<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Jun 6 2007, 08:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Guess what? Wade shoots the midrange jumper at 39% compared to Bron's 35%. And if you include 3's, Wade shoots 37% to Bron's 34%.So I don't see what you are trying to prove...</div>Wade doesn't shoot near as many 3s as Bron does though. Bron shot near 200 more three pointers this season than Wade.As of who I would take, it's really tough. They are both great top notch players in the league. Their stats are nearly identical. I think I would have to give the slight advantage to LeBron though, because he has proven that he can win without another superstar on his team, in the form of 7 feet, and 215 lbs of muscle.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 6 2007, 09:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I wasn't trying to prove anything, smart guy, I was just putting that out there. Even so, don't even bring up Dwyane's 3's....everyone knows 'Bron is better from 3...midrange, probably Wade, but Lebron takes the most absurd shots....if the dude was smarter and penetrated more so than taking dumb shots, the debate would be so much easier to resolve. I'm still surprised no one has mentioned Dwyane's meltdown in the series.</div>Yes, he does take absurd shots, which is why Wade scored more on better FG % this year (he was at near 29PPG before injury on over 49% shooting). It isn't like Bron is a great streak scorer like Kobe or T-Mac, so his 32% 3pt shooting is not impressive to me. Give me the smarter scorer in this case.Meltdown? The guy was at about 70% (shoulder/knee) and improved his game signficantly from the few games he played post-injury. His stats weren't even far off from last year's playoffs vs the Bulls. He had a few nice 4th quarters, including game 1 where he scored or assists on 11 of the Heat's last 13pts in the last 4min of the 4th, and 8pts in a 1min stretch at the 3min mark of game 3 to keep team within reasonable distance. Nontheless, the Heat lost because Wade was not near full strength and because Luol Deng averaged 26/9 on 58% shooting.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Wade doesn't shoot near as many 3s as Bron does though. Bron shot near 200 more three pointers this season than Wade.</div>And that's a good thing when you shoot under 32%?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Jun 6 2007, 09:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And that's a good thing when you shoot under 32%?</div>I was just trying to state the fact that the percentage is misleading when trying to contest who the better outside shooter is. LeBron is not a consistent shooter, but, when the game is on the line, he always seems to be able to knock the 3 down, or atleast lately in the playoffs that's the case.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GrizzFanTaylor @ Jun 6 2007, 10:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I was just trying to state the fact that the percentage is misleading when trying to contest who the better outside shooter is. LeBron is not a consistent shooter, but, when the game is on the line, he always seems to be able to knock the 3 down, or atleast lately in the playoffs that's the case.</div>And that's why I used the midrange stat as well, inside 3pt line and not counting shots at the rim. Wade shoots it at 39%, Bron at 35%.Wade is not the best jumpshooter in the world, but when the game is on the line he always knocks down jumpshots. And Wade has came up clutch far more times than Bron has.
Nitro - It was a meltdown because Wade played like garbage, don't deny it, he played like garbage and needed to step up, he chose to play...and they got swept.We all should wait and see how Bron does in the Finals...if he can earn the Finals MVP, that would put it over the top...most likely not, though.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 6 2007, 10:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Nitro - It was a meltdown because Wade played like garbage, don't deny it, he played like garbage and needed to step up, he chose to play...and they got swept.</div>He was averaging 15PPG coming off injury and was playing pitiful. For him to put up 24/6/5 after such a horrible return against the team he historically struggles mightily against is pretty damn good. He didn't play like crap, and got them close come clutch moments. His teammates didn't help things, and there slow and aging lineup had no answer for Deng or Gordon (who was also a monster in the series).<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>We all should wait and see how Bron does in the Finals...if he can earn the Finals MVP, that would put it over the top...most likely not, though.</div>I don't care if he wins or not, but I wanna see how he reacts to being in the Finals and what he does down the stretch of games. That means more to me than the title (especially since I'm sure he'll be back soon enough to get that done).
