The Bulls are the exception to the rule. Definitely not common by any standard. It's a lot easier winning with a couple superstar bigs, and an average PG, and average SG. Than winning with a superstar PG and superstar SG and average bigs. You'll see a lot more teams finding it easier to have success with a Shaq, Tim Duncan, Kareem, Hakeems than teams starting off with a Jason Kidd, Allen Iverson, Tracy McGrady, Kobe, Vince Carter, etc.
No, my point was you either need a superstar big and/or multiple elite defenders. The Bulls teams lacked a superstar big but they regularly had 2 - 3 of the top 10 defnders in the league (Pippen, Jordan, Grant/Rodman). They were also an excellent rebounding team. Rodman and Grant were both excellent rebounding power forwards, and Pippen and Jordan were great rebounders for their positions. A superstar big automatically gets you great interior defense and rebounding (and also dominant low post scoring). Without a superstar big, you can still win a title with excellent team rebounding and multiple great defender. That also fits the 2004 Pistons team to a tee. No superstar big (Ben Wallace does not qualify in my book as a superstar due to his nearly non-existant offensive game), but great rebounding and multiple great defenders (including DPOY Ben Wallace). It really comes down to the old addage about defense and rebounding winning championships. A super star big gets you that, as does great team rebounding and defense. My point, relative to the Raptors is they have none of the above. They don't have a dominant big. Bosh is good, but he's not a Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem, or even Garnett. They are also an extremely weak defending, poor rebounding team. They have none of the ingredients required for post season success. BNM
Yeah but you're trying to correct me for some reason yet my thought was demonstrable while yours cleary has an exception to the rule, which makes me feel like you're just trying to antagonize here. How many times has this been refuted? Because I have seen virtually no indication that Raptors fans think any different than you do regarding that analysis. In fact the consensus is that the team is not constructed properly and that the overspending this past summer was a disaster. It seems you're just keen on repeating yourself ad nauseam. You've virtually made the same post regarding the Raptors here and on the Blazers forum dozens of times as if trying to correct or enlighten somebody but who that person is I have no clue.
My assertion about defense and winning championships has nothing to do with you. I've been saying it for years in every forum I participate in. I said it when the Bulls were winning titles, and when teams like Phoenix and Dallas were trying to win with high powered offenses. It's based on 40+ years of watching NBA basketball. Frankly, I don't care if you agree or not. It's a time tested formula. The Lakers in 2004 were stacked with superstars, but Detroit won because they played better defense and outrebounded the Lakers by an average of 10 RPG. That's not an exception. An exception would be a poor rebounding, weak defending team winning a title. We must be reading different threads then, because this forum has been full of predictions of 50 wins and making it to the second round of teh play-offs this season. My point is, and has always been, that even if you do win 50 games during the regular season (I think 45 is tops), you won't make it to the second round due to weak defense and poor rebounding. So, perhaps you are I are in agreement that the Raptors roster is poorly constructed, but that is far from the consensus in this forum. BNM
And what an original thing to keep repeating. Give me a fucking break. This is basketball 101. That's something Colangelo said and he didn't say the team would win 50 games, he said it was possible. And nobody agreed in that thread. Kaz is the only person who's talked about round two and if that constitutes "all over the forum" than I guess you're right. Be honest--you're still in here because of some shit some raptors fans said like two years ago regarding Bargnani and Roy or Oden or something, I don't even remember the context. And you've been on a truth-spreading mission with regards to all Raptors forum posters since. You're in here to jump on someone you think is overly optimistic (or not nearly pessimistic enough) and since there basically isn't more than one or two people like that you just keep repeating the same stuff over and over to bait someone into disagreeing with you. It's like me going into the Jazz forum and telling them they can't make the conference finals. Why would I bother them with that? Even if they said they could, who cares?
