My teamBillups/hinrichKobe//Pierce/MillerArtest/Battier/LebronBosh/Odom/BrandHoward/Oden/MillerLet's see, you have shooting, defense, clutchness, leadership in the back court. You have shotblocking in the front court. You have a versatile player and defender in odom who was the best defensive player on that 04 team. That front court would dominate on the boards. At the 3 you have defense, versatility and playmaking in lebron. Lebron would be the 2nd foward off the bench, artest would be starting.Only 2/3 legit superstars. Fills up alot of the holes this usa team had. With that team Usa wins gold.edit: Oh and coached by Larry brown. He'd love coaching defensive minded players and i'm sure he'd bring gold back to the usa.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ballerman2112 @ Sep 3 2006, 12:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Ok, so if a player of Lebrons caliber doenst do as well in these games, how is a guy like Josh Howard going to do any better? Care to explain...And also, when you play at that fast of a tempo, alot of turnovers are expected. Alot of players had alot of turnovers. It is going to happen to alot of good players.</div>I also agree on putting Howard on the line-up, it's a smart move. You don't seem to be understanding pj's points and result to calling him biased/homer but sometimes it's good to have players on a team that don't NEED to shoot to help the team win, such as Bruce Bowen. Howard can play good defense, shoot and do all the little things to help the team win.I also don't like the idea of having Wade, Melo and LeBron on a team, especially Melo. He helped us win a game but I don't like how much he shoots, Wade and LeBron both pass the ball while Melo shoots every chance he gets. Cutting Bruce Bowen was a mistake, I think it would have been a better move to cut Battier instead.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Heatfan32 @ Sep 4 2006, 04:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I also agree on putting Howard on the line-up, it's a smart move. You don't seem to be understanding pj's points and result to calling him biased/homer but sometimes it's good to have players on a team that don't NEED to shoot to help the team win, such as Bruce Bowen. Howard can play good defense, shoot and do all the little things to help the team win.I also don't like the idea of having Wade, Melo and LeBron on a team, especially Melo. He helped us win a game but I don't like how much he shoots, Wade and LeBron both pass the ball while Melo shoots every chance he gets. Cutting Bruce Bowen was a mistake, I think it would have been a better move to cut Battier instead.</div>Carmelo's legit jumpshot is more useful in internation ball but honestly, usa don't need him. They need 2 way players and none of the big 3 fill that role. But lebron is 21 and by 08 will be a beast. So i came to the decision that i'd only take one of the big 3 and it was lebron. Lebron though has the biggest room to grow and by 08 he'll be tied for the best player in the league. I pick him.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo061 @ Sep 4 2006, 02:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Carmelo's legit jumpshot is more useful in internation ball but honestly, usa don't need him. They need 2 way players and none of the big 3 fill that role. But lebron is 21 and by 08 will be a beast. So i came to the decision that i'd only take one of the big 3 and it was lebron. Lebron though has the biggest room to grow and by 08 he'll be tied for the best player in the league. I pick him.</div>Your right on the jumpshot part but by 2008 we will also have Kobe and I don't mind watching Wade come off the bench. Some veteran leadership would be great as well, if we had Tim on the team I would be positive that we will win the gold.
Tim duncan refused to play in a fiba styled game again. He said their rules sucked.If wade by 08 can show he can play good defense and can actually consistently hit a jumpshot he's in the starting lineup. He's jumpshot failed him everytime i watched him. His jumpshot was money against the nets so i'm guessing it's fatigue.I'm on record saying when wade develops range on his jumpshot, he'd be arguably the best player in the nba. I stick by it if he can fix his defense up.