24/6/5 is not sh*t. Without him they would have had no offense whatsoever. Shaq was in foul trouble most of the series and was being played very well under single coverage by Ben Wallace. This allowed the Bulls to guard the role players, and they had trouble scoring without Wade passing to them. Without Wade they would have had no one to score the ball without Shaq, no one to make the plays (Williams was AWFUL), and no one to come up in the clutch (which he did).I can't believe you're going to say Wade had a meltdown despite him playing fairly well, and extremely well considering he just came back from 2 injuries that were still very much lingering in the playoffs.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Jun 6 2007, 10:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>24/6/5 is not sh*t. Without him they would have had no offense whatsoever. Shaq was in foul trouble most of the series and was being played very well under single coverage by Ben Wallace. This allowed the Bulls to guard the role players, and they had trouble scoring without Wade passing to them. Without Wade they would have had no one to score the ball without Shaq, no one to make the plays (Williams was AWFUL), and no one to come up in the clutch (which he did).I can't believe you're going to say Wade had a meltdown despite him playing fairly well, and extremely well considering he just came back from 2 injuries that were still very much lingering in the playoffs.</div>Without him, the Heat would've been the same team that went 17-8 without him, the same team that went on a 9-game win streak without him, the same team that anchored the Heat into the playoffs, the SAME team that elevated them from the .500 range. Dwyane Wade coming back was a stupid decision on his part...anybody can concede to that. He was out of his comfort zone the whole series, he played like sh*t in all scenarios possible, as opposed to how he was expected to play and step up. Seriously...were you watching the same series as everyone else?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 6 2007, 11:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Without him, the Heat would've been the same team that went 17-8 without him, the same team that went on a 9-game win streak without him, the same team that anchored the Heat into the playoffs, the SAME team that elevated them from the .500 range. Dwyane Wade coming back was a stupid decision on his part...anybody can concede to that.</div>Unlike against virtually every other team in the league, the Bulls have the luxury of singling up on Shaq. Without help defense on Shaq, other players have a harder time getting the baskets. Like he did in the playoffs, Ben will get Shaq into foul trouble (majority of them offensive fouls), and without Shaq or Wade...where is the offense from Miami coming from? Sure Eddie Jones gives you defensive help, but Deng was dominating virtually everyone in the playoffs, and when Gordon gets hot he is unguardable. Without Wade they had no hope against the Bulls. He was worth the risk of bringing back, and brought the majority of good play against the Bulls in the series. With or without 70% healthy Wade it would have been a sweep IMO. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>He was out of his comfort zone the whole series, he played like sh*t in all scenarios possible, as opposed to how he was expected to play and step up.</div>First of all, the Heat knew once the test results came in from Wade's injury that he would be far from 100% in the playoffs. If you had noticed, he didn't have the freedom as a scorer as he normally does until down the stretch. The Heat took the gamble with Wade knowing full well he couldn't do the things he normally does. Secondly, he was out of his comfort zone but he still played decently against arguably the best perimeter defender in the league in Hinrich. Forget the injury, he averaged pretty nice numbers in 24/6/5, he came up clutch in games 1 &3, and did almost everything offensively for them because Williams was crap and they have no one else to run the offense.Again, if Wade was healthy and played crappier than he did, then yes, I'd agree it was a horrible series for him and he didn't do what he needed as a leader. But for a 70% Wade to play as well as he did and play very well down the stretches of the close games is not a meltdown and not more of a negative than if the Heat played without him. I think it's absolutely ridiculous to rate this series as if he was completely healthy and to use it against him as much as you are doing.
