Minny announcers baffled on our success

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by magnifier661, Jan 7, 2013.

  1. handiman

    handiman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    5,881
    Likes Received:
    3,916
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I was a proponent of Lillard leading up to the draft because you need a primary ballhandler than can shoot from deep or drive to the hoop to win in today's NBA. That's the intangible than the stats overlook. Close games go your way more often than not when you've got that guy on the roster.
     
  2. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    14,616
    Likes Received:
    14,835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Master of Xen Foro
    Location:
    La Grande, OR
    Mook, FTW again!

    Good News: I think we have a very, very good team.
    Bad News: 4 or 5 guys is apparently my definition of a team.
     
  3. PapaG

    PapaG Banned User BANNED

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    32,870
    Likes Received:
    291
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Tualatin, OR
    Team would be 29th in pace and top 10 in efficiency with Nate as coach. Probably would be worth 2 more wins at this point. :MARIS61:

    Really though, the answer is that the Blazers have 4 players who could arguably be in All-Star consideration so far this season. Hickson/LMA/Lills/Batum

    Only LMA will make it, but the other 3 are playing at a very high level, and mostly doing it consistently. When you can count on 4 players most nights to play well, you're going to win some games.
     
  4. Nikolokolus

    Nikolokolus There's always next year

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2008
    Messages:
    30,704
    Likes Received:
    6,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    2013 is one seriously tough schedule for the Blazers. So while it's nice to think that the Blazers might keep up their current pace and continue to win close, odds are the teeth of the schedule is going to take a bite.
     
  5. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    5,465
    Likes Received:
    423
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Considering our bench can't get any worse and was young / inexperienced to begin with, they are likely to improve at least a little bit. Maybe some improvement from them will help offset a portion of an increased schedule difficulty.
     
  6. PapaG

    PapaG Banned User BANNED

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    32,870
    Likes Received:
    291
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Tualatin, OR
    I have some hope for Babbitt, Freeland, and Price being at least semi-competent, and Leonard too if he can get healthy.

    Not an ideal bench, but Babbitt can at least score a little bit, Freeland is getting good looks and even has some post moves, Leonard is an energy guy, and Price is well, Price, but he's not screwing up too bad in recent games.
     
  7. Nikolokolus

    Nikolokolus There's always next year

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2008
    Messages:
    30,704
    Likes Received:
    6,198
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Maybe the bench gets marginally better, but I think there are a couple of factors that give me pause. The Blazers' starters have been remarkably healthy. Aside from some missed games from Matthews, the starting five have enjoyed a pretty good run of luck when it comes to availability. Can we count on that in the second half of the season? Secondly, I think Lillard may hit a bit of a rookie wall; he's playing so many minutes and being asked to carry such a burden. Maybe he can keep it up, but I worry about him wearing down.

    In any case, I'm not guaranteeing a cratering, but I think some fall-off is inevitable as the degree of difficulty ramps up and the law of averages catches up a little bit.
     
  8. Rhal

    Rhal Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2009
    Messages:
    12,997
    Likes Received:
    2,756
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    UPS
    Location:
    Portland
    This sentence just goes to show how snake bitten we've been the last few years. LA came into the season pretty obviously not in game shape due to surgery and has been banged up and missed 2 games while dealing with a few lingering issues, Mathews has missed 5 games and played less then 10m in 2 others and its not just missing a few games for Mathews he has been playing pretty banged up for quiet a few games. Batum has missed a game and came out early in another and had a handful of games were he played with (what was it an injured back?). We'v been remarkably healthy compared to the Blazers of the last few years but its not like were OKC Healthy here.
    Actually after looking at most of the other "playoff" teams/contenders I take it back, we have been remarkably healthy with our starting 5 compared to a lot of other teams.
    I do also think were going to run into more injuries from LA/Mathews/Batum/Lillard due to how many minutes played
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
  9. Boob-No-More

    Boob-No-More Why you no hire big man coach?

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2008
    Messages:
    19,094
    Likes Received:
    22,763
    Trophy Points:
    113
    When it comes to win-loss record, this team is seriously overachieving. Basketball-reference calculates expected won-loss record based on a number of key team stats.