ballerman has the right attitude. It doesn't matter if these guys are a bunch of all stars, as long as they are unselfish (and they have shown they are overly unselfish at times) they will work out much better than a bunch of role players that have never played together. These stars know their role.melo- Wade deserves to be in the starting lineup and on the team. If you don't think so then you are crazy. He dropped 32 on Argentina, 18pts in 4th. F*ck a jumpshot, whenever he wants he can get it to the rim. In the game against Greece he was probably the best playmaker because of that driving ability. His jumpshot is good, but he hasn't had a break since September of 2005, and was sort of forcing shots like the rest of the team against Greece. And like LeBron, he has greatly improved that shot since his rookie season, and it will be much more polished by 2008.-----------------------------------------------------Guys, all the current team needs is a side of Kobe and Chauncey. They will fix almost everything, along with 2 more years of learning set offense and what to do with the pick and roll. Chauncey and Kobe are great free throw shooters (which if this team shot 80% from FT line against Greece we woulda been the World Champions), great one on one and help defenders, and both can run the break and shoot the 3 well. Both are clutch as well. All of these things will GREATLY improve this USA team. Amare getting healthy will be HUGE help down low and will be fast and athletic enough to get back on the pick and roll and block shots.
[quote name='Melo061' post='151315' date='Sep 4 2006, 06:59 AM']Tim duncan refused to play in a fiba styled game again. He said their rules sucked.[/quote]I guess he found life hard with the refs not catering to him like they do in the nba. [quote name='Nitro1118' date='Sep 4 2006, 08:19 PM' post='151569'melo- Wade deserves to be in the starting lineup and on the team. If you don't think so then you are crazy. He dropped 32 on Argentina, 18pts in 4th. F*ck a jumpshot, whenever he wants he can get it to the rim. In the game against Greece he was probably the best playmaker because of that driving ability. His jumpshot is good, but he hasn't had a break since September of 2005, and was sort of forcing shots like the rest of the team against Greece. And like LeBron, he has greatly improved that shot since his rookie season, and it will be much more polished by 2008.[/quote]Wade doesn't play defense and is not a consistent outside shooter. Zone defense takes away part of his attack. Kobe does fit the FIBA style better since his specialty is outside shooting and he plays better defense than Wade.
Wade doesn't play defense? So that is why he was one of the 2 or 3 best defenders on the USA team and was on 2nd team all defense a year ago? And he is consistent midrange shooter, and was the leading scorer in exhibition rounds. And if it wasn't for an 18pt 4th quarter against Argentina we might not have a bronze medal. He deserves to be on team. The players in starting lineup and bench can be interchangable as they will all get around same playing time.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Sep 9 2006, 07:25 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Wade doesn't play defense? So that is why he was one of the 2 or 3 best defenders on the USA team and was on 2nd team all defense a year ago? And he is consistent midrange shooter, and was the leading scorer in exhibition rounds. And if it wasn't for an 18pt 4th quarter against Argentina we might not have a bronze medal. He deserves to be on team. The players in starting lineup and bench can be interchangable as they will all get around same playing time.</div>I watched pretty much every game the USA was involved. All i saw was wade gambling and when that didn't work he looked like he was a no defender. It could've been a coaching policy for them to gamble but Shane batteir and JJ didn't. I guess it isn't a coaching policyWade's off the ball defense is eliteMan to man defense? AverageThe result is not a good defender. Don't believe the hype.melo- Wade deserves to be in the starting lineup and on the team. If you don't think so then you are crazy. He dropped 32 on Argentina, 18pts in 4th. F*ck a jumpshot, whenever he wants he can get it to the rim. In the game against Greece he was probably the best playmaker because of that driving ability. His jumpshot is good, but he hasn't had a break since September of 2005, and was sort of forcing shots like the rest of the team against Greece. And like LeBron, he has greatly improved that shot since his rookie season, and it will be much more polished by 2008.There is absolutely no reason why my team needs wade. I have everything i need to win gold.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo061 @ Sep 8 2006, 06:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched pretty much every game the USA was involved. All i saw was wade gambling and when that didn't work he looked like he was a no defender. It could've been a coaching policy for them to gamble but Shane batteir and JJ didn't. I guess it isn't a coaching policyWade's off the ball defense is eliteMan to man defense? AverageThe result is not a good defender. Don't believe the hype.</div>You could say the same thing about Kobe. All he did with Shaq there was gamble, and it payed off because he had great defenders helping out if it didn't work. Since Shaq has been gone everyone says Kobe's defense has declined, and it hasn't, but if he gambles now teams will burn the Lakers.The coaching policy for the USA was simple- Out run and outscore other teams. Everyone on the team gambled, but Wade was doing it best. Is he an elite on ball defender? No, but to say he doesn't play defense is ridiculous.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>melo- Wade deserves to be in the starting lineup and on the team. If you don't think so then you are crazy. He dropped 32 on Argentina, 18pts in 4th. F*ck a jumpshot, whenever he wants he can get it to the rim. In the game against Greece he was probably the best playmaker because of that driving ability. His jumpshot is good, but he hasn't had a break since September of 2005, and was sort of forcing shots like the rest of the team against Greece. And like LeBron, he has greatly improved that shot since his rookie season, and it will be much more polished by 2008.There is absolutely no reason why my team needs wade. I have everything i need to win gold.</div>Why your team needs Wade? You don't even live in the USA, so you shouldn't even be making comments like those. He was the 2nd best scorer, one of best playmakers, and one of best perimeter defenders on the team. He got it done every game outside of the Germany game, and if it wasn't for his huge game they wouldn't have beaten Argentina (although you can say similar things about how Melo played most of the tournament).