I would just like to say that Wade was a defensive liability the whole series; Eddie Jones didn't even get to play one minute...the same Eddie Jones that was playing when Deng and Gordon were held to 22 points total earlier in the season when the Dwyane Wade-less Heat team BLEW OUT Chicago 103-70....BUT, I guess it would all go down the EXACT same way, correct? I guess EVEN with Dwyane Wade not there, Shaq still would've dropped his same PPG although he'd be the one dominating the ball, I guess Deng and Gordon STILL would've fired it up with a much better defender on them.That Heat team was the better defensive team with Eddie Jones and no Dwyane Wade, the Heat team went 17-8 with no Dwyane Wade, the Heat team blew out Chicago 103-70 without Dwyane Wade. But...it still comes to the same conclusion that Dwyane Wade MADE the Heat a better team...Hell....that "same luxury that the Bulls have" of playing Shaq one-on-one was completely hindered when Shaq had the ball in his hands earlier in the season. Oh well.I know its completely useless to try to tell the future, but its best to see what happened EARLIER with a different squad and game plan....and that was a blowout. Wade? Sweep.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 7 2007, 12:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I would just like to say that Wade was a defensive liability the whole series; Eddie Jones didn't even get to play one minute...the same Eddie Jones that was playing when Deng and Gordon were held to 22 points total earlier in the season when the Dwyane Wade-less Heat team BLEW OUT Chicago 103-70....BUT, I guess it would all go down the EXACT same way, correct? I guess EVEN with Dwyane Wade not there, Shaq still would've dropped his same PPG although he'd be the one dominating the ball, I guess Deng and Gordon STILL would've fired it up with a much better defender on them.</div>Gordon is a streak scorer that, as I said before, would have gotten his points no matter hwo was on him. Deng would have still scored his points and not have gone 3-14 like he did in that ONE game without Wade. Shaq was getting as much offensive control as Wade was to start off each game. But with Ben Wallace's defense Shaq was getting offensive (and defensive) fouls called left and right, something that Wade had no part of. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>That Heat team was the better defensive team with Eddie Jones and no Dwyane Wade, the Heat team went 17-8 with no Dwyane Wade, the Heat team blew out Chicago 103-70 without Dwyane Wade.But...it still comes to the same conclusion that Dwyane Wade MADE the Heat a better team...</div>In last 8 games with Wade before his injury, the Heat were 7-1. The Heat got to the semi's in his rookie season, ECF the next year, then won the championship last year mostly due to his amazing display in the Finals....yeah they are a much better team without him... :no3: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Hell....that "same luxury that the Bulls have" of playing Shaq one-on-one was completely hindered when Shaq had the ball in his hands earlier in the season. Oh well.I know its completely useless to try to tell the future, but its best to see what happened EARLIER with a different squad and game plan....and that was a blowout. Wade? Sweep.</div>Shaq had the ball in his hands more than enough in the Bulls series, and due to no players getting open shots he had less than 2APG and the offense was 16PPG better without him on the floor. You won't see Deng and Gordon go 9-32 each game in a 7 game series, nor will you see Eddie Jones go 8-11 from 3. You are using ONE game in which a few abnormal things happenned to base your judgement while I am using all the times a Ben Wallace team has played a Shaq team since the '04 Finals...the formula is the same every year, and the one year Shaq actually got past a Ben Wallace team Wade averaged 30PPG on near 70% shooting in the first 5 games of the series. I am using what I saw in the series, and common knowledge that the Heat would have no offense without Wade or Shaq on the floor. Hell, they would struggle offensively even with Shaq on the floor.As you said though, this is all hypothetical and I'm done talking about it. But in reality Wade was never expected to be his 100% self yet he performed very well for such an injured player. He came up clutch and if he was not there the losses would have been much worse (IMO). Even if you consider it a meltdown, his amazing post season accomplishments are more than enough to make up for it (although as I said, I hardly consider it a meltdown and he did as much as he could with his injuries).
