Lebron James (Superstardom? The Best?)

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">I'm not bashing LeBron. I've said it many times and I'll say it again LeBron James is a great player however, I've heard way too much stuff like he's going to be better than Jordan, and he's better than Kobe. The last time I checked that was hype. The point I'm trying to make is James isn't a superstar yet plain and simple. I have no problems with Cavs, or LeBron James fans. I just don't understand why some people aren't being realistic around here.</div>

How is one being unrealistic to project he'll be better than Jordan? Assuming he maintains his current level of play throughout the season, he'd be ahead of where Jordan was at the age of 20.

 

Give LeBron a primed Scottie Pippen, a defensive king, Dennis Rodman, and a spark, Toni Kukoc then start doing the comparison. It's too damn bad there is no way it can happen, there for there should be no comparison what so ever for the success of MJ towards LBJ. We are talking about individual skill, which LeBron carries that makes him a superstar, not achievements. Jordan didn't win 7 rings by himself.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Infante:</div><div class="quote_post">Give LeBron a primed Scottie Pippen, a defensive king, Dennis Rodman, and a spark, Toni Kukoc then start doing the comparison.</div>

I have a better idea. How about not doing the comparision at all, as it is extremely premature and uncalled for.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Infante:</div><div class="quote_post">Give LeBron a primed Scottie Pippen, a defensive king, Dennis Rodman, and a spark, Toni Kukoc then start doing the comparison. It's too damn bad there is no way it can happen, there for there should be no comparison what so ever for the success of MJ towards LBJ. We are talking about individual skill, which LeBron carries that makes him a superstar, not achievements. Jordan didn't win 7 rings by himself.</div>

First of all it was six rings and LeBron's skill has not developed yet into the superstardom yet. I think next year or the year after he can be one but, he hasn't reched it yet. LeBron won only one impressive game worth talking about. For me to even consider him being a star he needs to play better teams and win against them.

 

I'll admit it, I was a big LeBron doubter when he was coming out of school. But man, this kid is amazing. I'm not sure if he's better than Pierce, Kobe, T-Mac etc right now, but I think there is a chance he may be by the end of the year. His numbers will translate into wins soon IMO

 

Lebron James is the best 19 year old basketball player ever. If he can continue to improve as the greats before him, it's not unreasonable to call him the greatest player ever. Time will tell. Too often, people try to proctect the past, thinking nothing will ever be better, like many are doing here with Jordan. Jordan was great, the greatest, but that doesn't mean he will never be topped. If Lebron continues at the pace he is at, he will no doubt end his career as the greatest basketball player of all time. Right now, it's too soon to call.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Viscanti:</div><div class="quote_post">Lebron James is the best 19 year old basketball player ever. If he can continue to improve as the greats before him, it's not unreasonable to call him the greatest player ever. Time will tell. Too often, people try to proctect the past, thinking nothing will ever be better, like many are doing here with Jordan. Jordan was great, the greatest, but that doesn't mean he will never be topped. If Lebron continues at the pace he is at, he will no doubt end his career as the greatest basketball player of all time. Right now, it's too soon to call.</div>
No it's not! Jordan got to a better start than LeBron did in his career. When Jordan was a rookie people were talking about him. I know many people who don't know who LeBron is but, they knew who Jordan was when he was a rookie.

 

Ill be honest i thought Lebron was gonna be a bust and i prefered Camrello over him but after seein him play and all that good stuff i think he'll be a Hall of Famer IF He doesnt become injury prone like Grant Hill, who couldve been atleast top 5 all time if not the best.