Obviously you missed kobe in 2003-2004 where he absolutely owned everyone on man to man defense. And this was this was with shaq. Again, go check out game tape. And if you can go check out game tape of the 2002-2003 season. You will see kobe's man to man defense was light years ahead of what wade is doing currently. Please, Kobe didn't gamble all the time like wade was doing. Kobe used to guard pg's, they'd go buy him and then he'd try to cheat with a block or a steal. But again, it doesn't compare to what wade was doing.It would've been nice if coach k came out and said he told wade to gamble. Just like Phil jackson wanted kobe to be a rover this season because of the energy issue and his bum knee. Batter's gambling doesn't even come close to what wade did.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Why your team needs Wade? You don't even live in the USA, so you shouldn't even be making comments like those. He was the 2nd best scorer, one of best playmakers, and one of best perimeter defenders on the team. He got it done every game outside of the Germany game, and if it wasn't for his huge game they wouldn't have beaten Argentina (although you can say similar things about how Melo played most of the tournament</div>It's my team because i picked the players.I only wanted 2 superstars, kobe and lebron. I have everything i need, pg defense, shotblocking, 2 way players. Clutch players. So yes, i don't need wade.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo061 @ Sep 8 2006, 07:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Obviously you missed kobe in 2003-2004 where he absolutely owned everyone on man to man defense. And this was this was with shaq. Again, go check out game tape. And if you can go check out game tape of the 2002-2003 season. You will see kobe's man to man defense was light years ahead of what wade is doing currently. Please, Kobe didn't gamble all the time like wade was doing. Kobe used to guard pg's, they'd go buy him and then he'd try to cheat with a block or a steal. But again, it doesn't compare to what wade was doing.</div>Owned everyone man to man? He made some great man to man plays, but he did gamble trying to go for steals and such, but he had a great frontline behind him to back him up. Why do you think he doesn't gamble hald as much anymore, and people don't call him a great defender anymore? He used to play players like AI and T-Mac very agressively, but if they got past him he had that frontline. Now he plays them looser as he doesn't have such a great frontline, and players are scoring more on him? I never said Wade was a better defender, man to man or gambling, but if you are gonna call Wade not a good defender because he is an elite help defender and not much better than average man to man defender is crazy since Kobe isn't a top of the line man to man defender either.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>It would've been nice if coach k came out and said he told wade to gamble. Just like Phil jackson wanted kobe to be a rover this season because of the energy issue and his bum knee. Batter's gambling doesn't even come close to what wade did.It's my team because i picked the players.</div>Battier shouldn't gamble, he can't run the break like Wade, which is the whole point of getting a steal on the perimeter. He is much better off doing his own thing. But it was clear the USA wanted to push the ball and get their shots. What happenned when they couldn't get those steals? They lost.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>I only wanted 2 superstars, kobe and lebron. I have everything i need, pg defense, shotblocking, 2 way players. Clutch players. So yes, i don't need wade.</div>2 way players? Bron can't play good man to man defense, and he is another one who gambles a ton. Shot blocking? For career Wade blocks more shots than either of them. Clutch players? Kobe yes, Bron is still far from being a clutch player. Wade is also a fantastic PG/playmaker, averaging near 7APG past 2 seasons, and being one of best players in league at penetrating and dishing.I still don't get what you have against Wade...