Again..hypothetical, hypothetical....I'm not gonna even bother because it would go back and forth, no finalized answer. Few things you got wrong though: I don't think the Heat are a better team without Dwyane Wade overall...only during the injury, which I think is pretty obvious and sensible. A 17-8 team, running hot, and then all of a sudden getting swept in the playoffs AFTER a key player in the rotation was cut in their little run without Dwyane, and substituted with a someone else...it just subtly suggests something was wrong, you take a jab at it. But nah, instead of reaching for the obvious, I guess you think its easier to go for some sophisticated hypothetical situations, right? Me, personally I think the Wade-less Heat team going into the playoffs would've done a better job...sh*t, there's absolutely no way it would go down the same way either, mostly because the team wouldn't have 1 more player taking shots away and turning the ball over frequently....which brings me to my conclusion about why Wade was sh*tty in the series and why him coming back was a bad decision: 1) Depreciated play by far, 6 assists but also 6 turnovers2) Didn't allow the Heat team to play the same ball they were winning withYou can bring in all the hypothetical sh*t that you want, but there's no denying the concrete evidence. Hell, that Wade-less team would've at least brought it to 5 and made it look respectable.You guys tell me who's right: A team going 17-8, changing up some vital parts prior to going into the playoffs and getting swept, is that a deflation in value or what?Alex, you can word it whatever way you want, but it will always look the same....getting swept after doing great is no fluke and I want you to realize what glaring fallacy is being displayed...its not that hard to grasp.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 7 2007, 02:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Again..hypothetical, hypothetical....I'm not gonna even bother because it would go back and forth, no finalized answer. Few things you got wrong though: I don't think the Heat are a better team without Dwyane Wade overall...only during the injury, which I think is pretty obvious and sensible. A 17-8 team, running hot, and then all of a sudden getting swept in the playoffs AFTER a key player in the rotation was cut in their little run without Dwyane, and substituted with a someone else...it just subtly suggests something was wrong, you take a jab at it. But nah, instead of reaching for the obvious, I guess you think its easier to go for some sophisticated hypothetical situations, right? Me, personally I think the Wade-less Heat team going into the playoffs would've done a better job...sh*t, there's absolutely no way it would go down the same way either, mostly because the team wouldn't have 1 more player taking shots away and turning the ball over frequently....which brings me to my conclusion about why Wade was sh*tty in the series and why him coming back was a bad decision: 1) Depreciated play by far, 6 assists but also 6 turnovers2) Didn't allow the Heat team to play the same ball they were winning withYou can bring in all the hypothetical sh*t that you want, but there's no denying the concrete evidence. Hell, that Wade-less team would've at least brought it to 5 and made it look respectable.You guys tell me who's right: A team going 17-8, changing up some vital parts prior to going into the playoffs and getting swept, is that a deflation in value or what?Alex, you can word it whatever way you want, but it will always look the same....getting swept after doing great is no fluke and I want you to realize what glaring fallacy is being displayed...its not that hard to grasp.</div>You keep knocking me for being hypothetical, but you're even worse and are looking at things with a very closed minded view. The team went 17-8 without Wade because Shaq was able to command double teams and kick it out to open teammates for jumpers and such. With a Ben Wallace team, just like past years, there is no double team...he plays Shaq straight up. In the playoffs Ben was playing Shaq the best he has ever played him, doing things like taking charges and flopping which he hadn't done much of in previous years. Without Shaq being doubled, other players would have a harder time scoring, correct? Take a look at Shaq vs Ben teams in the past....the only games the Lakers/Heat won is when the other star broke out and had a huge game. The principles they did well on just wouldn't apply nearly as much against the Bulls. If they had played a series vs. say the Cavs, then I'd say it would be smarter to wait out on Wade's return. But Wade was much more valuable to the Bulls series than you seem to think. You can bring up that one game the Heat beat the Bulls without Wade, but there were so many abnormalities that I don't put much stock into it, especially with 3 different Ben vs Shaq series' in the past few seasons to give me more than enough evidence to form an opinion. The Heat knew that they had no chance to beat the Bulls without Wade. They knew that if he somehow came back and was healthy they WOULD have a chance, which is why he did in fact come back. For the most part Wade did what was expected (outside of TO's and FG % he had a good series, even by his standards), but the Heat didn't foresee the other problems that arose (Deng/Gordon exploding, Shaq getting into foul trouble most games which limited his minutes, the age difference being much more of a factor than last year, etc...). Nothing you have brought up suggests Wade had a meltdown in the series, which is the only reason I am arguing this. He wasn't expected to play quite as well as he did, he showed the same leadership and clutch characteristics that people always praise about him, and all of the negative things that he did are a direct result of being rusty and injured (shoulder injury effected jumpshot and finishign at rim, knee effected explosiveness, his timing was off thuis the turnovers and fouls on steal/block attempts). If anything, blame the organization and coach for bringing him back/giving him as much offensive control, don't blame the player (although I agree with their decision).Oh, and what about Bron's 10pts in game 1 vs Detroit? How about his horrible 18pt game against NJ in game 3 (I was there)? What about his choking in game 4 vs NJ and game 1 & 2 vs Detroit? Sure, he made up for these things by eventually winning the series (although he hasn't played amazingly in the playoffs outside of a few games vs Detroit), but Wade has also done WAY more than enough in the past to make much of his 70% healthy self getting swept by the Bulls. You are the first person I have heard take the Bulls series even remotely serious in judging Wade. It is senseless and simply retarded.
