<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Black Mamba @ Mar 14 2008, 01:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm not going to lie, if Kobe would've won an MVP one of the past two years, when he deserved it, I would have no problem with LeBron being this year's MVP, or being in the running. The MVP has turned from the most valuable player into the best player on one of the league's best teams. You can't change that standard all of a sudden.</div> Nothing wrong with that. This is what most Laker fans basically think.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 02:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Mar 14 2008, 01:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chutney @ Mar 14 2008, 11:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Not really. Most people factor in team record into the MVP equation and Lebron shouldn't be rewarded for leading his team to a mediocre record in a shitty conference. Its what's worked against Kobe the past two years, and the same standard should be applied for Lebron. I don't know about you guys, but I'll be very surprised if Lebron gets the MVP. Biased media coverage and other inconsistencies aside, the voters have been pretty fair when its come to rewarding a player for team success. Its been a really long time since an MVP came from the East and I don't see that trend changing when there are candidates as strong as Kobe and Chris Paul.</div> How can you consider the voters as being pretty fair when Nash won two MVP awards? </div> He means fair in the sense that the writers usually vote for a MVP that is a great player on a great (not good) team . </div> That still doesn't explain Nash winning the award
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You're also bitching about cheap shots Universe. Yes it does make sense, because Kobe did not split the number of games played evenly in 05-06. He doesn't get to pound on them as much as LeBron. If James had the game total split Kobe had a couple of years ago, his stats wouldn't be as impressive. The East is sad. And? LeBron plays a higher percentage of games against the East. This would be a fair point if there was an MVP for the Eastern Conference, and another for the Western conference. The Cavaliers aren't one of the best teams nor will they have a top-tier record.</div> I'm not bitching about cheap shots? I love a good argument even if I'm wrong but there is no room for LOLin in this joint. I just showed you that LeBron has played more games in the West. The Cavs weren't considered a good team last year and still made it to the Finals. Yes, East, I know but still went through Detroit. Even with that being said, doesn't that mean LeBron has done a good job then considering he is only 8 games behind the Lakers without a Gasol or Bynum. I had nothing against Bryant getting at least one of Nash's awards since he had to deal with a similar roster situation that LeBron is facing yet he only won 42 and 45 wins and the fans were crying when he didn't win it.
Lebron just told the media he stands 6'9 at 260 ibs. He's a bigger Karl Malone! This guy better be good with his size and athleticism.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Mar 14 2008, 03:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You're also bitching about cheap shots Universe. Yes it does make sense, because Kobe did not split the number of games played evenly in 05-06. He doesn't get to pound on them as much as LeBron. If James had the game total split Kobe had a couple of years ago, his stats wouldn't be as impressive. The East is sad. And? LeBron plays a higher percentage of games against the East. This would be a fair point if there was an MVP for the Eastern Conference, and another for the Western conference. The Cavaliers aren't one of the best teams nor will they have a top-tier record.</div> I'm not bitching about cheap shots? I love a good argument even if I'm wrong but there is no room for LOLin in this joint. I just showed you that LeBron has played more games in the West. The Cavs weren't considered a good team last year and still made it to the Finals. Yes, East, I know but still went through Detroit. Even with that being said, doesn't that mean LeBron has done a good job then considering he is only 8 games behind the Lakers without a Gasol or Bynum. I had nothing against Bryant getting at least one of Nash's awards since he had to deal with a <u>similar roster situation</u> that LeBron is facing yet he <u>only</u> won 42 and 45 wins and the fans were crying when he didn't win it. </div> Do you know what type of players Kobe was surrounded with? He was in a much tougher situation than Lebron, not to mention, he was playing the superior western conference. Here were the players whom Kobe had to play with for the past 2 seasons. Smush Parker - Dude couldn't even find any playing time on the Miami Heat. Where is he now? With the Clippers, soon to be out of the league. Jordan Farmar - Only a rookie at the moment, didn't really contribute anything. Shammond Williams - Out of the league, playing in Europe. Aaron McKie - Didn't do shit, and retired. Jimmy Jackson - Who? Retired. Luke Walton - Worst player on our roster right now, and can't play defense. Lamar Odom - Third option at best, Mr. Invisible. Andrew Bynum - It was Bynum's second year when he even contributed, and he wore out by the end of the season. His contributions last season compared to his contributions this season are not comparable. Vladamir Radmanovic - Super bust of the season. Injured for basically the entire year, lied about snowboarding, and etc. Didn't do anything last season. Chris Mihm - Out for the season. Devin Green - Who? Currently in the NBDL Kwame