 

Jordan played college ball, his skills at 19 were not on the level of Lebron, period. Jordan was good, but it is unfair to judge a more polished player. At age 19, all things considered, Lebron James is the best. If that translates into wins and future success, then he is on track to be the greatest of all time. Without doing an official survey, i'm going to say more people know Lebron than knew Jordan as a Rookie. The NBA was more popular back then, but all things being equal Lebron is more well known. Fact: Jordan was not offered a 100 million dollar shoe deal before he ever stepped foot on a basketball court. If you look at away game attendance, Lebron draws more fans compared to average attendance than Jordan did starting out. Lebron had the top selling jersey his rookie year, Jordan did not. But really, fan popularity has almost nothing to do with it, even though Lebron is the more popular player, at least at age 19 versus jordan age 19. The greatest player could be overlooked by almost all fans. The point is, at age 19, Lebron is a better all around player than Jordan. Whether or not he dominates the league over his entire career the way jordan did, we will still have to wait and see. I'm hoping he does, as a cavs fan, but objectivly i can state, he is the best 19 year old basketball player to ever lace up his shoes and hit the court.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Viscanti:</div><div class="quote_post">Jordan played college ball, his skills at 19 were not on the level of Lebron, period. Jordan was good, but it is unfair to judge a more polished player. At age 19, all things considered, Lebron James is the best. If that translates into wins and future success, then he is on track to be the greatest of all time. Without doing an official survey, i'm going to say more people know Lebron than knew Jordan as a Rookie. The NBA was more popular back then, but all things being equal Lebron is more well known. Fact: Jordan was not offered a 100 million dollar shoe deal before he ever stepped foot on a basketball court. If you look at away game attendance, Lebron draws more fans compared to average attendance than Jordan did starting out. Lebron had the top selling jersey his rookie year, Jordan did not. But really, fan popularity has almost nothing to do with it, even though Lebron is the more popular player, at least at age 19 versus jordan age 19. The greatest player could be overlooked by almost all fans. The point is, at age 19, Lebron is a better all around player than Jordan. Whether or not he dominates the league over his entire career the way jordan did, we will still have to wait and see. I'm hoping he does, as a cavs fan, but objectivly i can state, he is the best 19 year old basketball player to ever lace up his shoes and hit the court.</div>

You can't be serious. Michael Jordan's rookie year was in the 84 LBJ's was almost 20 years later at 2003. Stuff was much different back then. Players didn't come from highschool and Nike didn't do stuff like that back then. The reason why Nike is now giving kids contracts is because of Michael Jordan. The market was not nearly as big as it is now. The reason why Nike is big is partly because of Jordan. I'm convinced if Jordan was drafted from HS he could have made a bigger impact than James. LeBron is not more well known. Jordan is known by pretty much everyone in the entire world. There are many people who aren't basketball fans who don't know who James is. Jordan made people that weren't basketball fans know his name when he was just a rookie James is yet to do so.

 

I can't believe this kid said LeBron wasn't well known coming into the NBA. LeBron had headlines on sportcenter since he was a sophmore.

 

Win a Championship Lebron or at least take the Cavs deep into the Conference Finals, then I'll call him a SuperStar. Right now, he is just a very good player to me.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Infante:</div><div class="quote_post">I can't believe this kid said LeBron wasn't well known coming into the NBA. LeBron had headlines on sportcenter since he was a sophmore.</div>

He was well known by basketball fans, or people in Ohio but, not by everyone else.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">He was well known by basketball fans, or people in Ohio but, not by everyone else.</div>

When he was a senior in High School, people knew him in Belgium. Most people in Belgium don't even know who Ron Artest, Vince Carter or Shareef Abdur-Rahim are.A high-school senior was more known than them at the time. Talk about popularity!

LeBron is better than MJ at 19. But then again, MJ entered the leauge at 21. When LBJ is 21 we can compare their stats and can see a glimpse whether LeBron will have a better career than Jordan or not. Until then, Michael stays the GOAT. But I'm about sure LeBron will take that title, once his career is over.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Phuzer:</div><div class="quote_post">When he was a senior in High School, people knew him in Belgium. Most people in Belgium don't even know who Ron Artest, Vince Carter or Shareef Abdur-Rahim are.A high-school senior was more known than them at the time. Talk about popularity!