I'm not going to bother replying because you're not saying anything different, but one quick thing: Really? Do you think a 17-8 team, that did blowout Chicago without Wade and got blown out earlier in the season with him, really would have gotten swept as abruptly as they did? That's all I want to know, because I'd rather not continue in a debate with someone who's entire point is centered behind "and/ifs"...So, you're on the spot...17-8 Team, blew out Chicago with the same team, would they: A) Actaully win one game in the series or Get sweptYou're on the clock, Alex.
As I said, very closed minded and black and white. The Heat knew they had no chance winning without Wade, which is why they took the risk of bringing him back. He did not have a meltdown and carried the offense which was struggling, he came up clutch, etc... He is not to blame for the Heat loss, and certainly didn't have a meltdown.I think they would have been swept with or without Wade for reasons I have previously mentioned that I put a lot more stock into than one lone game where things that rarely happenned, happenned. But he played well for a player as injured and rusty as he was, and IMO he helped the team rather than hurt them. I cannot hold one series which he wasn't near 100% during against the man who has done so much in the postseason. It is ridiculous you would call it a meltdown and hold it against him.
Meltdown probably was the wrong word, the appropriate word probably should've been sh*tty and made the Heat lose. And hell, the Heat team looked pretty confident to me...the Heat team with no Dwyane Wade blew out Chicago....I didn't see any necessities that game....or prior to the series.I guess the Chicago Bulls are just THAT great, though.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Jun 7 2007, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Meltdown probably was the wrong word, the appropriate word probably should've been sh*tty and made the Heat lose. And hell, the Heat team looked pretty confident to me...the Heat team with no Dwyane Wade blew out Chicago....I didn't see any necessities that game....or prior to the series.I guess the Chicago Bulls are just THAT great, though.</div>This has got to be one of the most retarded and ignorant posts I have seen.I'm done arguing about this. If you have something else to bring to the debate, do so. If not, then this is done.
My fault Nitro, I got busy. To your Pistons comment. I didn't say this Pistons team was better than last years. I just said they weren't that bad. The Pistons were still a solid team (as for as the East is concerned) and you can't take away what LeBron James did in Game 5. I said basically, and why did I say that? He broke his finger in the preaseason. He was never able to start off with the Cavaliers healthy. He then came back towards the end of the season but admitted he wasn't 100%. Then in the playoffs, his brother dies. He misses some games and what not, and you can't say that wouldn't have any effect on him. Then this season he comes in healthy, a new start. So you tell me, is a 80% Hughes the same type of player as a 100% healthy Hughes? We didn't resign Flip, and we only picked him up because Hughes was out. The Cavaliers basically got a new member of the team. He also had a game winning three against the Raptors off a LeBron James kick out. Two big threes out of 82 games of play isn't that impressive. Sure I loved them, but I would much rather have solid production on a consistant pace. Damon Jones stats stayed the same, but like I said: "Damon Jones wasn't hitting too many key threes last season and this season he really took off. His 3pt% went up and so did the fans love for the guy." When I said key threes, I ment throughout games, not just a game winner. I ment when we are down 8 and need a three to get momentum going, guess who missed it? Damon Jones was complaining about not getting enough game time, he was complaining about how he was being used, and the fans weren't happy. The Cavaliers and fans were upset about the point guard situation and Damon Jones and Eric Snow were stars of the debate. This year was different. Then, some time in the season something happend that no Cavalier fan understands and he didn't play anymore. He has gotten more playing time again during the playoffs when the Cavaliers needed some shooting, but he really hasn't played like he did at the start of the season. He isn't in the rotation anymore really, he just gets in here and there. With Larry Hughes coming and Gooden being used more in the offense, Z got less shots. Mike Brown stuck in a new offense this year and Z said he was having troubles getting used to it. But other than that, I don't know why I said that. My mistake. I have been on this guy all year about how much I haven't been able to stand him. I got trigger happy with names here... Well that was stupid. Honestly, I want to trade the man while we still