You called Bill Russell a superstar in a previous post. He was a career 44% shooter, 56% FT shooter, and scored about 1/3 of what the league leading scorer scored, led the league in rebounding. Ben Wallace was a career .472 shooter, 42% FT shooter, and scored about 1/3 of what the league leading scorer scored, led the league in rebounding. I am not a huge Wallace fan or anything, I just recognize he was truly great for 3-4 seasons. I think you gloss over that gimmicks effect championships. Bulls had 4 guys 6'7" who could basically play any of 4 positions each. Certainly on defense. Their SF played PG, their SG played PF (on offense). I don't consider Duncan a true PF, but a C playing PF (gimmick). I disagree about defense winning championships, too. Lakers were 3rd in team scoring and 14th on defense. The top 4 defensive teams: #1 Cleveland lost ECF #2 Spurs lost 1st round #3 Celtics lost 2nd round #4 Blazers lost 1st round
Good god, someboody needs to chill out. I'm not baiting anyone. Feel free to ingnore my posts if you don't like them. Nobody is forcing you to read them and nobody is forcing you to respond. Why not just put me on your ignore poster list? For somebody who supposedly don't care, you sure seem pretty damn angry. Best of luck with your season. I've already got my tickets (for the third straight year) for when the Raps come to Portland. I'm looking forward to it. BNM
lol there are only like 6-8 Raptor fans that even frequent the forum lol. So I guess the consensus would be 4 or greater. So far 3 Raptor fans have agreed that the team is poorly constructed and overspent (Myself, Speeds, and Deception), so if we get 2 more then it'll be clear that the average S2 Raptor fan has a pretty solid perspective. Colangelo maybe has a skewed perspective who claims this is a 50 win team, but he might not even think that, and he does have an agenda to promote. He needs people to buy tickets, be excited and optimisitic.
who made that prediction? that was something colangelo threw out there and it was almost unanimously criticized by raptors fans and the media
5-6 might even be a stretch, most of the Raps fans on this site don't post here. Maybe once the season gets going.
Mike Tomlin is wearing some awesome sunglasses. If Triano wore those glasses to games, he'd have my respect.
The good: Bargnani played great, he really appreciated having a tired Cleveland team with Shaq or Big Z covering him. He had a great steal and dunk, but he messed it up, but overall he had the biggest performance and got the biggest cheers. Including the first dunk of the game, and a nice post move on Lebron. Obviously Bargnani won't be able to maintain this kind of performances against a fresh team and has a quicker PF put on him. DeRozan looked like he has good potential, and he should continue to get minutes. He had a nice looking put-back dunk, however it was on a play that had a foul called 1 second earlier. He definitely brings a bounce to the team. Belllini definitely had impressive stretches, amazing that we got him for nothing. (an old Devean George) A nice dunk too. Jarret Jack had solid contributions. The mediocre: Hedo was not impressive, and a non-factor, he was invisible the entire first quarter. Bosh was not shooting well, and was short shooting over Shaq for like his first 5 shots. He got a handful of star calls later on in the game, which he usually gets, and made his points tally look more respectable. Antoine Wright just generally looked bad. Other things: I forget, but someone had a sick crossover, and then got Rasho an absolutely wide open jump shot. (he made it) Barg's 4 foul in the third quarter was pretty much no contact, and sent him to the bench. Crowd started the first bullshit chant. Lebron got a ridiculous star call with like 2 minutes left, clearly a charge (over I think Bosh). Another bullshit chant. At one point the crowd actually kind of cheered/ooh-ahhed for Lebron after a fancy layup. (only time there was a cheer for Cleveland) Moon generally received more negative attention than Parker.
Jack had troubles hitting shots, but besides that, awesome job, his D was great. I thought Wright was okay, especially considering this is his first action, plus he did guard LeBron. Belinelli was awesome, especially on the Defensive end.
hedo not impressive? is this your first time watching basketball? if the nba counted hockey assists, im confident he would have had 15 assists. he improved the spacing, the offensive execution and didnt force anything. plus, he was the primary defender on bron and managed to contain lebron to 23 points; and i dont think any raptor has ever managed to that in raptor history. btw, he also had 3 blocked shots. antoine wright- he was really impressive, especially in light of his recent injury. the guy played 15 minutes or so but managed to have like 3 or 4 charges. defensively he was awesome. and in the fourth quarter he took lebron off the dribble and scored, then hit a three on a bad pass thrown by caledron. this was all done in limited action.
I still think his performance was not impressive, but don't want to get into it anyway, and usually you debate things to death anyway. Same with Antoine Wright.
i think if jlo ever met me, she would be overwhelmed by my charm but what i think is a lot different than whats real. u might want to reconsider your observations next time because u have no clue.