LeBron is better than MJ at 19. But then again, MJ entered the leauge at 21. When LBJ is 21 we can compare their stats and can see a glimpse whether LeBron will have a better career than Jordan or not. Until then, Michael stays the GOAT. But I'm about sure LeBron will take that title, once his career is over.</div>
Did people who weren't basketball fans know who he was? I think not. You can't really say he was better than Jordan at 19 because he wasn't in the league at that time. The 3 year age difference has little to do with it. LBJ has the body of a man, and was NBA ready from 18 so, whether Jordan needed a couple of years in college to gain experience or not still doesn't make him better. Jordan didn't even have a choice or not to enter from HS.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Did people who weren't basketball fans know who he was? I think not. You can't really say he was better than Jordan at 19 because he wasn't in the league at that time. The 3 year age difference has little to do with it. LBJ has the body of a man, and was NBA ready from 18 so, whether Jordan needed a couple of years in college to gain experience or not still doesn't make him better. Jordan didn't even have a choice or not to enter from HS.</div>

No, they didn't know him, but non-basketball fans weren't even familiar with Jordan's name when he was a 6-time champion. That changed 4 years ago when Cable TV started to show NBA games, but before that, little or nothing was known about the NBA(talking about non-fans)

True, but when Jordan was a freshman in college, he had a nice body as well. Jordan could not enter the leauge, but he didn't put up incredible numbers in college as well. 15ppg as a freshman is worse than what Carmelo has accomplished. Yes, he was a sidekick of Worthy, but 'Melo was first seen as a sidekick of Warrick as well, until he put up great stats.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Phuzer:</div><div class="quote_post">No, they didn't know him, but non-basketball fans weren't even familiar with Jordan's name when he was a 6-time champion. That changed 4 years ago when Cable TV started to show NBA games, but before that, little or nothing was known about the NBA(talking about non-fans)

True, but when Jordan was a freshman in college, he had a nice body as well. Jordan could not enter the leauge, but he didn't put up incredible numbers in college as well. 15ppg as a freshman is worse than what Carmelo has accomplished. Yes, he was a sidekick of Worthy, but 'Melo was first seen as a sidekick of Warrick as well, until he put up great stats.</div>

Actually pretty much everyone non-basketball fan knew Jordan's name. That's how good he was. And although LeBron could have arguably be better than Jordan as a HS student, Jordan still had a better impact. If LeBron wen't to college he might be averaging less points. Some players such as Jordan make better impacts on higher levels. I'm sure if Portland knew that they would have selected him. James was more physically built than Jordan as well for his age.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Viscanti:</div><div class="quote_post">Jordan played college ball, his skills at 19 were not on the level of Lebron, period. Jordan was good, but it is unfair to judge a more polished player. At age 19, all things considered, Lebron James is the best. If that translates into wins and future success, then he is on track to be the greatest of all time. Without doing an official survey, i'm going to say more people know Lebron than knew Jordan as a Rookie. The NBA was more popular back then, but all things being equal Lebron is more well known. Fact: Jordan was not offered a 100 million dollar shoe deal before he ever stepped foot on a basketball court. If you look at away game attendance, Lebron draws more fans compared to average attendance than Jordan did starting out. Lebron had the top selling jersey his rookie year, Jordan did not. But really, fan popularity has almost nothing to do with it, even though Lebron is the more popular player, at least at age 19 versus jordan age 19. The greatest player could be overlooked by almost all fans. The point is, at age 19, Lebron is a better all around player than Jordan. Whether or not he dominates the league over his entire career the way jordan did, we will still have to wait and see. I'm hoping he does, as a cavs fan, but objectivly i can state, he is the best 19 year old basketball player to ever lace up his shoes and hit the court.</div>

Sorry, your biased because you are a fan. People for all time will argue who is the greatest in basketball. LB is just 19 years old and he is poised to be great. But to say he is better than Jordan is just ridiculous.

Selling more Rookie Jerseys dont make you a better player. Selling more tickets doesnt make you a better player. Overall skillz make you better. Lebron just happens to have better size and "natural" athleticism than any 19 year old to date. It has nothing to do with just physical skillz.. Skillz also include your mental abilities as a player. Jordan was one of the best. There were youngins who were better athletes than him in his later years, but Jordan wore you down mentally. He beat you even before the game was over. LBJ does not have that ability yet.

Lebron has yet to win the respect of the entire league. Players will still try and test him. Jordan went uncontested in many cases. They would not even try to go one on one with him. They respected his game in its entirety. LB has a long way to go.