    Here's what they say about the Blazers:

    PTS/G: 96.5 (15th of 30) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 98.6 (19th of 30)
    SRS: -2.33 (20th of 30) ▪ Pace: 90.6 (23rd of 30)
    Off Rtg: 104.8 (14th of 30) ▪ Def Rtg: 107.2 (24th of 30)
    Expected W-L: 14-19 (20th of 30)
    Actual W-L: 18-15

    Compare that to the underchieving Lakers:

    PTS/G: 102.9 (5th of 30) ▪ Opp PTS/G: 100.8 (26th of 30)
    SRS: 2.38 (9th of 30) ▪ Pace: 94.3 (3rd of 30)
    Off Rtg: 108.7 (6th of 30) ▪ Def Rtg: 106.6 (21st of 30)
    Expected W-L: 19-14 (10th of 30)
    Actual W-L: 15-18

    So, why are the Blazers winning more games than the stats predict? My theory is outstanding late game execution in close games by our above average starters. If you look at our starters, they are all above league average (PER = 15.00)

    J.J. Hickson, PER = 20.5
    LaMarcus Aldridge, PER = 19.5
    Nicolas Batum, PER = 18.0
    Damian Lillard, PER = 16.6
    Wesley Matthews, PER = 15.3

    These are the guys playing the closing minutes of close games. And, I like the way Stotts is using them. Instead of predictable ISOs where everyone in the gym knows who is going to take the last shot, the Blazers have multiple options. Batum has hit a couple big game winning/game tying shots, as has Lillard, and Aldridge has at least one as well. This makes it much harder for our opponents to defend the Blazers with the game on the line. They can't simply key on one player. The Blazers may not have one superstar go to guy, but they have multiple guys who can take and make the big shots. I like this versatility, and Stotts play calling takes advantage of it.

    Also, the Blazers most likely to have the ball in their hands late in the game are all good free throw shooters. And, that helps win close games.

    Nicolas Batum, FT% = .872
    Damian Lillard, FT% = .848
    LaMarcus Aldridge, FT% = .805

    Compare these same metrics to the underachieving Lakers.

    Lakers Starters ranked by PER:

    Kobe Bryant, PER = 25.6
    Dwight Howard, PER = 20.1
    Steve Nash, PER = 16.9
    Pau Gasol, PER = 14.7
    Metta World Peace, PER = 13.7

    That's two below average starters, and Nash has only played in 9 games. In his place the Lakers tried starting Steve Blake (PER = 8.9) and Chris Duhon (PER = 9.6) before finally settling on Darius Morris (PER = 7.7)

    And when it comes to FTs, Nash is a great FT shooter. He hasn't missed yet this season, but he's only he's only attempted 9 FTs all season. With the ball in Kobe's hands late in the game, Nash is only averaging 1 FTA/G and simply doesn't get the opportunity to get fouled. So, that leaves Kobe and Dwight as the Lakers most likely to get fouled late in the game.

    Kobe Bryant, FT% = .847
    Dwight Howard, FT% = .508

    Kobe is a good FT shooter, but not as good as Batum and on par with Lillard. But, Dwight is an absolute disaster. His poor FT shooting makes him a liability late in close games. So, they don't even look to get him the ball.

    Before Nash came back, the Lakers were essentially playing 3-on-5 on offense in close games (with a single digit PER PG and Dwight a liability), and 2 of those 3 are having below average seasons (Pau, PER = 14.7 and Meta, PER = 13.7). Even with Nash back, he doesn't have the ball in his hands enough to make a difference. Nash is great at making average players better. He can create for those who can't create for themselves. But Kobe doesn't need that. He creates for himself and needs the ball in his hands to be effective - which is why Nash is a bad match for Kobe. As good as Kobe is, at the age of 33, he's essentially playing 1-on-5 ISO ball with the game on the line. And, if you look at Kobe's clutch time stats at 82games.com, you'll see he's not getting the job done. He's settling for jump shots and not making them. Check out some of his clutch time stats:

    Net Pts: -25
    Off: 94.5
    Def: 118.4
    Net48: -23.9
    W: 5
    L: 11
    Win%: 31.3%

    FG%: .359
    eFG%: .410

    Now, compare that to the Blazers Big 3 when the game is on the line:

    Damian Lillard:
    Net Pts: +54
    Off: 111.1
    Def: 78.2
    Net48: +33.0
    W: 13
    L: 4
    Win%: 76.5%

    FG%: .459
    eFG%: 568

    Nicolas Batum:
    Net Pts: +56
    Off: 113.0
    Def: 78.2
    Net48: +34.8
    W: 13
    L: 3
    Win%: 81.3%

    FG%: .423
    eFG%: 577

    LaMarcus Aldridge:
    Net Pts: +46
    Off: 107.9
    Def: 78.9
    Net48: +29.0
    W: 11
    L: 5
    Win%:68.8%