FYI Wade, Lebron, and Carmelo are all average to bad defenders. Depending on the day for them. I would put only one bad defender on the court at a time and make sure the other players are good defenders. More than one and teams will take advantage like what Greece did.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Sep 8 2006, 07:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>FYI Wade, Lebron, and Carmelo are all average to bad defenders. Depending on the day for them. I would put only one bad defender on the court at a time and make sure the other players are good defenders. More than one and teams will take advantage like what Greece did.</div>None of them are bad defender. Melo is average, Bron is real good help defender (although in 2004-2005 he did it way too much which caused his defense to be less than par, but this past season he was more controlled), and Wade is also real good at help defense and stripping ball from players.What Greece did was be more controlled and not try to run with USA, and ran enough pick and rolls to where Wade and Bron didn't get so many steals. What happenned? 4 total steals in game, USA couldn't run, they lost.
I don't pay attention to steal stats. I pay attention to them staying on their man off the ball and on the ball. They tend to drift away from shooters and get burned a lot and yeah don't guard the pick and roll well. Mainly the communication part.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Sep 8 2006, 07:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't pay attention to steal stats. I pay attention to them staying on their man off the ball and on the ball. They tend to drift away from shooters and get burned a lot and yeah don't guard the pick and roll well. Mainly the communication part.</div>Unfortunately guarding the pick and roll is something they will learn over time by playing together and Coach K teaching themn exactly what he wants when that time comes. But steal stats do matter, stripping ball from other players and intercepting passes is what creates easy buckets. Wade and Melo are average-good man to man defenders, and when Bron doesn't try to gamble a lot he is also a decent man to man defender. All 3 aren't bad defenders.
Against the top teams in FIBA it will be hard to rely on stealing and turning the other team over. If they don't do that than they are vulnerable on defense. I think Wade is probably the best defender of the 3 but not by much. A defensive stopper was definitely needed. Unfortunately USA didn't have any of those.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Sep 8 2006, 08:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Against the top teams in FIBA it will be hard to rely on stealing and turning the other team over. If they don't do that than they are vulnerable on defense. I think Wade is probably the best defender of the 3 but not by much. A defensive stopper was definitely needed. Unfortunately USA didn't have any of those.</div>When teams don't bite on it and exploit it, then yes they are extremely vulnerable. That is why I said a few weeks back that KObe and Chauncey will fill that void. But to say Wade shouldn't be on the team is absolutely ridiculous, as despite not getting rest since summer '05, playing off bench, etc... he was the 2nd best and most productive player on the team.
I would have Wade backup Kobe as I wrote earlier. Kobe is a better outside shooter and better man to man defense. Sure he gambles but not as much as Wade. Lebron will have to major improvements on defense these next 2 years. Otherwise I look for the best defender at the 3 to start with Kobe. Bosh should be ready to start at the 4 by then and Howard at the 5. I don't want to see Carmelo at the 4 on defense and it also hurts rebounding.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Sep 8 2006, 08:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I would have Wade backup Kobe as I wrote earlier. Kobe is a better outside shooter and better man to man defense. Sure he gambles but not as much as Wade. Lebron will have to major improvements on defense these next 2 years. Otherwise I look for the best defender at the 3 to start with Kobe. Bosh should be ready to start at the 4 by then and Howard at the 5. I don't want to see Carmelo at the 4 on defense and it also hurts rebounding.</div>As I said before, Bron, Wade, Paul, and Chauncey will all be inter-changable and will all work differently against different teams. Against teams that collapse under high pressure defense and can't play very controlled offense, Wade will work amazingly. But against a team like Greece USA needs Kobe and Chauncey more than Wade, Paul, Bron or Melo. I think that Kobe and Wade can be exchanged as startes at the SG spot, and same with Melo and Bron at the SF spot. All depends on the team they are playing and the flow of the game.