LBJ also has had killer advertising even before he laid a foot on the court. All this hype. Jordan didn't have that type of advertising his rookie year. Advertising has changed. NBA stars today are treated almost like GODS. Overpaid, Over Advertised, and thought of as untouchable. In the 80's Magic, Kareem, Jordan, Bird, were not making the kind of money nor getting the kind of endorsements athletes are getting now. LBJ is a product of advertising and changes in the NBA over the years. He is one of the first but certainly not the last you will see coming in the league at 19 and rippin it up. The NBA has changed.

http://www.justbball.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18846

When he is able to lead his team to titles, win multiple MVPs, win the respect of everyone in the league, etc..... We can consider him in the same breathe as the legends of basketball. He is still a youngin, with alot to learn. Give him a few more years before you start braggin about how great he is. The season is still early man.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting trenchteam:</div><div class="quote_post">Sorry, your biased because you are a fan. People for all time will argue who is the greatest in basketball. LB is just 19 years old and he is poised to be great. But to say he is better than Jordan is just ridiculous.

Selling more Rookie Jerseys dont make you a better player. Selling more tickets doesnt make you a better player. Overall skillz make you better. Lebron just happens to have better size and "natural" athleticism than any 19 year old to date. It has nothing to do with just physical skillz.. Skillz also include your mental abilities as a player. Jordan was one of the best. There were youngins who were better athletes than him in his later years, but Jordan wore you down mentally. He beat you even before the game was over. LBJ does not have that ability yet.

Lebron has yet to win the respect of the entire league. Players will still try and test him. Jordan went uncontested in many cases. They would not even try to go one on one with him. They respected his game in its entirety. LB has a long way to go.

LBJ also has had killer advertising even before he laid a foot on the court. All this hype. Jordan didn't have that type of advertising his rookie year. Advertising has changed. NBA stars today are treated almost like GODS. Overpaid, Over Advertised, and thought of as untouchable. In the 80's Magic, Kareem, Jordan, Bird, were not making the kind of money nor getting the kind of endorsements athletes are getting now. LBJ is a product of advertising and changes in the NBA over the years. He is one of the first but certainly not the last you will see coming in the league at 19 and rippin it up. The NBA has changed.

http://www.justbball.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18846

When he is able to lead his team to titles, win multiple MVPs, win the respect of everyone in the league, etc..... We can consider him in the same breathe as the legends of basketball. He is still a youngin, with alot to learn. Give him a few more years before you start braggin about how great he is. The season is still early man.</div>

Actually, you've missed the point. The argument was made by mrj that Lebron is not as good at age 19 because more people knew jordan than knew lebron at that age. My point was, that's not true, if you look at the factors that display popularity (ie, jersey sales, away game attendance, etc) you will see that more people know Lebron at age 19 than knew jordan at age 19. I go on later in my post to explain that no, even though Lebron is more popular does not make him better than jordan just based on that. I was pointing out the flaw in mrj's logic, that in fact, no Jordan was not more well known at age 19 than Lebron. As a highschool senior Lebron was the most searched for Basketball player in the world, something Jordan did not achieve until much later in his career.
My point is, if you bother to pay attention, is that Lebron is a better player at age 19 than Jordan was. It took years for Jordan to work on his defense, while Lebron is top 3 in steals at age 19. Jordan's defense in college was suspect, but he had the determination to work on it. right now, Lebron has the advantage over the 19 y/o jordan, and every other 19 y/o that has ever played the game. That's not bias, it's fact. Top 5 in scoring per game, top 3 in steals, ranked above half the pg's in the league in assists per game and leads his position at rebounds. No other 19 year old has ever done that, period. Does this mean that Lebron is already better than the best Jordan ever had to offer, NO. If you had bothered to read my post, i explained that if (note the if) Lebron continues to progress, like Jordan and the other greats did throughout their career, he will be the greatest of all time. He has the advantage now at his age, but has not yet achieved it. Next time read before you respond.

 

Dag Bron is putting up the numbers I predicted for him so far. But his defense and rebounding and even shooting from the field and 3pt line is doing far better then I predicted. As far as comparing him to MJ I don't like to do that at all. Lebron to me is himself. I don't think about MJ at all when it comes to them. I believe in my mind that he's the Lebron James. Youngest superstar ever!