    FG%: .459
    eFG%: .459

    And, that's pretty much why the Blazers are overachieving and the Lakers are underachieving. With the game on the line, the Blazers are a 3-headed monster that is very difficult to stop. With the game on the line, the Lakers are playing 1-on-5 and relying too heavily on an aging superstar who can no longer get it done. I'd hate to be Mike D'Antoni. He's pretty much fucked either way. If he keeps deferring to Kobe with the game on the line, the results won't improve and he'll get fired. If he takes the ball out of Kobe's hands, he'll piss him off and get fired. And, even if he does, he really only has 38-year old Nash to turn to. Nash can create for others, but do you want the ball in the hand's of Dwight Howard (.508 FT%) or Metta World Peace (100% head case) with the game on the line. So, that leaves Nash creating for himself and Pau (whose confidence is shot). So much for the idea of assembling a dynasty by combining 4 future Hall-of-Famers on one roster.

    Executive Summary:

    With the game on the line, our young guys have been dominant and their old guys have sucked.

    BNM
     
    BlazerCaravan, Darkwebs and Further like this.
  10. Rhal

    Rhal Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2009
    Messages:
    12,997
    Likes Received:
    2,756
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    UPS
    Location:
    Portland
    I'm not gonna quote you BNM because that is one long ass post, but i'd wonder how Lillard/Batum/LA compared to Parker/Ginobli/Duncan in there championship years, they kind of remind me of them. Three very different players all unafraid to take the last shot and unafraid to give it up to someone with a better shot.
     
  11. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2009
    Messages:
    59,328
    Likes Received:
    5,588
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Cracking fools in the skull
    Location:
    Lancaster, California
    Bnm; you are a scholar!
     
  12. BLAZINGGIANTS

    BLAZINGGIANTS Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    22,030
    Likes Received:
    14,606
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I haven't seen enough to make me think we'll win more than 34-38 games.

    Hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see much more. For the record, given the roster, a rookie PG, injuries, etc.... I could handle that. I don't think we're far from a 6-8 seed, but we don't have any depth and the season is 82 games. Now, if Lillard continues to improve, guys adjust to bigger roles and continue to grow (Wes, Nic, and JJ especially), we could see us combat the upcoming tougher schedule. Time will tell, but I expect we'll continue to win tough games, lose ones we shouldn't, finish a few games out of 8th, and feel comfortable knowing that if we add some depth, we'll be back in the playoffs with the potential to be spoilers next season.

    Is that most exciting? No. But I feel better about the future now than I did back at the end of the summer.
     
  13. Further

    Further Guy

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2008
    Messages:
    11,099
    Likes Received:
    4,039
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Stuff doer
    Location:
    Place
    Wow BNM, great analytical post. I think I agree, but being much dumber than you I'm going to have to contemplate your sage words a while before finally giving up and turning my attention to youporn.
     
  14. PapaG

    PapaG Banned User BANNED

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    32,870
    Likes Received:
    291
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Tualatin, OR
    Too long, and the opinions contained in your post are still not facts.

    Learn how to be more brief and get your opinion across. Which of the multitude of facts are we supposed to accept as facts that prove your opinion?
     
  15. Sinobas

    Sinobas Banned User BANNED

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Messages:
    14,608
    Likes Received:
    5,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    9-2 in close games says alot!

    However, this is a very solid starting lineup. Easily a +.500 starting lineup. It's just that our bench sucks so much. I thought before the season started, that this was about a .500 team, factoring in that our weak bench would drag us down some.

    Also consider that we've played 3 more games on the road so far.....
     
  16. MickZagger

    MickZagger Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    37,276
    Likes Received:
    16,162
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    UPS
    Location:
    V-Town Baby
    Not great team stats, but a good record can be marked up to good coaching IMO. Their is about 4-5 games that could have gone either way against inferior opponents that we lost, as well.
     
  17. jlprk

    jlprk The ESPN mod is insane.

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2009
    Messages:
    30,672
    Likes Received:
    8,852
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    retired, while you work!
    http://espn.go.com/nba/standings

    The "Diff" column in the standings, when out of order, tells you which teams have stats disproportional to their win record.

    I vaguely remember that we were lucky that some of those teams had an injured player missing, short-term right when they played us.
     
  18. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2009
    Messages:
    59,328
    Likes Received:
    5,588
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Cracking fools in the skull
    Location:
    Lancaster, California
    We had some key injuries with 5 of our losses. Do we get to take them back?
     

Share This Page