can. Gooden has been used in the offense more this year than in the past. His shots have gone up and he has really made use of his jumper. With the increase in AV and using Gooden more, Marshall hasn't been used too much. He averaged 10 less minutes per game this year. And actually, AV brings up the energy level now as does Gibson. AV does help out on the offensive boards. He gets in there and knocks the ball loose and what not, but he isn't the best player in the world. If it wasn't for the energy he brings, the hustle, and him drawing charges- he wouldn't be in the NBA. I miss Flip. After the Cavs didn't resign him, I was upset. But it is obvious why, we got Hughes back, we didn't need Flip... I guess. I was still mad. The changes in the team weren't individual as much as they were as a whole. The focus of the team shifted from just LeBron to the team as a whole. I mean, last season the Cavs were the fourth seed, and this season they are the second. Even though they had the same record, the Cavs were fighting at the number one seed until they started slacking off (because like I said, they have problems finishing). The team's profits, where they have ended up is better than last season's. The team was eliminated in the playoffs last season because of the fact they had problems finishing games. They aren't great at finishing now, but they have gotten better. And they proved that by finishing off each series this season without reaching a game 7. Besides, with the way Gibson is playing I would rather have him than Flip- Gibson has been providing more of a spark than Flip ever did. Sasha has gotten a lot better as a whole. He is more aggressive and actually trys to play defense this year. The Cavaliers were still able to finish off the Wizards in a sweep, something that last year would have been harder for them to do. The Nets don't suck, like I said before. Like I stated before, the Pistons didn't suck either. Playoff series wins aren't easy. Just because you are a better team doesn't mean you automatically get the win, ask the Mavericks. So the fact the Cavaliers got to where they are right now is still impressive. Which was my point before. The Cavaliers are a better team this year than last year. They don't show up to play everyday (as you stated in the Nets series). But we are seeing right now the potential this team has when they want it. The Cavs are in the finals now, a place they have never been.As a whole, you are winning this arguement right now. But, as long as you keep going, I am going to keep going and see if I can't pull anything out. Although there isn't really anything to keep going about. Right now the only thing we are doing is talking about 2005-06 Cavs and the present Cavs.
[quote name='Drake24' post='377956' date='Jun 11 2007, 11:14 AM']To your Pistons comment. I didn't say this Pistons team was better than last years. I just said they weren't that bad. The Pistons were still a solid team (as for as the East is concerned) and you can't take away what LeBron James did in Game 5.[/quote]Pistons were a solid team, but not what they were last year (and same to Wizards) which makes your point that they played the same 2 teams this year and beat them moot. Cavs had a pretty easy road to the Finals. Hughes played better early in that season than all of this year. It was not like he was a new member of the team, and the adjustments weren't too difficult this year. Much like last year. Gets some playing time, then all of a sudden no playing time. He hit a few big 3's last year, but for the past 2 years he has had such little time in the clutch where he is close to a non-factor, certainly someone you wouldn't bring up to make your debate that the Cavs are better. LoL ok. Basically everything positive you are saying also has a detritment. It basically all comes down to LeBron for me...I thought the offense was better suited with him going for 31PPG, and still do. He hasn't been as agressive this year, and this new offense hasn't been too good for the Cavs. The Cavs are a better team when he is more agressive as a scorer.Their success this year has come largely because of a weaker East, and in the playoffs they had amazing matchups.Give me Flip over Gibson anyday. Gibson is a shooter who can go cold...Flip is a scorer. Of course it is harder to do with GA and Caron Butler on the opposing team.Nets don't suck, but their one weakness is rebounding....Cavs were the perfect matchup for the Nets. Not to mention Nets do an even worse job of closing out games. That series should have went to 7 games as the Nets had a meltdown in game 4.Pistons didn't suck, but each game they played like crap and with little energy. They simply weren't the team they were last year.I still feel the Cavs were a slightly better team last year, but I'm done arguing this as there is no real connection to the Wade vs Bron debate. I will happily continue discussing that, though.
