of the worst On/Off point differentials in the league. Chuck Hayes is totally different. He actually possesses useful basketball skills, besides being an energizer bunny who flails around. He's a strong rebounder and team defender, he moves well without the ball, and he's a fantastic screener (an essential yet underrated aspect to the game). His PER last year was 18.0, exceeding the league average of 15.0 and easily eclipsing what Bowen has done the last two years (7.7 and 4.0). <div class="quote_poster">SkiptoMyLue11 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I'm kind of surprized that a 6'6 238 pound player is being considered to play C. I guess its like Marion playing C at 6'7 228 pounds. It just doesn't happen very often.</div> I doesn't happen very often, but it's not without precedent. Wes Unseld, a Hall of Famer, was a 6'7, 245 pound center. Chuck Hayes has a low center of gravity and a strong base, which allows him to be a very effective post defender and rebounder. He also has relatively long arms and quick hands, which allows him to contest shots pretty well and get a fair number of blocks and steals. His one major weakness on the defensive end is committing fouls. If he can't overcome that, he'll have a tough time getting significant minutes.
I really think you guys are overrating Hayes. Just because he played 2 good "preseason" games, you guys think he is better than Howard. What did Hayes really do last year? Nothing. He is a good post defender, but look at Howard. He plays bad, but I still consider him better than Hayes. Howard is a good mid range shooter. Hayes never shoots, and is really short for a C. He is only 6'6''. He gives up too much height. That is one reason I wouldn't like to have him as back up C. I like Howard better than Hayes, because of experience. Howard has much more experience than Hayes. Hayes barely plays any minutes in season games. I think if you give Hayes a chance, he might be good, but we don't have time for chances this season. Like JVG and Rockets fans, I want a championship right now! Remember that is the reason we got Battier instead of Gay? So why take chances and wait for someone to improve when we wanna win right now? That is the reason I would rather have Howard start than Hayes. Howard has experience. He can give us 10 ppg. Say if Hayes plays C for us. Where will the rebounding come from? The guy is only 6'6''. Howard is 6'9''. I would rather have Howard starting
I don't want to get into a big post here, so I'll leave you with just one thing Umair. Chuck Hayes is 10 times the rebounder Howard is. Height is not a matter in this, if it is, then Shawn Marion would average 6 and Yao 20. Also keep in mind that Charles Barkley is arguably the best rebounder in history, and he's 6-5.