Brown - Superbust, dude can't even get any playing time on the Memphis Grizzlies. One of the worst players in the league, yet he was a starter. Ronny Turiaf - Nice energy off the bench, role player at best. Laron Profit - Injured. Out of the league, in Europe. Von Wafer - Bench warmer, soon to be out of the league. Devean George - Gump. One of the stupidest players ever. Sasha Vujacic - Seems to have found his niche this season, but in the past, he was just a practice player, and turned into brick city come game time. Brian Cook - One of the most hated Lakers at the time. Dude didn't give any effort and couldn't play defense to save his life. Super chucker. Now, look at the starting lineup Kobe had to play with: pg: Smush Parker - couldn't get PT on Miami Heat, soon to be out of the league sg: Kobe Bryant sf: Luke Walton - worst player on our roster right now pf: Lamar Odom - third option, Mr. Invisible c: Kwame Brown - can barely get off the BENCH in MEMPHIS We had two players who may not even be in the league next season as STARTERS Looking back, I find it difficult to comprehend how Kobe was even able to lead those teams into the playoffs, not to mention taking the Phoenix Suns to 7 games. Don't tell me if Lebron was in the same situation he could've done better, because he couldn't have. We'd be even worse and wouldn't even make the playoffs.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Mar 14 2008, 03:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You're also bitching about cheap shots Universe. Yes it does make sense, because Kobe did not split the number of games played evenly in 05-06. He doesn't get to pound on them as much as LeBron. If James had the game total split Kobe had a couple of years ago, his stats wouldn't be as impressive. The East is sad. And? LeBron plays a higher percentage of games against the East. This would be a fair point if there was an MVP for the Eastern Conference, and another for the Western conference. The Cavaliers aren't one of the best teams nor will they have a top-tier record.</div> I'm not bitching about cheap shots? I love a good argument even if I'm wrong but there is no room for LOLin in this joint. I just showed you that LeBron has played more games in the West. </div> Wtf are you talking about? LeBron has played 8 less games against the West than Kobe this year, and Kobe in 2005-2006 played 50 games in the West, compared to 30 in the East. You make terrible points for LeBron, if he wins it it has nothing to do with his record or Kobe "only" winning 42. Face it, you've got no point to make about that, drop it.
I would like to step in and say that T-Mac was NBA scoring champion for 2 years straight in the east. Those numbers = MVP numbers today...too bad their aren't any great bigs in this league or Kobe/LeBron would have some real competition. Right now it's a coin toss, I would give it to Kobe, but LeBron is the NBA's golden boy.
Seriously... Do not ocunt lebron's REBOUNDING STATS! Period... the dude is an oversized SF who is one of the MAIN REBOUNDERS on his team. KB is already very luck to be averaging 6rpg
When you have guys like Gasol, Odom, and soon Bynum up front, you won't get many chances to rebound the ball Btw, I'm not saying Kobe is a better rebounder than Lebron, because he's not
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 07:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Mar 14 2008, 03:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (huevonkiller @ Mar 14 2008, 12:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You're also bitching about cheap shots Universe. Yes it does make sense, because Kobe did not split the number of games played evenly in 05-06. He doesn't get to pound on them as much as LeBron. If James had the game total split Kobe had a couple of years ago, his stats wouldn't be as impressive. The East is sad. And? LeBron plays a higher percentage of games against the East. This would be a fair point if there was an MVP for the Eastern Conference, and another for the Western conference. The Cavaliers aren't one of the best teams nor will they have a top-tier record.</div> I'm not bitching about cheap shots? I love a good argument even if I'm wrong but there is no room for LOLin in this joint. I just showed you that LeBron has played more games in the West. </div> Wtf are you talking about? LeBron has played 8 less games against the West than Kobe this year, and Kobe in 2005-2006 played 50 games in the West, compared to 30 in the East. You make terrible points for LeBron, if he wins it it has nothing to do with his record or Kobe "only" winning 42. Face it, you've got no point to make about that, drop it. </div> Hey, you can argue all day but that's just my opnions and what you say are 'bad points' are not IMO. I'm stating that LeBron has played games in the West THIS YEAR. It shows it on ESPN but of course that may be wrong but I'm not really down for counting each game. I don't know why you are bringing up 2005 when I stated the Lakers record wasn't even top 4. I don't get when Kobe fans will ever be happy. Everyone will have an opinion about something and there is always ways to back it up but it seems Kobe always has to be the best. The best win rings and since Shaq left, he has how many?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobe23 @ Mar 15 2008, 12:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>How many? 1 this june</div> I agree. Lakers will win the championship if they are healthy and it will be because of Bryant. It just has to put a damper on his greatness status though that he needed a Gasol to reach that goal though. But then you bring in past greats and who they had by their side and that is a whole other argument.
Are you kidding me? It dampers it because Gasol was here? Kobe > Gasol, so it should damper it when Shaq supposedly won 3 "by himself". Pippen was just as good as Gasol, so that should damper Jordan's rings. Duncan had Manu and Parker, combined they're better than Gasol. You're argument is fucked up and flawed beyond repair. Get the **** out of here with that bullshit argument.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Mar 15 2008, 12:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobe23 @ Mar 15 2008, 12:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>How many? 1 this june</div> I agree. Lakers will win the championship if they are healthy and it will be because of Bryant. It just has to put a damper on his greatness status though that he needed a Gasol to reach that goal though. But then you bring in past greats and who they had by their side and that is a whole other argument. </div> What? Nobody did anything by themselves buddy. Not even the great, Micheal Jordan himself. He had tons of talent around him, as did Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, and even Fat Daddy O'Neal
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Black Mamba @ Mar 15 2008, 12:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Are you kidding me? It dampers it because Gasol was here? Kobe > Gasol, so it should damper it when Shaq supposedly won 3 "by himself". Pippen was just as good as Gasol, so that should damper Jordan's rings. Duncan had Manu and Parker, combined they're better than Gasol. You're argument is fucked up and flawed beyond repair. Get the **** out of here with that bullshit argument.</div> lol. No he wasn't. Pippen is easily a top 50 player of all time, Gasol is nowhere near him. He's not even a top 20 player in the league this season
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Black Mamba @ Mar 15 2008, 12:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Are you kidding me? It dampers it because Gasol was here? Kobe > Gasol, so it should damper it when Shaq supposedly won 3 "by himself". Pippen was just as good as Gasol, so that should damper Jordan's rings. Duncan had Manu and Parker, combined they're better than Gasol. You're argument is fucked up and flawed beyond repair. Get the **** out of here with that bullshit argument.</div> Someone can't have a mature arguement. Scottie Pippen was there since the beginning. How do you know Jordan didn't help Scottie? Gasol was an All-Star before Bryant and was added for nothing. Would the Lakers be in the running for a Championship without him? Yes. Would they be heavy favourites? Heck no. The fact is Kobe tried to make it work by himself. It didn't and he whined about the Lakers not doing enough. Now they have players yet you expect Kobe to be in this situation and still be considered bringing this team on his back? You guys are the biggest Kobe homers ever. I'm actually going to take your advice and leave because I've never seen so many people with one opinion that cannot even open their eyes to the rest of the league. You guys spend more time worrying about who thinks what of Kobe then anything else in the world and have a secret quest for him to be the greatest player in the entire world. I was never making attacks rather than making arguments and you have to be a ****ing cock. I'm sorry to other Laker fans who aren't homers but all you guys will have is 81. Sad but true.
Oh man, someone <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>. Huevon absolutely owned him and now he thinks Kobe cried for help. <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>, maybe you can make the playoffs by the time the Lakers have got 3 more rings. <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span> How can you disrespect the game in general by saying maybe MJ helped Scottie? Bring a legit argument or get out.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Black Mamba @ Mar 15 2008, 12:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Oh man, someone <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>. Huevon absolutely owned him and now he thinks Kobe cried for help. <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>, maybe you can make the playoffs by the time the Lakers have got 3 more rings. <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>. How can you disrespect the game in general by saying maybe MJ helped Scottie? Bring a legit argument or get out.</div> I got owned for stating an opinion on an online forum, oh noes! We know you sit alone at lunch because you have no friends other than Kobe Bryant <span style="color:#FF0000">NOT ACCEPTABLE</span>. BTW, Micheal Jordan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Scottie Pippen.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Mar 15 2008, 12:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I got owned for stating an opinion on an online forum, oh noes! We know you sit alone at lunch because you have no friends other than Kobe Bryant BTW, Micheal Jordan >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Scottie Pippen. </div> BTW, Kobe Bryant >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pau Gasol Are you ****ing kidding me? What's your point? The year Jordan left town, Pippen earned All-Star Game MVP honors, averaged 22 ppg, 8 rpg, 6 apg, and 3 spg, while shooting 49% from the field. He was on the All-NBA First Team, and lead the Bulls to a 55 win season, two less wins then their previous championship year with Jordan. Don't act like Jordan was the sole reason for Pippen's success. Dude was a talented player regardless, and one of the top players in the game. Gasol doesn't even come close. He's a borderline allstar AT BEST. He?€™s not even a top 20 player in this league, like I mentioned previously. And like I mentioned previously, there is no way Kobe would have won anything with the rosters he was given. Read my previous posts. Jordan himself wouldn't have done crap with Puke, Smush, Kwame (remember how he cursed out Kwame?), and Odom in the starting lineup. He wouldn?€™t have won shit with Odom as his "sidekick" instead of Pippen. Jordan had plenty of talent around him, as did all other championship teams. Nobody has won shit by themself, not even Jordan. And don't forget he had one of the best defensive players of alltime in Dennis Rodman. And by the way, I don't know if you remember, but the Lakers were #1 in the mighty west at one point before Pau Gasol. Give Kobe talent, and he'll win you games. It's that simple, and not really hard to comprehend. He needs talent around him to win, NOBODY can do it by themself <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The fact is Kobe tried to make it work by himself. It didn't and he whined about the Lakers not doing enough. Now they have players yet you expect Kobe to be in this situation and still be considered bringing this team on his back?</div> Also, answer this question. How far do you expect Kobe to take a starting lineup of Smush Parker, Luke Walton, Kwame Brown, and Lamar Odom? Championshipzzz“ Jordan couldn't have won the championshipzz with that roster, and Lebron wouldn't even have us in the playoffzz. Seriously, just stop. Your arguments make absolutely no sense. And no, we are not the biggest Kobe homers ever. Don't expect to sway my opinions with your retarded arguments Mamba, I'm disappointed, your not yourself today. Where's the witty comebacks...
